DISI Compression Results

[shpankey]

Question: I bought Devil's Own meth-injection kit and the large tank with the pump in it. I haven't hooked it up yet as it looks a bit difficult (for me, lol) and I've been kind of lazy. Anyhow, if I hooked this meth kit up, and say I did have really bad carbon'd up dirty intake valves, would this actually REVERSE the process and clean the intake valves back to near factory clean? Or is this just something that basically stops them from getting any dirtier? Also, as far as cleaning goes, would it be better to run 100% meth or a mix or meth and water?

I've seen pics of intake valves of other direct injected cars, like the Audi 2.0 FSI at 15k miles and if our car is anything as bad as it, I fear what mine look like now at 27k miles because those were horrendous! I have a feeling this is where my power loss is at, but I don't know... I'm just guessing as I've pretty much given up on figuring out where my power has gone now.

[Cataphract_40]

Originally Posted by shpankey I know this sounds really dumb, but I'm not sure where the intake manifold is.

Oh boy.

Here, have a look at these pictures. I'm going to assume you still have the stock top-mounted intercooler. You can't really see the IM because the intercooler & its plastic shroud sit on top of it:




Here, the intercooler has been removed, and you can see the actual IM itself. Note four runners, one for each cylinder.



You've actually worked on it before, when you installed your OCC kit. You also shoot seafoam through it everytime you perform a seafoaming.

[shpankey]

Cool thanks. How does one look into them to see if there are oil tracks there? Is it a difficult job? I can get down to that level pretty easy as I take the TMIC and SRI and TIP off a lot and the battery box out all the time.

[08_ms3_gt]

shpankey, if your compression is good, and if you maintain the car as well as you say, then i am not really sure that the intake valves are your problem.

i follow a similar route, maybe less rigorous, and i don't have power loss. i've pulled my plugs a few times and they look OK, about the same every time. i do seafoam thru the intake system once every other oil change or so.

my questions would be related to fuel and air -
- is your fuel pump working properly?
- do you have any boost leaks?
- is your MAF calibrated for the intake you have (if any)?

if you've been driving modified w/ a stock pump for a long time, your pump might be hosed, and that could cause a power loss. a boost leak would sap power as well, although you'd prolly hear it.

get a log of your car and post it up. we can go from there.

[shpankey]

I've been running the KMD Ver 2 pump for almost a year now. I don't have a logging tool, just a code reader that can do live readings. According to it, at WOT I'm 1750+ to 2000 psi with the average being between 1790 to 1850. It never goes below 1700 at any time at WOT and idle is close to 500 psi. So I've kind of ruled the fp out. Though I will admit the power loss did come around the time I installed it and a few other mods (step colder denso's, TIP, OCC). I've since taken everything off the car except the HPFP as my stock clip is broke and since I see such good pressure I think it's probably ok.

[08_ms3_gt]

have you checked your boost pressure?

[shpankey]

No. I don't really know how to do that tho.

[08_ms3_gt]

you've really gotta check your AFR and boost pressure.

[shpankey]

I'm going to take it to a local shop to take the intake off and clean the intake valves next month some time. If that doesn't fix it I'll go from there. The way I figure it, I'm at almost 30k miles and they need cleaning no matter what, judging by pics I've seen of intake valves of many other direct injected cars. So it's something worth doing either way. I'm pretty sure this is the main reason for the power loss, and for a fact, at least SOME of it. So regardless of where the real problem may lie, this needs done anyhow.

[Erich]

I was between 200-205 on all 4. Though it wouldn't be a bad idea to check after running my 2100 PSI test.

[javanc]

From left to right:
Cold: 180, 170, 170, 175
Hot- drove it like i stole it till ECT 190c- 175,170,165,165

25000 miles, MSCAI, CS midpipe, PP 5/40 for most of the cars life. Oh yeah and a recently drained of all oil run home from the store.

Piston tops looked a bit crusty, nothing a few ccs of Seafoam sitting on them for 15 mins didnt help. Recently Seafoamed thru the intake tracts that produced miles of thick grey smoke.
Next step leakdown test..............

[javanc]

proof

2010-12-22_10-47-49_315.jpg

2010-12-22_10-47-37_907.jpg

[stokes620]

2007 Mazdaspeed 3 GT
73,xxx Miles
1- 172
2- 170
3- 169
4- 165

Very happy with the results had the car for a year and loving every day

[8.5MS3]

Originally Posted by 8.5MS3 did mine yesterday 2008.5 MS3 16k on the ODO Drivers side 185 185 183 185 Passengers side

redid mine again tonight for the hell of it

26k on the ODO
Drivers side
190
190
185
190
Passengers side

Mods:

SRI/TIP/FMIC/HPFP/TP/CBE/DJ Tune

first test was only with SRI/TIP/Akuma Tune

guess its wearing in better.....or DJ has some black magic in his tunes

[djuosnteisn]

Lol

Great #'s for sure though.

[darth vader]

Arrr, I bought an Ebay 10mm lighted USB inspection camera just so I could take a look down the plug holes myself. That's how dedicated to DISI I am....

[8.5MS3]

i did that


it wasnt pretty

[Cataphract_40]

Yep...looks a little like this, as viewed through the spark plug hole...

[Lex]

Compression will differ slightly based on oil used, atmospheric pressure etc ... test on a warm sunny day (high pressure) for best results.

[MaverickX3]

I've had to clean my piston tops twice (long story lol). Best thing you can do to stop crud from forming on your pistons/valves is to run an OCC and block off the EGR valve. Those with a newer valve cover with the different baffle might have less oil picked up on the breather tube. Just the nature of a direct injection engine.

On a side note, once you see/think you have lower compression, a leak down test is your best friend. I have yet to do one but wish I had earlier before I took the engine apart lol. In my case, looks like it is going to be the injector seals that are toast (see Change those seals yo).

[paveltol]

Okay, here's my turn.
Did the test yesterday when changing the spark plugs. Ambient was about 77. Elevation approx 511 ASL. The car runs fine, the vacuum at idle is 21ish. 35k miles on the clock.

183
176
176
183

Confused about the difference between two central cylinders and the other two..

[darth vader]

Normal to see accelerated wear on the inner cylinders of any in line engine. Typically, they run hotter than the outer 2. I'd be concerned if the 3s were way down on 2 adjacent cylinders, indicating a hg leak.

[Metal409]

Went ahead and tested my car again today. 2009 Speed3, 42,600miles, more than half of that was stage 1, car is stage 2 now. Was roughly 80degrees out when I tested, 570~ ASL.

1: 185
2: 185
3: 185
4: 185

Only did 6 cranks to get these readings, 7 on cylinder 1.

[MPSdriver]

I had my inj seals replaced with the safeseals and asked for a before and after compression check.
I asked them to do the check on a warm engine but they did the b/f with a cold one anyway...

b/f replacement of seals (cold engine) in psi
1: 160
2: 130
3: 130
4: 160

after replacement of seals (warm engine) in psi
1: 160
2: 130
3: 115
4: 160

Compression results are pretty bad I guess. Cylinder 3 is obiously out of spec, what a surprise.

I'm at 103k miles most of which have been with an upgraded TMIC, BPF and catback. Never used anything else then premium 98ron fuel. Dealer overfilled the oil a couple of times but as I check the level regularly I noticed and had them drain it the next day. I had some crazy knock counts when my timing chain tensioner gave up but other than that all has been fine.
Last couple of months I started noticing 2 - 4° KR past 4k rpm when getting on the gas especially after a 4 - 5 gear change. Based on the info on the forum I suspected that the seals had gone bad. Well the good news is WOT KR is back to less than one degree which is were it has always been so my seals were probably somewhat toasted and the safeseals are taking better care of the injectors now.
When I got the car I thought getting 125 - 150k miles out of this car would be no problem but now I don't know if it's going to hold that long.

[TWOptSL0W]

just hit 50k and i have 180 in all cylinders i guess im good for another few miles until my shit explodes

[Lex]

Originally Posted by MPSdriver I had my inj seals replaced with the safeseals and asked for a before and after compression check. I asked them to do the check on a warm engine but they did the b/f with a cold one anyway... b/f replacement of seals (cold engine) in psi 1: 160 2: 130 3: 130 4: 160 after replacement of seals (warm engine) in psi 1: 160 2: 130 3: 115 4: 160 Compression results are pretty bad I guess. Cylinder 3 is obiously out of spec, what a surprise. I'm at 103k miles most of which have been with an upgraded TMIC, BPF and catback. Never used anything else then premium 98ron fuel. Dealer overfilled the oil a couple of times but as I check the level regularly I noticed and had them drain it the next day. I had some crazy knock counts when my timing chain tensioner gave up but other than that all has been fine. Last couple of months I started noticing 2 - 4° KR past 4k rpm when getting on the gas especially after a 4 - 5 gear change. Based on the info on the forum I suspected that the seals had gone bad. Well the good news is WOT KR is back to less than one degree which is were it has always been so my seals were probably somewhat toasted and the safeseals are taking better care of the injectors now. When I got the car I thought getting 125 - 150k miles out of this car would be no problem but now I don't know if it's going to hold that long.

If the before and after tests were done with basically 0 miles in between I would suspect something is up with the tester/method in both tests.

I would get this redone and get a leakdown test done as well to see what is leaking compression.

Are you burning any oil?

[MPSdriver]

I didn't attend the testing, it was all done by a local ford /mazda dealer. They're good people but kinda old school.

I would expect the test to be better after replacement of the seals not b/c of the seals but b/c the engine was hot compared to the 'cold' before test (so I guess they took it for a drive after replacing the seals). The 115 psi kinda freaked me out but the car does run 'normal'. Only anomaly is the WOT knock in higher gears which got slightly better after the seal replacement.

I have to add oil regulary but no more than one to two liter between dealer visits (every 10k). I think most of the oil consumption is related to crankcase ventilation. I have an oil trail from the valvecover vent to the intake and TIP and the flange on the cold side of the IC is an oily mess. I had the dealer clean the entire intake side b/c it needed to be disassembled for the seal swap. They told me it was very oily and the valves were basically carbon turds. They didn't dare to clean the valves though. So I went back two days ago and had them run a "sea foam" kind of product which helped recover some smoothness of the engine. I asked for another compression test but they didn't have the time.

It would probably be best to try and get a second opinion on that compression test or man up and try it myself.

[djuosnteisn]

On the motor i'm currently building, the machinist mentioned that he wanted to clean up the valves and valve seats... because they were pretty pitted.


Kinda makes sense to me, judging from how much carbon build up they see with DI. Yet i don't recall anyone having bad leakage past the valves, etc.

MPS, i wonder if your test would be any different if you sea foamed the car.

[MPSdriver]

Well the dealer ran some sort of a seafoam product through the car a couple of days after I had the seals changed but they didn't have time to do another compression test. I'm going to look into doing a compression test myself when I come back from holidays to see what I come up with.

[dooderek]

I will never get an compression test. Ignorance is bliss. Plus I've recorded my favorite saying so when passengers ask me, "what's that noise?" I put the recording on loop "its suppose to sound like that"

[Lex]

I have noticed on more "tired" engines that there is a lot of oil in the valvecover to intake line and down the intake. Oil there is a sign of blowby - in other words there is quite a bit of gas getting past the rings which lines up with the lower compression.

Any serious shop would do a leakdown test at this point.

[frivolous_rob]

So, I ran a test yesterday. 67k miles, 104 degrees outside, let idle up to 180 degrees coolant temp. Then did the test.

86,89,85,89.

Im not sure why they're are so low, as to if it was a bad gauge, poor tester (me), or what. I just changed the oil the day before the so the oil was brand new.

My car runs fine, but that shit is low, at least its consistent.

[cpolly69]

Originally Posted by letsfightrobbb So, I ran a test yesterday. 67k miles, 104 degrees outside, let idle up to 180 degrees coolant temp. Then did the test. 86,89,85,89. Im not sure why they're are so low, as to if it was a bad gauge, poor tester (me), or what. I just changed the oil the day before the so the oil was brand new. My car runs fine, but that shit is low, at least its consistent.

i don't see how that can be accurate - maybe your gauge had a funky scale and those were really 186,189, etc
if those were really your numbers your car would run like shit - most likely w/ coolant temp thru the roof or bellowing smoke out the exhaust

[frivolous_rob]

The gauge was the oem brand rental from autozone. Looked normal to uss. Think it went up to like two hundred on psi side. Never saw anything above 89 when doing it. No smoke and car still beasts on peopleople so i have a feeling it had to be the gauge

[Tokay444]

180-185-165-185

[djuosnteisn]

Go BT.

[Tokay444]

Who me? Lol.

[frivolous_rob]

Errrrrrrrrrrrrr fkn body!

[themytb]

07 ms3 sport
52K
engine kinda warm, cooled off in garage for 30-45 minutes before test

175
174
175
176

[Lex]

08.5 MS3
47k km
1 (driver side): 195
2: 190
3: 195
4: 195

Cranked about 16 times until needle stopped climbing. Engine was warm to the touch but not hot.