Touchè

I know you see what I'm saying.
It's the tensioners job to take up any slack, but if it can't, it would be the same for pinned and non pinned cams. It's not like our non pinned ones are floating/self adjusting.
Stretching a chain just plain sucks for all involved.
I need to get the dcr and do mine.
I really don't want to though.

the ARP crank bolt is not ttyl, you can reuse and retorque the shit out of it, and wtf the ms3 has 2 separate sprockets, reg mzr has a one piece dual sprocket....yeah most definitely shitty engineering

But with the arp bolt you follow the same TTY procedure?

Yes you follow the same torque proceedures as stated in the factory manual, but do not be alarmed when you can not get the full 90 degrees beyond the inital ftlbs, the arp crank bolt is a stout mother fucker compare to the oem ttyl crank fastener, the most I was able to get was 40 degrees

Guess what....remember when I said cosworth stopped making keyed sprockets, well I guess they started making them again although they are charging twice as much as they used to, just bought one, I'll use it on my second engine I' am building.

The amount of force required for the ARP bolt to reach that 90 should only be done with a flywheel lock and the engine on the ground not a stand. otherwise do as tobasco did and do the 40 degrees. IT is a very stout bolt and can and will break the SST pin or an engine stand if you try and force it to the full 90degrees without the above mentioned procedure.


For those doing the keyway I just torque mine down to 155ft/lbs and call it a day. Had a nice talk with a ARP tech about this and with a keyed crankshaft there is no need for all that torque anymore. I haven't had a problem with it yet and have retorqued it atleast 6 times sense the initial use.


Disclaimer: anything done outside of the mazda OEM service manual with non standard factory equipment is done at your own risk.

Hahaha.
That goes for YOU big turbo DJ.

Lol, what?

Maybe i missed something.




I failed at measuring the I.D. of the sprocket. Ended up working late, and then had to run home to fab a dump tube for a 20g mr2. I won't have time to swing by my mom's house (where the sprockets are) tonight either, but i have a spare motor in my garage at my house.... so i'll pull the crank pulley and measure the crank shaft.

You missed the disclaimer right before my post apparently.
Doing things outside the manual(like big turbo) are done at own risk

Lol, i kinda thought that was it.

Im about to goto the storage unit to ship some parts, i have a pully and crank that I can measure. You guys just need the id and od?

Yup, I.D. of the crank sprockets. Might not hurt to get a tooth count too i guess... but i sincerely doubt that would be any different.

Just take a pic with your phone and the micrometers :)

You got it.

Here ya go

Any reason why I couldn't use a gen2 short block on a gen1? This thing with the key on the crank pulley is the only difference I've seen so far.

A new gen2 short block for $2160 is really not so bad. And it's $300 LESS than a gen1. shuuu. wtf.

MS3 DISI engine regardless of gen 1 or 2 are the exact same I' am like almost 100% sure of this, now the mzr engines- gen2 are what was changed radically, keyed forge crankshaft, rotating assembly is still cheap ass cast crap, the stroke was increased to go from 2.3 to 2.5 displacement, so different crank throw (longer) and longer rods.

I do not think you disi guys would have anything to gain from taking ms3 gen2 engine parts cause they are the same, the chasis platform represent the difference between gen 1 and 2 for your cars

Side note I think it is fucking horseshit that import mags do buyers guides and rate the ms3 head and shoulder above all else in the fwd catergory ie dsport in particular yet they turn their noses up at them, sick and fucking tired of reading about feature honda eg and dg's.

MSF takes way too long to show attached pics when i click em... i just measured the diameter on the block in my garage, with ghetto ass measuring tape... and it was right at one inch.

Is that what your dial shows marcus?


Hahaha, yeah, i thought that article was funny two. Huge spread on the ms3.

wish i read this thread before i blew up my valves but awesome disscussion

awesome knowledge to add to the bank

ID is 1.044"
OD is 1.046"

2 thou clearance?
Seems like a lot.

Its about what I expected, after torquing that bolt down I dont think it makes a difference.

Do you have a part # for the ARP replacement bolt for the speed3?

I would call ARP directly and ask them .....but I 'm pretty sure it would be the same as the mzr...meh still call to verify http://www.c-f-m.com/productimages/thumb/2512501.jpg part no.251-2501

http://static.summitracing.com/globa...234-2503_w.jpg http://www.summitracing.com/parts/AR...2501/?rtype=10

@pinkcheese

Can you confirm Marcus's measurements are either the same or different than the duratec?

Ok maybe we could make a New post about this idea ..
Some guys on here have had the timming slip or bolt come loose.
I would like to know what you guys did wrong .
As in ..
Was the tourque enought
Did u do the 1/4 turn
New bolt
new washers
I would like to know wear you went wrong .
Maybe a stickey for referance on not what to do .
Just a idea ..
I think It may be time for my VVT/ chain/ tentioner to be done and I an scared as hell !

It is quite interesting that I missed this thread, and this past weekend came to the conclusion while helping tune @oldognewtriks car. The conclusion (without seeing this thread) was that the crank pulley slipped and lost timing with the crank

We will know Saturday socks. I am buying a new bolt and possibly installing the stck crank pulley instead of the aftermarket one.

Most issues arise from re-using the stock crank bolt, and / or not replacing the friction washers that go between the crank sprockets.... as well as not torquing properly.

As long as you do it right, you shouldn't have issues imo.

thanks DJ..

Sorry been a little MIA lately

Duratec measurements off a spare 2.3L sprocket I have/

I.D. 1.047"
O.D. 1.484"

taken with a digital micrometer.

O.D's are off quite a bit.... how is that possible? Or was it supposed to be 1.048, pink?

There is no way thats right, the crank i measured off of had some surface rust on the snout so it nay be a couple thousandths off.

These are sprocket dimensions. I do not have a spare crank to measure.

Ohhh you measured the outside part of the sprocket not the crank. Mine was 1.455 but I dont think that is a critical measurement.

At this point... i guess it's safe to say the keyed products from cosworth would indeed work on the DISI MZR's.... eh?

If they have the same amount of teeth, pitch and pressure angle.

The Cosworth is a 19 teeth sprocket and a 38 teeth cam gear with a 8 MM chain.

I have to run to my mum's house in a bit, and that's where i have a tore down motor. I'll bring my calipers with me, and snap a few pics.

Looks like we have a 40 tooth cam gear:

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30093030.jpg


And 0.162" (4.12mm) cam gear width:

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30094057.jpg


0.19" (4.83mm) inner chain gap:

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30094240.jpg


0.451" (11.46mm) outter chain (including a pin, i was rushed and just grabbed some quick measurements):

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30094136.jpg




And for giggles, here's my crank sprocket I.D., 1.048" (26.63mm), and it's a 20 tooth sprocket (i think this could possibly be the oil chain sprocket, so i'll double check next time i'm over there... again i was rushed):

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30094018.jpg


And since the DISI crank sprockets are 2 piece, where the duratec are 1 piece, here's our spacing, 0.601" (15.26mm):

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30093927.jpg


Overall combined crank sprockets depth, 0.9315" (23.66mm), eye balled, but accurate enough IMO (also, no friction washers between sprockets for the hair splitters out there):

http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/o...1-30093728.jpg

http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/823/010lu.jpg
http://img607.imageshack.us/img607/9215/012pen.jpg
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/2923/013wfl.jpg
http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/1486/014dqa.jpg

the basic dimension are close but look at the teeth, looks to be a different profile, pitch and depth.
cos=cosworth part fyi
the disi cam chain teeth, assuming that I'am talking about the right ones seems to be of a lesser width, 4.83@ this one is cos: 4.93@
oil pump tooth width is cos: 2.74
overall sprocket depth is cos: .933mm versus .9315/but you didn't include the washer/spacer, so I would assume the 2 to be of the same depth

inside diameter cos: 1.043 disi: 1.048