DCR VVT Actuator Update

[06Speed6]

No problem man

[MattJackson86]

Still waiting to hear back from DCR on my order status. Not sure if they are waiting on me to send in a VVT or what. Just need to get the part asap so I can get it and chain/tensioner swapped.

[mazspeedshiz]

Originally Posted by MattJackson86 Still waiting to hear back from DCR on my order status. Not sure if they are waiting on me to send in a VVT or what. Just need to get the part asap so I can get it and chain/tensioner swapped.

Im kinda in the same boat. i need to order a new vvt and i want to try the dcr but i cant wait too long. i want my car back!! lol. how long did you have to wait? and did it seem worth it? i havent found any reviews on the unit.

[MattJackson86]

I heard back after my last post that it would ship out by last wednesday. Not heard back or received it yet. Need to follow up again.

[silvapain]

I've emailed both Jennifer and Darrell and have yet to receive a response. Tried calling them as well and nobody answered. Seems like DCR is still having customer service issues.


Tapadatass

[06Speed6]

Sent them an email, I need to pick one up and I have two extra cores if they need them.

[MattJackson86]

I have left numerous messages this last week just asking them to tell me when its going to ship out. No response and I have no idea if its shipped or what. They say their customer service is better, well its not. Its terrible. Just tell me when my product that I ordered and paid for already will ship out! You told me it would ship a week and a half ago, well its not here.

My car is booked in for VVT and timing chain fix on Friday. I don't want to have to put an OEM VVT but I need this fixed as I have been driving on loose chain for weeks.

[06Speed6]

Well that sucks, lets see if they respond to me at all.

[silvapain]

Goddamnit. I really don't want to have to buy the VVT actuator from PTP.


Tapadatass

[MattJackson86]

Originally Posted by silvapain Goddamnit. I really don't want to have to buy the VVT actuator from PTP. Tapadatass

Is the PTP one really better than OEM? Trying to decide what to do if DCR dont come through this week.

[Tokay444]

Yes. It's a reworked oem unit.

[Erich]

Originally Posted by MattJackson86 Is the PTP one really better than OEM? Trying to decide what to do if DCR dont come through this week.

Plenty of people running it with out a single issue, including me at over 700hp and over 600hp daily driven for extended periods of time. Instead of welding or threading, PTP has double pinned the puck. Why the reluctance to buy the VVT replacement from PTP? DCR's customer service was way worse here then PTP's ever was. How long did they have paying customers waiting on a manifold? If I remember correctly that situation was bordering on becoming like the Medieval situation. And meanwhile they take jabs at PTP while claiming to be the big power pioneers for this platform (all in their product descriptions). I have asked them for links to their high power builds. Hell, can anybody show me an MS DISI that DCR is largely responsible for that has put down 75% of what my car has?

[silvapain]

It's not a question of quality, customer service, or innovation Erich; it's a question of price. John's parts are simply overpriced across the board.


Tapadatass

[Erich]

Originally Posted by silvapain It's not a question of quality, customer service, or innovation Erich; it's a question of price. John's parts are simply overpriced across the board. Tapadatass

I hadn't checked what the price difference was, but if true that is a fair enough argument.

Edit: Just checked prices and John's is in fact $100 more. Likely because John uses new parts and I am assuming DCR works from the cores that are getting returned. Not saying anything about the merits of using new or used, just pointing out the likely reason for the price difference.

[jmhinkle]

.

[06Speed6]

Originally Posted by Erich Plenty of people running it with out a single issue, including me at over 700hp and over 600hp daily driven for extended periods of time. Instead of welding or threading, PTP has double pinned the puck. Why the reluctance to buy the VVT replacement from PTP? DCR's customer service was way worse here then PTP's ever was. How long did they have paying customers waiting on a manifold? If I remember correctly that situation was bordering on becoming like the Medieval situation. And meanwhile they take jabs at PTP while claiming to be the big power pioneers for this platform (all in their product descriptions). I have asked them for links to their high power builds. Hell, can anybody show me an MS DISI that DCR is largely responsible for that has put down 75% of what my car has?

I think phailrider was near 900hp...

It is a price thing, I have three VVTs laying here and they are perfectly good parts and John wont use them. To save 300% most of us will suffer the terrible customer service.

[silvapain]

Originally Posted by 06Speed6 I think phailrider was near 900hp... It is a price thing, I have three VVTs laying here and they are perfectly good parts and John wont use them. To save 300% most of us will suffer the terrible customer service.

That's it exactly. The VVT actuator off my car works fine with no signs of failing yet, so why not save $100 and get it modified instead of getting a whole new one?

[Erich]

Originally Posted by silvapain That's it exactly. The VVT actuator off my car works fine with no signs of failing yet, so why not save $100 and get it modified instead of getting a whole new one?

Perfectly reasonable position to take. Hope it works out for you.

[06Speed6]

If somone could post pics of the dcr VVT, i wonder if I could duplicate it...

[MattJackson86]

Originally Posted by 06Speed6 If somone could post pics of the dcr VVT, i wonder if I could duplicate it...

I just got an email saying its shipping out tomorrow. If/when I receive it I will get a bunch of photos for you.

[06Speed6]

Hells yeah

Glad they got back to you, I am still waiting on them to get back to me. I might just blow their phone up

[TWOptSL0W]

So I called yesterday because I'm going to need one of these too. Fwiw, I spoke to a nice gentleman who started there like last week because darrell wasn't there yet. He explained that there were only 3 people working there, one of them being himself, so that makes sense why it's taking so long for everything. I remember them wih the art community and even though there may be a big wait, I trust the quality of his parts.

[06Speed6]

Sounds like I definitely need to call

[jmhinkle]

FWIW, Jennifer has been quick to respond to emails. I'm just waiting to get our VVT's together to go out to them.

[djuosnteisn]

Pulling them tonight with the cams.

[MattJackson86]

I actually ended up getting a response via a facebook message i sent them. It does seem they are under staffed, but i have heard nothing but great things about their quality.

I got a voicemail today saying it has shipped out. They even overnighted it for me at no extra charge as I told them I needed it asap.

[TWOptSL0W]

Called again and "Darrell very seldom speaks to people on the phone" so I'll had to email him

[RaisedOnPunk]

I have searched and searched for the answer to no avail, so now I ask : Are the 2nd gen MS3s that were built after the recall date of 2/27/2010 going to possibly experience this same vvt issue? Did Mazda fix this in production?

[06Speed6]

Originally Posted by RaisedOnPunk I have searched and searched for the answer to no avail, so now I ask : Are the 2nd gen MS3s that were built after the recall date of 2/27/2010 going to possibly experience this same vvt issue? Did Mazda fix this in production?

Good question, Mazda did add a heat treatment process to the pin but everything else is the same. The heat treatment makes it strong enough to not break in most cars during the warranty period. If you upgrade anything you are still screwed.

[MattJackson86]

Got my dcr vvt just in time. Took some pictures and will send them your way.

[jmhinkle]

Did someone have an extra core? Dustin and I got our cores together last night and one is blown. The side wall where the plug was is blown out and the the thing was all out of place. We disassembled it to see what it looks like inside at least. We need an extra core now though if someone has a spare.

[djuosnteisn]

Actually, i'm out of money right now... so i don't need a core. I'll cross this bridge later on if i have issues.

It's all you Joel


I'll post up the pics we took of the actuator in a sec.

[jmhinkle]

We'll have the core off my engine once I get my build done.

[djuosnteisn]

Some pics of the broken vvt actuator (wanted to take one apart for a while now)








And a lil vid of us rotating the center section:

VVT - YouTube


Surprisingly simple i guess, just 4 oil chambers, 2 pushing to advance, and 2 pushing to retard, and the oil control valve simply adjusts the flow. My question is the purpose of the pin... i should have taken a pic of how this unit was broken... but what exactly does the pin do? Just lock the actuator when there's no oil pressure? Is it spring loaded, and disengaged when oil pressure is present?

And if it's only used when oil pressure isn't present, then it's really only used on start up... and in that situation, it really doesn't matter how much power your actually making. So am i right in thinking these VVT failures have no correlation with power? I mean shit, my ms6 VVT is still stock, and it's making pretty decent power. I can see how stiffer valve springs would have a direct effect on failure, but not necessarily "power".

If anyone cares to share, i'm all ears

[Tokay444]

The purpose if the pin is to keep the cam phase at ideal idle/start up avdvance for when there is no oil pressure at the OCV spool.

So really, a broken vvt worst case scenario, is that button gets sucked up by the oil pump.
There is no hampering on power.

Bad vvts have nothing to do with stretched chains as the common misconception leads people to believe.

[djuosnteisn]

Yup, metal bits would probably be my biggest concern.

Also, at idle, the ecu triggers the spark based off the cam pos sensor, and measures it with the crank pos sensor. It's a quick way to make sure that everything is still in mechanical time (you should hover right around 10* spark advance at idle, usually from 9 - 11).

[Tokay444]

Yes, but, for the first couple cranks, when there's no oil pressure, that's where the pin comes in, but do we know how long the ecu can see the crank and cam being out of phase at idle before it throws a code? I'm sure it's more than the 20-30 revolutions it takes to get oil to the OCV.

[djuosnteisn]

Originally Posted by Tokay444 Yes, but, for the first couple cranks, when there's no oil pressure, that's where the pin comes in, but do we know how long the ecu can see the crank and cam being out of phase at idle before it throws a code? I'm sure it's more than the 20-30 revolutions it takes to get oil to the OCV.

I'm sure the ecu doesn't even look at it just after start up or before everything is up to temp.

[Tokay444]

All we're looking at is full retard at first crank, and the potential for metal shavings.

Lol. Shavings.

[RaisedOnPunk]

Upgrading my valve springs sometime early July. My PTP VVT is on the way. Unit claims to be rated for 600 whp+. Now the question is, with dual coil vale springs and a PTP VVT, what is a safe redline for my motor? Block will be built, but cams will be stock. Input much appreciated.