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-   MazdaSpeed 3 - Engine, Transmission & Driveline (http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f10/)
-   -   MZR DISI Heat Management (http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/forum/f10/mzr-disi-heat-management-140135/)

Voltwings 03-18-2013 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86azms3 (Post 1954761)
fuck it i'm doing it...you only live once.

If you look at the grille ( i remember you having a Gen2 correct?) you will see that a good upper portion of the smile is blocked off from behind. That plastic cover hides the crash bar, i've contemplated buying one of the slim bars, i believe UR and CP-E sell them, and taking all that plastic out to allow more airflow in the front grille. Not saying you need to spend more money to make this experiement worth it, but certainly something that should work well in conjunction with it.

Edit: fail, i see now you have an 09. Oh well maybe i'll have to be the one to try this ^^ out haha

86AmishMs3 03-18-2013 02:22 PM

And also with it open there is more fresh air for the heat to diffuse to the ambient when your stopped. Of course convection> diffusion

But also due to the high heat of the radiator you have forced convection...so i'm thinking even stopped it's a win win.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltwings (Post 1954768)
If you look at the grille ( i remember you having a Gen2 correct?) you will see that a good upper portion of the smile is blocked off from behind. That plastic cover hides the crash bar, i've contemplated buying one of the slim bars, i believe UR and CP-E sell them, and taking all that plastic out to allow more airflow in the front grille. Not saying you need to spend more money to make this experiement worth it, but certainly something that should work well in conjunction with it.

Negative genwon

aggierandy 03-18-2013 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86azms3 (Post 1954761)
fuck it i'm doing it...you only live once.

I can't believe you YOLO'd us! LMAO.

RapaTapTap

86AmishMs3 03-18-2013 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aggierandy (Post 1954780)
I can't believe you YOLO'd us! LMAO.

RapaTapTap

Oh...so that's what YOLO means? Guess I'm just getting old.

Tomas 03-18-2013 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by daafisch (Post 1950479)
i

As for max fluid temps: Water - 260°F, Oil 300°F+. The oil that they run is Maxima RS1040 and they don't ever worry about oil related issues.

Fucking crazy awesome that these engines can handle those temps.
Not that it should, but good to know that it can.

mrQQ 03-21-2013 09:09 AM

by the way, don't know about AP, but VT has table "Fan On Engine Coolant Temperature"...

chuckms6 03-21-2013 09:17 AM

Re: MZR DISI Heat Management
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by mrQQ (Post 1960384)
by the way, don't know about AP, but VT has table "Fan On Engine Coolant Temperature"...

Atr had that, it was ineffective so it was removed

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

8.5MS3 03-21-2013 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestspeed3 (Post 1951627)
Has anyone upgraded there rad on here?

I don't mind using a gen1 rad so long as I can make it work without too much custom work.

I think it should be safe to say that if you track you should upgrade the rad.

Quote:

Originally Posted by silvapain (Post 1954558)
+1. I am interested in the KOYO radiator upgrade, but my CXRacing FMIC hot pipe barely fits as it is with the stock radiator.

I have one sitting in a box

Once my clutch is finished being built, the new mods go in, and the tune is done I will be more than happy to post logs and such

its still balls cold here tho....

Dano 03-21-2013 09:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 8.5MS3 (Post 1960452)
I have one sitting in a box

Once my clutch is finished being built, the new mods go in, and the tune is done I will be more than happy to post logs and such

its still balls cold here tho....

Do you know if the koyo is thicker than OEM?

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrQQ (Post 1960384)
by the way, don't know about AP, but VT has table "Fan On Engine Coolant Temperature"...

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuckms6 (Post 1960399)
Atr had that, it was ineffective so it was removed

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I727 using Tapatalk 2

^^^ Correct, forget about ECU fan control...not going to happen b/c the majority of the logic is in the external controller on the fan. The ECU just sends a few input signals to it AFAIK:

AC on
Car stopped
ECT

From there the external controller makes its decisions about on/off

full info in Ant's thread linked in OP.

8.5MS3 03-21-2013 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dano (Post 1960475)
Do you know if the koyo is thicker than OEM?

Quote:

Originally Posted by RallySportDirect (Post 1707619)
OEM Core Dimensions: 26-3/8 x 14-1/2 x 5/8 in.

Koyo Aluminum cores have more efficient cooling fins as well as the added capacity an thickness to help dissipate more heat.

Koyo's Core Dimensions:

Core Depth: 1.0in
Core Height: 14.48in
Core Width: 26.37in

The major difference is the added 3/8" of thickness to the core.

No issues with condenser core clearance as this will fit in the exact same location as the OEM core and work with the OEM condenser.

It will install just like OEM and fitment will be of OEM quality with Koyo's.

I personally have run 2 of the Koyo Performance radiators on my cars and never had any issues to speak of with temps. AC running in the middle of the summer and 100+ degrees temps and the temps stay normal. On track and racing same as well.

see above

Dano 03-21-2013 10:12 AM

This is my worry for my setup at least...I suppose most things can be worked out but I have about that much space between my fan and IC piping.

Quote:

The major difference is the added 3/8" of thickness to the core.


8.5MS3 03-21-2013 10:16 AM

neoprene sticky pad on the pipe?

Dano 03-21-2013 10:21 AM

gheto?

haha I don't even think I fit into this catagory so IDK why I even posted...just for the general knowledge I guess.

what FMIC kit do you have and we'll wait to see how your fitment turns out...please be honest and tell us if you went gheto.

Snyeed 03-21-2013 10:33 AM

Ghetto

8.5MS3 03-21-2013 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dano (Post 1960542)
gheto?

haha I don't even think I fit into this catagory so IDK why I even posted...just for the general knowledge I guess.

what FMIC kit do you have and we'll wait to see how your fitment turns out...please be honest and tell us if you went gheto.

Cobb FMIC

surprisingly my car doesnt have too many zip ties, and no duct tape

i will post pics

Lex 03-21-2013 10:37 AM

A thicker core may not add to where the fans mount with respect to the chassis. The endtanks where the fans mount are larger than the core. So the core can grow without moving the fans inward.

TiGraySpeed6 03-21-2013 10:44 AM

Ayy room to run pusher fans instead of pullers?
could free up some room if the condenser isn't an issue

Dano 03-21-2013 10:49 AM

yes pushers were briefly discussed a page back or so. There is 3.5" in front of my FMIC. zero room for a fan between the AC condenser and FMIC...well < 1"

Voltwings 03-22-2013 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86azms3 (Post 1954771)
And also with it open there is more fresh air for the heat to diffuse to the ambient when your stopped. Of course convection> diffusion

But also due to the high heat of the radiator you have forced convection...so i'm thinking even stopped it's a win win.

Have you gotten ballsy yet? My intake manifolds coming out this weekend so I was thinking of tackling this while I was at it.

86AmishMs3 03-22-2013 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Voltwings (Post 1962657)
Have you gotten ballsy yet? My intake manifolds coming out this weekend so I was thinking of tackling this while I was at it.

Nah fiance said i coudn't have my balls and instead made me paint the bathroom. I'll try to commit to monday or tuesday, hopefully with data.

Voltwings 03-22-2013 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 86azms3 (Post 1962722)
Nah fiance said i coudn't have my balls and instead made me paint the bathroom. I'll try to commit to monday or tuesday, hopefully with data.

Wrecked haha. Well mine might be done this weekend and we can compare gen 1/2 at the very least.

cld12pk2go 03-25-2013 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cld12pk2go (Post 1951513)
FYI,

I personally think one of the reasons I have been able to keep the stock block together is that I rigorously follow a few simply rules:

1.) Never beat on the car until ECT's are up to temp (no more than 5-10 PSI), because clearances aren't right and KR is not active.

2.) Never beat on the car if ECT's are high (over 200°F), my pulls are typically after highway cruising with ECT in the mid 180's.

3.) Never do back to back pulls. Mine are always at least 3 min of highway driving apart and typically much longer.

2/3 help avoid overheating the piston and butting the rings, which is what I would believe is the most likely hypothesis to explain why people are breaking ring lands...

I do also run plenty of meth/eth for KR avoidance coupled with 2 heat range colder plugs than stock...

Compression check results:

Driver side to Passenger side (I forget the numerical order)

182-176-174-177

4.5% delta between max/min. I can live with that at ~500whp.

http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j6...psde7696a8.jpg


I love these motors... :dance:

Dano 03-25-2013 10:25 AM

Looking good!

BTW since I will soon be putting a new motor in and plan to use the " pull it through the front method", I am tempted to pickup a koyo. I'll already have the rad out anyway and am hemorrhaging money already what's another 400.
Lol


Tappin

erevlydeux 04-16-2013 02:17 PM

Necroing this shit, but does anybody in the NE area, or hell, anyone whose willing to ship one, have a spare radiator fan they'd be willing to give to me? I'd love to take a crack at figuring out a simple way to provide an override signal to the fan that is PNP for errbody. :squareeyed:

Dano 04-16-2013 02:22 PM

there is already something in the works ;)

erevlydeux 04-16-2013 02:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dano (Post 2007738)
there is already something in the works ;)

Doesn't mean two (or more!) people can't work on things in parallel and combine their efforts :D

Voltwings 04-16-2013 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erevlydeux (Post 2007744)
Doesn't mean two (or more!) people can't work on things in parallel and combine their efforts :D

Get ballsy ;) lol weekends are as long as you make them.

Dano 04-16-2013 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by erevlydeux (Post 2007744)
Doesn't mean two (or more!) people can't work on things in parallel and combine their efforts :D

tis very true.

erevlydeux 04-16-2013 02:42 PM

Guess I can just build a pass thru harness and tap the pass thru for debugging.. easier than finding a spare rad fan

Alpha 04-16-2013 03:04 PM

I still wanna see some AWR radiator results before I scoop one up! :)

Dano 04-16-2013 03:56 PM

the news on the alternate aux fan controller can be found here. @BlueStreak; has been working on this for a few weeks and its almost ready.

I didn't 100% like the aux controller solution that Anthony had going so I asked Dave [bluestreak] if he could make some magic happen since he is practically building a dashawk type of device from scratch. The name Dashawk does't do that device justice but the easiest thing I could think of.

This lil thing will aid greatly in heat management.

http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...6/#post2007570

Alpha 04-16-2013 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dano (Post 2007908)
the news on the alternate aux fan controller can be found here. @BlueStreak; has been working on this for a few weeks and its almost ready.

I didn't 100% like the aux controller solution that Anthony had going so I asked Dave [bluestreak] if he could make some magic happen since he is practically building a dashawk type of device from scratch. The name Dashawk does't do that device justice but the easiest thing I could think of.

This lil thing will aid greatly in heat management.

http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...6/#post2007570

I see, but it looks like a PITA to install while requiring more of the driver's attention due to the lack of a thermostat switch.

The benefit of that way is complete control anytime, but you'd have to be constantly monitoring coolant temps to know when to flip the switch. :o

I'd rather just drive an know I'm at 200 or less at all times lol

Cool work though!

jmhinkle 04-16-2013 04:38 PM

I think I like the standalone solution better as well. I have the parts already anyways.

breakfasteatre 04-16-2013 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alpha (Post 2007976)
I see, but it looks like a PITA to install while requiring more of the driver's attention due to the lack of a thermostat switch.

The benefit of that way is complete control anytime, but you'd have to be constantly monitoring coolant temps to know when to flip the switch. :o

I'd rather just drive an know I'm at 200 or less at all times lol

Cool work though!

There is a thermostat switch. It is completely automatic. Although he hasnt posted photos of the board he made, you can adjust the low and high temp thresholds and it will turn the fan on and off accordingly.

@BlueStreak;

erevlydeux 04-16-2013 05:59 PM

The lack of it being plug-and-play is what detracts from its value in my eyes. Having to pull out your radiator fan assembly and scrape/solder to wires? Eek. I'm surprised that was the approach taken over tricking the on-board fan controller into thinking it needed to be on.

BlueStreak 04-16-2013 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alpha (Post 2007976)
I see, but it looks like a PITA to install while requiring more of the driver's attention due to the lack of a thermostat switch.

The benefit of that way is complete control anytime, but you'd have to be constantly monitoring coolant temps to know when to flip the switch. :o

I'd rather just drive an know I'm at 200 or less at all times lol

Cool work though!

Quote:

Originally Posted by breakfasteatre (Post 2008009)
There is a thermostat switch. It is completely automatic. Although he hasnt posted photos of the board he made, you can adjust the low and high temp thresholds and it will turn the fan on and off accordingly.

@BlueStreak;

Correct. Its set and forget. Nothing manual. Give me some time :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by erevlydeux (Post 2008140)
The lack of it being plug-and-play is what detracts from its value in my eyes. Having to pull out your radiator fan assembly and scrape/solder to wires? Eek. I'm surprised that was the approach taken over tricking the on-board fan controller into thinking it needed to be on.

You're stealing my thunder! Thats for revision 2. I already looked into it and it wasn't as straight forward as I had assumed so I back tracked a little.

erevlydeux 04-16-2013 06:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueStreak (Post 2008216)
You're stealing my thunder! Thats for revision 2. I already looked into it and it wasn't as straight forward as I had assumed so I back tracked a little.

If you still have that radiator fan of yours out, you should check if there is a part number on the 3-pin connector that goes into the fan controller. I'd love try and find some mating pieces to build a harness and dink around on it. :D

BlueStreak 04-16-2013 07:03 PM

Ah. It's definitely back in the car now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Dano 04-16-2013 07:06 PM

Well I thought since Dave already posted in his thread it was ok to mention it.

Afaik all the "wants" will be included in the finished product. No hacking of hoses required.

You guys that want those china rad hose adapters and sending units that don't come in till 200 have at it!

Good things come to those who wait.

I hope Dave doesn't disown me.




Tappin

erevlydeux 04-16-2013 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlueStreak (Post 2008253)
Ah. It's definitely back in the car now.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

¡Ay que mala situacion! Anybody else got theirs our and wanna take some pics of the connectors? :)


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