Question: I bought Devil's Own meth-injection kit and the large tank with the pump in it. I haven't hooked it up yet as it looks a bit difficult (for me, lol) and I've been kind of lazy. Anyhow, if I hooked this meth kit up, and say I did have really bad carbon'd up dirty intake valves, would this actually REVERSE the process and clean the intake valves back to near factory clean? Or is this just something that basically stops them from getting any dirtier? Also, as far as cleaning goes, would it be better to run 100% meth or a mix or meth and water?

I've seen pics of intake valves of other direct injected cars, like the Audi 2.0 FSI at 15k miles and if our car is anything as bad as it, I fear what mine look like now at 27k miles because those were horrendous! I have a feeling this is where my power loss is at, but I don't know... I'm just guessing as I've pretty much given up on figuring out where my power has gone now.

Oh boy.

Here, have a look at these pictures. I'm going to assume you still have the stock top-mounted intercooler. You can't really see the IM because the intercooler & its plastic shroud sit on top of it:

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_9z7URVqFhnc/TQ...s800/mani1.jpg


Here, the intercooler has been removed, and you can see the actual IM itself. Note four runners, one for each cylinder.

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_9z7URVqFhnc/TQ...s800/mani2.jpg

You've actually worked on it before, when you installed your OCC kit. You also shoot seafoam through it everytime you perform a seafoaming.

Cool thanks. How does one look into them to see if there are oil tracks there? Is it a difficult job? I can get down to that level pretty easy as I take the TMIC and SRI and TIP off a lot and the battery box out all the time.

shpankey, if your compression is good, and if you maintain the car as well as you say, then i am not really sure that the intake valves are your problem.

i follow a similar route, maybe less rigorous, and i don't have power loss. i've pulled my plugs a few times and they look OK, about the same every time. i do seafoam thru the intake system once every other oil change or so.

my questions would be related to fuel and air -
- is your fuel pump working properly?
- do you have any boost leaks?
- is your MAF calibrated for the intake you have (if any)?

if you've been driving modified w/ a stock pump for a long time, your pump might be hosed, and that could cause a power loss. a boost leak would sap power as well, although you'd prolly hear it.

get a log of your car and post it up. we can go from there.

I've been running the KMD Ver 2 pump for almost a year now. I don't have a logging tool, just a code reader that can do live readings. According to it, at WOT I'm 1750+ to 2000 psi with the average being between 1790 to 1850. It never goes below 1700 at any time at WOT and idle is close to 500 psi. So I've kind of ruled the fp out. Though I will admit the power loss did come around the time I installed it and a few other mods (step colder denso's, TIP, OCC). I've since taken everything off the car except the HPFP as my stock clip is broke and since I see such good pressure I think it's probably ok.

have you checked your boost pressure?

No. I don't really know how to do that tho.

you've really gotta check your AFR and boost pressure.

I'm going to take it to a local shop to take the intake off and clean the intake valves next month some time. If that doesn't fix it I'll go from there. The way I figure it, I'm at almost 30k miles and they need cleaning no matter what, judging by pics I've seen of intake valves of many other direct injected cars. So it's something worth doing either way. I'm pretty sure this is the main reason for the power loss, and for a fact, at least SOME of it. So regardless of where the real problem may lie, this needs done anyhow.

I was between 200-205 on all 4. Though it wouldn't be a bad idea to check after running my 2100 PSI test.

From left to right:
Cold: 180, 170, 170, 175
Hot- drove it like i stole it till ECT 190c- 175,170,165,165

25000 miles, MSCAI, CS midpipe, PP 5/40 for most of the cars life. Oh yeah and a recently drained of all oil run home from the store.

Piston tops looked a bit crusty, nothing a few ccs of Seafoam sitting on them for 15 mins didnt help. Recently Seafoamed thru the intake tracts that produced miles of thick grey smoke.
Next step leakdown test..............

proof

Attachment 20622

Attachment 20623

2007 Mazdaspeed 3 GT
73,xxx Miles
1- 172
2- 170
3- 169
4- 165

Very happy with the results had the car for a year and loving every day

redid mine again tonight for the hell of it

26k on the ODO
Drivers side
190
190
185
190
Passengers side

Mods:

SRI/TIP/FMIC/HPFP/TP/CBE/DJ Tune

first test was only with SRI/TIP/Akuma Tune

guess its wearing in better.....or DJ has some black magic in his tunes

Lol

Great #'s for sure though.

Arrr, I bought an Ebay 10mm lighted USB inspection camera just so I could take a look down the plug holes myself. That's how dedicated to DISI I am....

i did that


it wasnt pretty

Yep...looks a little like this, as viewed through the spark plug hole...

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/_9...800/piston.jpg

Compression will differ slightly based on oil used, atmospheric pressure etc ... test on a warm sunny day (high pressure) for best results.

I've had to clean my piston tops twice (long story lol). Best thing you can do to stop crud from forming on your pistons/valves is to run an OCC and block off the EGR valve. Those with a newer valve cover with the different baffle might have less oil picked up on the breather tube. Just the nature of a direct injection engine.

On a side note, once you see/think you have lower compression, a leak down test is your best friend. I have yet to do one but wish I had earlier before I took the engine apart lol. In my case, looks like it is going to be the injector seals that are toast (see Change those seals yo).

Okay, here's my turn.
Did the test yesterday when changing the spark plugs. Ambient was about 77. Elevation approx 511 ASL. The car runs fine, the vacuum at idle is 21ish. 35k miles on the clock.

183
176
176
183

Confused about the difference between two central cylinders and the other two..

Normal to see accelerated wear on the inner cylinders of any in line engine. Typically, they run hotter than the outer 2. I'd be concerned if the 3s were way down on 2 adjacent cylinders, indicating a hg leak.

Went ahead and tested my car again today. 2009 Speed3, 42,600miles, more than half of that was stage 1, car is stage 2 now. Was roughly 80degrees out when I tested, 570~ ASL.

1: 185
2: 185
3: 185
4: 185

Only did 6 cranks to get these readings, 7 on cylinder 1.

I had my inj seals replaced with the safeseals and asked for a before and after compression check.
I asked them to do the check on a warm engine but they did the b/f with a cold one anyway...

b/f replacement of seals (cold engine) in psi
1: 160
2: 130
3: 130
4: 160

after replacement of seals (warm engine) in psi
1: 160
2: 130
3: 115
4: 160

Compression results are pretty bad I guess. Cylinder 3 is obiously out of spec, what a surprise.

I'm at 103k miles most of which have been with an upgraded TMIC, BPF and catback. Never used anything else then premium 98ron fuel. Dealer overfilled the oil a couple of times but as I check the level regularly I noticed and had them drain it the next day. I had some crazy knock counts when my timing chain tensioner gave up but other than that all has been fine.
Last couple of months I started noticing 2 - 4° KR past 4k rpm when getting on the gas especially after a 4 - 5 gear change. Based on the info on the forum I suspected that the seals had gone bad. Well the good news is WOT KR is back to less than one degree which is were it has always been so my seals were probably somewhat toasted and the safeseals are taking better care of the injectors now.
When I got the car I thought getting 125 - 150k miles out of this car would be no problem but now I don't know if it's going to hold that long.

just hit 50k and i have 180 in all cylinders i guess im good for another few miles until my shit explodes

If the before and after tests were done with basically 0 miles in between I would suspect something is up with the tester/method in both tests.

I would get this redone and get a leakdown test done as well to see what is leaking compression.

Are you burning any oil?

I didn't attend the testing, it was all done by a local ford /mazda dealer. They're good people but kinda old school.

I would expect the test to be better after replacement of the seals not b/c of the seals but b/c the engine was hot compared to the 'cold' before test (so I guess they took it for a drive after replacing the seals). The 115 psi kinda freaked me out but the car does run 'normal'. Only anomaly is the WOT knock in higher gears which got slightly better after the seal replacement.

I have to add oil regulary but no more than one to two liter between dealer visits (every 10k). I think most of the oil consumption is related to crankcase ventilation. I have an oil trail from the valvecover vent to the intake and TIP and the flange on the cold side of the IC is an oily mess. I had the dealer clean the entire intake side b/c it needed to be disassembled for the seal swap. They told me it was very oily and the valves were basically carbon turds. They didn't dare to clean the valves though. So I went back two days ago and had them run a "sea foam" kind of product which helped recover some smoothness of the engine. I asked for another compression test but they didn't have the time.

It would probably be best to try and get a second opinion on that compression test or man up and try it myself.

On the motor i'm currently building, the machinist mentioned that he wanted to clean up the valves and valve seats... because they were pretty pitted.


Kinda makes sense to me, judging from how much carbon build up they see with DI. Yet i don't recall anyone having bad leakage past the valves, etc.

MPS, i wonder if your test would be any different if you sea foamed the car.

Well the dealer ran some sort of a seafoam product through the car a couple of days after I had the seals changed but they didn't have time to do another compression test. I'm going to look into doing a compression test myself when I come back from holidays to see what I come up with.

I will never get an compression test. Ignorance is bliss. Plus I've recorded my favorite saying so when passengers ask me, "what's that noise?" I put the recording on loop "its suppose to sound like that"

I have noticed on more "tired" engines that there is a lot of oil in the valvecover to intake line and down the intake. Oil there is a sign of blowby - in other words there is quite a bit of gas getting past the rings which lines up with the lower compression.

Any serious shop would do a leakdown test at this point.

So, I ran a test yesterday. 67k miles, 104 degrees outside, let idle up to 180 degrees coolant temp. Then did the test.

86,89,85,89.

Im not sure why they're are so low, as to if it was a bad gauge, poor tester (me), or what. I just changed the oil the day before the so the oil was brand new.

My car runs fine, but that shit is low, at least its consistent.

i don't see how that can be accurate - maybe your gauge had a funky scale and those were really 186,189, etc
if those were really your numbers your car would run like shit - most likely w/ coolant temp thru the roof or bellowing smoke out the exhaust

The gauge was the oem brand rental from autozone. Looked normal to uss. Think it went up to like two hundred on psi side. Never saw anything above 89 when doing it. No smoke and car still beasts on peopleople so i have a feeling it had to be the gauge

180-185-165-185

Go BT.

Who me? Lol.

Errrrrrrrrrrrrr fkn body!

07 ms3 sport
52K
engine kinda warm,:bong: cooled off in garage for 30-45 minutes before test

175
174
175
176

08.5 MS3
47k km
1 (driver side): 195
2: 190
3: 195
4: 195

Cranked about 16 times until needle stopped climbing. Engine was warm to the touch but not hot.

I just did mine at 88,000KM and there is less than a 5 PSI difference between cylinders. I did it coldish, so my numbers were a bit lower but I was more concerned about the variance.

just did mine again at ~60k miles and i had 170's across the board.

20k of which were BT

damn...do I have to re-do mine again?

Just did mine today (warm).

2008 MS3
108,000 mi (stock for first 60k, then stage 2)

(Passenger)
180
185
187
187

750 ASL - 75*, sunny.

Really surprised.

Did a compression test on a fellow Gen 1 Speed owner in Toronto.

170
185
185
185

The car has 56,000KMs on it with the majority of it being highway. Odd that cylinder 1 is showing signs of wear so quickly.

Just did a compression test last week, all cylinders are sitting at about 175! lol

Just did a compression test last week, all cylinders are sitting at about 190! lol (This '07 MS3 has 30k miles on it.)

SERIOUS QUESTION,

I have an 07 MS3 74k miles on it, cars in mint cond, but was giving some very serious consideration on trading it in or seeling it for anther 1 with lower miles, since ur well over 100k have u noticed anything start 2 fall apart &/or what al have u replaced that has worn out since new?????

Arent u getting rid of your car lol

You give me hope good sir!
Mine was stock till 60k and then I went to town. Now big turbo at 71k and car is loving every bit of it. Glad your numbers are good =]

@thomas_cory2000 - I know this isn't the thread for this...I was also considering dumping mine because of miles. It's my DD so I haven't really beat the hell out of it, but it's fun to surprise the dick driving the S4 every now and then. (I keep it as stock looking as possible). I just bought a used 3076 turbo and am putting it on in the next few weeks. I'm seeing mostly salt corrosion on bolts and stuff. This doesn't include mods or related repairs.

44k - tensioner pulley
45k - rear shocks
60k - Mazda replaced the wiring harness (driver air bag light came on for the 4th time)
80k - brakes
93k - replaced driver CV boot 2x in a week, caused me to replace FSB endlinks (shitty mechanic the first time, I did it myself the 2nd)
109k - timing chain's really loose and I'm waiting for the parts to come in (DCR VVT actuator, timing chain, tensioner, etc).

Not too bad though.

Thanks man - I figured I should do it after some trolling. I'm definitely not the most experienced here, so I research a lot before posting. I've gotta ditch my K04 before I hit 110k...too bad my wife doesn't know enough to give me shit over it.

^ youll love driving with big turbo. no more boosting around town uncontrollably. Car feels way more solid.

Ive replaced my brakes and pads all the way around and the tires, I alo have to go to the dealer friday to get (DCR VVT actuator, timing chain, tensioner, etc). <--- replaced as well $850-900 :damnit:

That's why I'm doing it myself. Just need the timing tools. Total upgraded parts will be $450 and a day or 2 labor. And I'll get to know my car a little better. If I fail, then I'll take it to Mazda.

Now that I know why my engine went sour, here's the info.

190
185
150-160 (due to a cracked ringland)
180

Car has around 85,000KMs and has been raced in autocross and time attack over the last 3 years.

Damn that sucks. Time for a build? Or get a 2012 Focus ST. Lol


Tappin

Time To Go Forged :headbang:

150,150,150,151. 07 ms3 72k miles. 3076r for 1k miles. 4000ft elevation. At least its consistent

2009 MS3
40K miles - spraying meth for about 20K
Ambient Temp about 68 deg.
Sealevel

185
185
185
190

Hey Lex,
What do you say about the marks on the piston crowns. Are those from the Injectors spraying? I am assuming this is normal for DI engines. Looks a little as if there was brass on the crowns. The blots are sort of golden looking. Spark Plugs look perfect.

Boroscope pics:
http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/...t/IV7L0002.jpg

http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/...t/IV7L0004.jpg

http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/...t/IV7L0005.jpg

http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/...t/IV7L0006.jpg

Just ran a compression test this weekend as I was changing out my sparkplugs for Denso ITV-22's.

181
181
179
180

Looks all good to me!

updated numbers at 50K. Car was very warm to hot for this test so I guess that's why I got some 180's

1=180
2=175
3=180
4=178

Car bought stock @ 23,400 miles, All basic bolt on except downpipe till 36k miles.

30k-36k miles tuned @ 20 psi

Passenger side to driver side ->
1.) 184
2.) 182
3.) 182
4.) 182

test done twice.. same result.

Nice!

I'm so late to this party but the spray pattern from teh injector just cleans the carbon from the crowns so you're seeing that triangular shape - in the first pic especially. Any shiny stuff is generally not so hot - it can be pitting from detonation or just an unclear image. The crowns are very clean however.

Looks like most everyone has been having some really nice readings. Unfortuneately, that trend does not apply to me.

Test 1 @ 30,000 miles:

Cylinder 1 - 160
Cylinder 2 - 167
Cylinder 3 - 187
Cylinder 4 - 200

Test 2 @ 33,000 miles

Cylinder 1 - 159 w/ 21% leakage
Cylinder 2 - 162 w/ 28% leakage
Cylinder 3 - 175 w/ 13% leakage
Cylinder 4 - 191 w/ 3% leakage

Air is coming through dipstick.

Been trying to figure out which direction I'd like to go with a rebuild.

Look into mazda's new high pressure valve flush.

Is this some cleaning technique?

Yeah, I've never heard of this.

However, I cleaned my intake valves last weekend (for the second time)

It is.
It's crazy how well it works.
I've seen it cure a 20% leak down and restore factory compression accross the board.

It's proprietary for the disi I believe.

If he's leaking through into the crankcase - ie it's leaking past the rings, flushing the valves won't help with anything.

@Evan@COBB
Evan, what are your vacuum readings at warm idle with A/C turned off?

I know what you're saying, but it cleans the combustion chambers as well and removes deposits from the ring lands which can cause blow by.

Aight ... does any dealer do this? Just phone in and book it?

The system is knew, so not ALL dealers have it, and the tech go away for special training on it.
It's about $300 and was developed just for the problem us disi guys have with buildup on the valves.

The chemicals are extremely harsh and an oil change is done immediately post service.
They'll scope the valves prior and post for an extra fee.

You've got some concrete evidence of this? Know someone who's done it first hand? Certainly beats removing the intake manifold and scrubbing.

Yes. He's on the forum. Kris"cwp" something or other.

He was/having extreme fuel dilution issues (+10% after 1500kms) that Mazda is turning a blind eye to.
He had bad leak down over 20%. Brought it back to less than 2%, and resorted his compression to perfect spec.
He is still having fuel dilution issues however. Brand new genpu.

Interesting.
Lex, I'll inquire with some of our local dealers here.

@Lex

Vacuum shows -10 on the AP.

Could also be a leaky PCV i suppose...



The valve cleaning service sounds awesome.

I'm guessing with the new SkyActiv engines being introduced to the broader scale of vehicles and not just limited to the Mazdaspeeds, dealing with the pitfalls of direct injection is going to be a concern for Mazda.

Haven't performed a compression/leakage test since I've installed a new PCV and installed the OCC.

At the same time as I did those installs, I installed a reworked K04 from Forced Performance.

I then had a smoking turbo which I cured with a bnoon bolt.

Now, it seems, that if I get into high boost, as soon as I let off, I get a cloud of white smoke that puffs out.

It's never ending..

Oh yeah, I'm still getting oil coming through the valve cover vent and into the SF intake.

FML.

Hahahahaha. And you have check valves with the OCC? Seems unlikely the that's the cause of low compression then.

I had a cracked ringland in cylinder 3 and had oil going through my intake tract like yours (starting at the VC vent and permeating to the IM).

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6184/...9d31d67e_z.jpg
http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6079/...0c603493_z.jpg

Yeah, but I think oil gets in the intake from the vc regardless of broken rings.

You've got that in inches of mercury instead of psi? There is more resolution in that reading.

Note that a drop in compression can readily be seen in the steady state vacuum reading of the car.

Does not - it gets in there if blowby exceeds a certain amount (ie there is a certain amount of leakage into crankcase of combustion gases under load) as the crankcase pressure pushes the oil through the intake tract from the valvetrain.

I need that valve flush. Bad.

Agreed. The car was tracked extensively before and I never had this issue until the cracked ringland.

I hais oil in my intake. :(

I haz forged motor looking for a hew home :smlove2:

Do you haz compression and leakdown test?

No leak down yet.
Compression in #3 is 165psi.
Bluestreak, how much.
I was gonna ask in private. Pm me if you'd like.

I never posted my results from a couple months ago.

80,000 miles (10,000 on big turbo)
1. 184
2. 186
3. 188
4. 190

The car was still warm when the test was performed.

@SPEED6 KILLAH would have info on the Mazda valve flush.

Pablo... any info on restoring compression with a proprietary DI valve flush?

146,000 miles and approx. 170 psi on all cylinders.

20k miles on rebuilt motor with stock compression
1. 185
2. 188
3. 180
4. 190

On 26 May 2010, I did the test. I got:

Just did it again today. 55k miles, still stock block.

Passenger side
175
175
175
180
Driver's side

Uh oh :worried:

Atmospheric pressure as well as the tester used and heat of engine will affect readings. Make sure you are very consistent - those numbers are very even which is good.

that motor does need a good home...I would buy it but waaaay tooooo far away from me...lol

It's more than I can bite off right now, but worth every penny I'm sure.

oh I am sure he would give a fellow Canadian a brother in law deal :)

I actually have no idea what a built motor would cost and frankly I am sure it would scare the shit out of me....lol

*knocks on wood and lowers boost targets on current map*

06speed6 I believe it was or maybe it was quartermilebeast quoted me around $2600.
This was substantially more than that. But there are two many variables to even try to compare the two.

^^ was this a complete motor with aftermarket rods/pistons? or stock?