Looking for real world data on filters
 

Does anyone have any good links to the benefits and tradeoffs of dry vs oiled media as it relates to air filters? I read the intake sticky and didn’t see anything on this.

I understand concerns around CELs and HP gains etc, but I also like to know that an air filter is doing its job. Obviously this would be stopping as many particles as possible from being drawn into the engine.

Has anyone, from experience, decided that one was better than the other? Like maybe seeing more dust on a MAF when they cleaned their filter or maybe a poor UOA while running on a certain type for a while.

Thanks!

I'll be nice. Dry flow filter all the way.

Since your being nice I might as well push my luck. Are you talking about a Dry flow like CS sells, or something like the wire mesh dry type?

Like CS, or AEM's. As long as it's a dry flow.

@Lex

Aren't cs filters rebranded aems?

I think aem has a study on their site showing how effective their media is compared to competitors.

i would never believe a company's study and comparison on their own product, doesnt matter how good it really is. it just screams data bias.

Chrysler thinks they're the best car manufacturer in the world.

And I think I have the biggest dick.


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That is true. Like they say, marketing is where the rubber meets the sky.

I have heard that as well. When I look at the AEM site they have two general types of dry filters. One of them has wire mesh on at least the outside of the filter, and the other doesnt.

The CS filter looks like no wire from what I can see.

They're using is standardized ISO methods, so bias is a little more difficult.

cs is in fact rebranded aem. In my opinion, Aem > everyone, including amsoil. But, basically, aem and amsoil are the two that most trust. Both are dry.

Probably sent from a toilet

Thanks to all for the feedback. I have always leaned towards dry media when it comes to air filters. The only air filter I ever oiled was a foam filter on my dirt bike.

FWIW, my K&N oiled filter worked just fine, no CELs in almost 7k miles of use.

The theory behind oiled is that b/c oil carries a charge, you can have a less dense filter and grab more particulate matter on account of incoming particulate matter carrying a slight charge.

IMO if you're going to get a SRI/CAI, diameter is more important than filter media.

Tuned? Grab the biggest intake you can find.

Not tuned? Get something (very) close to stock diameter.

Just my .02

Do some actual flow testing science and come back with your .02!

Not to be a dick but I don't have the time or patience to go get my CP-e CAI (dryflow) tested against my K&N (oiled media). I also don't have access to a flow bench so the testing would consist to me sitting around each filter, drinking a few beers, and giving you that exact same opinion.

I said 'the theory is', because I don't have hard evidence to back up said theory. All I'm saying is that I haven't seen a car have problems because they used an oiled filter vs. a dryflow.

I also haven't seen a car have problems from using 75w-90 vs. 75w-80 tranny fluid either but I'm not going to run viscosity tests under operating temperatures to show the improvement from one to the other. You either think it's a difference not worth looking into, or you obsess about it and you're marginally happier for choosing one over the other.

Either way I still drive a slow-ass minivan looking car with a hood scoop and rims.

Now, as far as intakes - JBR WP (3.5") was a noticeable increase from the K&N and the CP-e. And I'm on the stock k04.

But, I don't have access to your science. So my .02 will remain 2 goddamn cents and not the say-all be-all for filter media selection.

I went from cs dryflow to arm, prob gained 4-8 g/s. Log proved.

Now I wouldn't say go replace yours like I did, but of your looking for one get the biggest aem dryflow you can.


Also if you have a cs intake a quick not is their cs filter has a ledge to hold their air straightener inside the maf, under very hard driving with the new filter my air straightener was chilling in the filter causing all sorts of problems.

It is said 10hp from oiled to dryflow, so go dry Forsure.


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Maf sensors don't like filter oil.

k and n dipped a maf in oil and it worked so that's a little off. I have been using a cobb for 15k miles no issue. honestly if used right I don't see a issue with either. over oil or don't clean, you gonna have a issue. but the filters job first and for most is clean air that's what I expect it to do.

And now the English version, please?

i've had a k&n on for close to 50k miles with no problems. it makes sense that a dry filter would flow better, i am just wanting to share my anecdotal evidence supporting the reliability of oiled filter media..

my MAF doesn't mind my k&n..

Look up online, there's a flow chart some where.. Dry came up so far on top it's stupid.


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These aren't turbos, they are filters. I think it's pointless to compare them. Any actual differences will be so minute that you won't notice it in practice.

Some people prefer air filters cause they're easier to clean and you do not have to reapply a coat of oil. It really makes no damn difference, arguing about it is time wasting....

no excuse, stupid auto correction and my typing equal fail.

I can't get access to their website right now because i'm at work, but there is a great article on Spectre Performance's website about this very topic.

Basically, whatever filter they used for their world record setting Spectre Speedliner last year was the best solution they found. The conditions it had to protect the engine from were quite horrid as you'll see looking at the pictures on the website. The filter would end up caked with salt at the end of each speed run.

Keep in mind that they needed enough airflow to keep an 8.8l twin turboed V8 breathing until 9000 RPM's.

I can't access the website at work so I can't find it right now.

I just say run no air filter. Cheap yet effective.

I beg to differ. There is imperical data showing more g/s on a dry flow filter than an oiled one. and we all know more g/s means more potential power.
And just because a maf doesn't short out with filter oil, doesn't mean it's not caking with particles that DO get through the filter and skewing its readings. Hell, even with a dry from you still need to clean your maf sensor from time to time.

I did a little more research (As much as I can do at work) and the Spectre performance filter is an oiled filter.

They claim it is the best flowing filter available. Of course, any company would 'claim' this. It is at least proven given the fact that it was on a car going over 400MPH. Although it is unknown to me right now if they chose potentially less air flow with an oiled filter due to the oiled filter potentially capturing more particles. Being that they were on the salt flats, and from the images of the caked air filter - You'd want a filter that was actually doing it's job to prevent that salt from getting into the engine.

Link?

I've had K&N oil coat my maf and screw up my tune on a different car. I'd like to see if the oil sticks to our valves the way it sticks to the maf.

Even K&N is recognizing that dry filters are better...

They're who manufactures AEM's dry filter elements now.

Transnational Capital Corp. | Recent News & Events

i still want to see the flow tested data. i looked for almost an hour and couldn't find anything that seemed objective.

like i said, it makes sense that a dry filter would flow better, but i would like proof before i get rid of my k&n filters and buy a dry flow.

ah fuck, i only have a HT, i bet it makes fuck all of a difference.

probably, but if you're not using an OCC it's irrelevant because engine oil is building up on them much more.

man, how much oil do you put on your air filters? i hardly think oiled filters are a remotely significant source of carbon build-up on the valves...

edit:^beat me to it!

TBH My nickname is Snap Off because I tend to over do it. Break tools, to much grease, shit like that. I very well might of over oiled it. It was not dripping off but I made sure I left no area white on that filter.

This is not possible. The breather hose is after the MAF.

Whoops, realized you were talking about the valves.

Best air filter information I have gathered.

I think in most cases, it comes down to filtration vs. another 10 hp.

Air Filter Shootout Test - Results! - evolutionm.net
^note popular amsoil filter (Cobb replacement tested)

http://www.mkiv.com/techarticles/filters_test/2/

Air Filtration Test

this is a thread i created a couple years ago comparing the same question.

http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...arisons-44858/

From what I have seen it is a trade off between filter performance and flow performance. A dry paper filter will flow more air over the life of the filter than basically anything else, a oiled filter will out flow a dry paper filter when fresh but it clogs extremely quickly because it filters better than anything else.

Some of the drawbacks of the k&n can be mitigated by running a filter that is oversized for the application.

Filter oil does skew maf readings.