Oversized bearings mazdaspeed 3 issues

[azazelthegreat]

I can't find the proper bearings for my car.
Ive gone through so many sets

Bought standards
then found out my crank needed to be machined
Then was told i need to order .20 oversized
Then was told that they had to go to 50MM since the crank was bent or some shit.

Ordered 50mm oversized bearings from Clevite and well this happened


Clevite said that those bearings would work. which doesn't make since Eagle says that those bearings are obviously wrong


So my question, where do i go about finding proper 50mm oversized bearings im about to say screw it and buy a new crankshaft after having my car down for almost 3 months.

[Lex]

Oversized bearings were hard to find in the past and not sure that has changed. I would also look at sourcing a good crank. A bent crank - if that was the case - is not something I'd run.

[06Speed6]

There are no .5mm bearings. New crank time.

[silvapain]

I have yet to find bearings that will work with machined crank journals. My machinist has three MZR cranks that are worthless until we find a solution.

[He Hate Me]

OEM part#: L3Y2-11-SFX is 50mm oversize.

I would like to see the numbers that are on the bearings that you currently have to make sure they are even the correct ones.

[SFWD 1934]

Those con rod bearings that you have are not for the MZR motor. They are for a 2.3L DOHC from a Ford truck. The max tunnel on those is 53MM. The ones for the MZR have a tunnel size of up to 55MM. Look in the thread in the sticky section of the Mazdaspeed 3 area. The ones for the MZR motor from Clevite is CB-1918 or CB-1925. ACL has some as well. Just check that thread for the part numbers.

But yes if the crank is not true I would not use it.

Jason

[El_Diablo]

Jeez Kieth, you never told me the crank was actually bent. What machine shop did you go through? There aren't to many around here that can properly straighten a crank.

[Andjo]

I might have a crank for sale soon and will sell it cheap if it's any good.

[azazelthegreat]

Originally Posted by 06Speed6 There are no .5mm bearings. New crank time.

Ive found 2 sets.
undersized and oversized

Originally Posted by El_Diablo Jeez Kieth, you never told me the crank was actually bent. What machine shop did you go through? There aren't to many around here that can properly straighten a crank.

they said it was bent, i dont think it was i think they wanted more money.

it was fine coming out of the car.
"crank was bent so we machined some more. or something along those lines"

Originally Posted by He Hate Me OEM part#: L3Y2-11-SFX is 50mm oversize. I would like to see the numbers that are on the bearings that you currently have to make sure they are even the correct ones.

me too but the bearings are at my buddies and hes not getting ahold of me

Originally Posted by silvapain I have yet to find bearings that will work with machined crank journals. My machinist has three MZR cranks that are worthless until we find a solution.

BEARING SET for 2010 Mazda CX-7|L3Y211SFX

Originally Posted by Andjo I might have a crank for sale soon and will sell it cheap if it's any good.

How soon. like in a few days soon?

[silvapain]

you need UNDERsized bearings when you machine the crank journal. OVERsized bearings are for when the block side is machined.

http://www.freeasestudyguides.com/cr...nspection.html

[skiptowncat]

Originally Posted by silvapain you need UNDERsized bearings when you machine the crank journal. OVERsized bearings are for when the block side is machined. Main Crankshaft Bearings: Use Oversized or Undersized Bearing

A new day here, another thing learned.

[azazelthegreat]

well back to square one. Finding proper undersized bearings.

[azazelthegreat]

Originally Posted by SFWD 1934 Those con rod bearings that you have are not for the MZR motor. They are for a 2.3L DOHC from a Ford truck. The max tunnel on those is 53MM. The ones for the MZR have a tunnel size of up to 55MM. Look in the thread in the sticky section of the Mazdaspeed 3 area. The ones for the MZR motor from Clevite is CB-1918 or CB-1925. ACL has some as well. Just check that thread for the part numbers. But yes if the crank is not true I would not use it. Jason

i actually have 1925s in my room. They are not big enough.
If im correct they are STD size

[azazelthegreat]

So, when it comes to machining, how does it go? 10 20 25 50 or 50 25 20 10?

[06Speed6]

10 20 25 50, that is the amount of material removed.

Undersize bearings are a different story, if they ground a bent crank .5mm it is almost certainly garbage because the jounals have to be in alignment and there is almost no possibility that they didnt move the centerline while grinding.

[azazelthegreat]

i really dont think it was bent. i think they were full of shit.

but anyways i think im just going to find a new crank.

Originally Posted by 06Speed6 10 20 25 50, that is the amount of material removed. Undersize bearings are a different story, if they ground a bent crank .5mm it is almost certainly garbage because the jounals have to be in alignment and there is almost no possibility that they didnt move the centerline while grinding.

anyways i cant grind off anymore even i wanted to.

I got word that my buddy knows a guy who can get special bearings made.

looking into options this week i guess

Hopefully i can snag a crank for under 500...

774 new.

[m4tic]

Originally Posted by silvapain you need UNDERsized bearings when you machine the crank journal. OVERsized bearings are for when the block side is machined. Main Crankshaft Bearings: Use Oversized or Undersized Bearing

holy shit... so many things make sense now

[azazelthegreat]

Clevite:
140 CID (2.3L) DOHC 16 Valve L4; 3.44" (87.5mm) Bore; Ford MZR
Turbocharged; Engine Code: L3T; VIN: M - sorry, no bearings for this
model.

But thats after saying the bearings (posted above) will work.

same guy.

[M900]

I used to grind cranks, and the first thing to check after measuring the journals is if the the crank is bent. If it is bent it needs to be checked for cracks. If not cracked it needs to be straightened, then ground. If you grind a bent crank it will come out of the grinder bent, and or the stroke will be off. So, either these guys missed the number the first time, or it came out bent. The sizes most likely go .25mm-.50mm and so on.
Paul

[SFWD 1934]

Here:

Part Details for CB-1925H:
Rod Bearing Overview

Specifications
Material: TM-77

Min. Std. Shaft Diameter:
2.0465"
51.9811MM

Max. Std. Shaft Diameter:
2.0472"
51.9989MM

Min. Vert. Oil Clearance:
.0004"
0.0102MM

Max. Vert. Oil Clearance:
.0022"
0.0559MM

Max. Wall:
.0588"
1.4935MM

Min. Brg. O.D. or Housing Bore:
2.1662"
55.0342MM

Max. Brg. O.D. or Housing Bore:
2.1667"
55.0342MM

Max. Length:
.665"
16.8910MM


Jason

[azazelthegreat]

Originally Posted by SFWD 1934 Here: Part Details for CB-1925H: Rod Bearing Overview Specifications Material: TM-77 Min. Std. Shaft Diameter: 2.0465" 51.9811MM Max. Std. Shaft Diameter: 2.0472" 51.9989MM Min. Vert. Oil Clearance: .0004" 0.0102MM Max. Vert. Oil Clearance: .0022" 0.0559MM Max. Wall: .0588" 1.4935MM Min. Brg. O.D. or Housing Bore: 2.1662" 55.0342MM Max. Brg. O.D. or Housing Bore: 2.1667" 55.0342MM Max. Length: .665" 16.8910MM Jason

Thanks but pretty sure those are standard... I have a set I bought before I found out the crank needed machined

[SFWD 1934]

I tried to copy over the page that had all the info from Clevite but it didn't work. So I just grabbed the basic info from those bearings. Just out of curiosity what is the part number you have for the Eagle rods?

Jason

[azazelthegreat]

Originally Posted by SFWD 1934 I tried to copy over the page that had all the info from Clevite but it didn't work. So I just grabbed the basic info from those bearings. Just out of curiosity what is the part number you have for the Eagle rods? Jason

not sure im not at home. The 1925s fit

[rangergt]

Originally Posted by SFWD 1934 Those con rod bearings that you have are not for the MZR motor. They are for a 2.3L DOHC from a Ford truck.

That is not accurate, they are for mzr 2.3 as well just not mazdaspeed DISI mzr. All duratecs and NA MZR have a 50mm rod journal (and use clevite cb1838) and the mazdaspeed disi has a 52mm rod journal (use clevite cb1925)

Originally Posted by M900 I used to grind cranks, and the first thing to check after measuring the journals is if the crank is bent. If it is bent it needs to be checked for cracks. If not cracked it needs to be straightened, then ground. If you grind a bent crank it will come out of the grinder bent, and or the stroke will be off. So, either these guys missed the number the first time, or it came out bent. The sizes most likely go .25mm-.50mm and so on. Paul

I agree 100%

I would also find a new machine shop to work with because they are either incompetent or dishonest or both.

[azazelthegreat]

I don't plan on getting anything else machined...


Rods are fine. 2 sets fit fine.
Standard and the .25s

Its a shame

[SFWD 1934]

Originally Posted by rangergt That is not accurate, they are for mzr 2.3 as well just not mazdaspeed DISI mzr. All duratecs and NA MZR have a 50mm rod journal (and use clevite cb1838) and the mazdaspeed disi has a 52mm rod journal (use clevite cb1925)

I just do not call the non speed motor an MZR, I just refer to it as the NA 2.3L Duratec. But when I saw those CB1838 in the pic I knew he had the wrong con rod bearings.

Jason

[azazelthegreat]

Originally Posted by Lex Oversized bearings were hard to find in the past and not sure that has changed. I would also look at sourcing a good crank. A bent crank - if that was the case - is not something I'd run.

Have any leads on sourcing a crank=/

[crutch77]

Originally Posted by silvapain I have yet to find bearings that will work with machined crank journals. My machinist has three MZR cranks that are worthless until we find a solution.

Originally Posted by azazelthegreat I don't plan on getting anything else machined... Rods are fine. 2 sets fit fine. Standard and the .25s Its a shame

azazel, I was in the same boat as you. Rod bearing journals had to be machined to -.50mm, and then I found that there are apparently no undersize bearings to be had for our vehicles beyond -.25mm. I scoured the internet and spent half a day reading through catalogs and crossing part numbers and came across these:

ACL Race Series Bearings

The only significant difference is the overall length, which is .650" vs. stock I believe is .669". That gives you 97% of the stock width, so I wouldn't worry about that at all. They fit great in my Manley rods, and the oil gap (measured with plastigauge) came in right at .0015".

I've only got about 100 miles on my engine at this point, but it's running perfectly smooth. I'll update again after I've got more miles on, but I'm very confident at this point. This bearing crosses to all sorts of other manufacturers, and some come in sizes all the way down to -.75mm. I'll have to find the sheet I wrote all those numbers on when I get home.

Anyway, I hope it's not too late for this information to be of use to you. @silvapain, let me know what your machinist thinks.

[azazelthegreat]

Originally Posted by crutch77 azazel, I was in the same boat as you. Rod bearing journals had to be machined to -.50mm, and then I found that there are apparently no undersize bearings to be had for our vehicles beyond -.25mm. I scoured the internet and spent half a day reading through catalogs and crossing part numbers and came across these: ACL Race Series Bearings The only significant difference is the overall length, which is .650" vs. stock I believe is .669". That gives you 97% of the stock width, so I wouldn't worry about that at all. They fit great in my Manley rods, and the oil gap (measured with plastigauge) came in right at .0015". I've only got about 100 miles on my engine at this point, but it's running perfectly smooth. I'll update again after I've got more miles on, but I'm very confident at this point. This bearing crosses to all sorts of other manufacturers, and some come in sizes all the way down to -.75mm. I'll have to find the sheet I wrote all those numbers on when I get home. Anyway, I hope it's not too late for this information to be of use to you. @silvapain, let me know what your machinist thinks.

Yeah a bit late. Ordered a new crank.

550 miled into break in.

That is interesting though.

Though I have to sell my old bearings :l

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy S4.5

[BZiggy10]

Originally Posted by crutch77 azazel, I was in the same boat as you. Rod bearing journals had to be machined to -.50mm, and then I found that there are apparently no undersize bearings to be had for our vehicles beyond -.25mm. I scoured the internet and spent half a day reading through catalogs and crossing part numbers and came across these: ACL Race Series Bearings The only significant difference is the overall length, which is .650" vs. stock I believe is .669". That gives you 97% of the stock width, so I wouldn't worry about that at all. They fit great in my Manley rods, and the oil gap (measured with plastigauge) came in right at .0015". I've only got about 100 miles on my engine at this point, but it's running perfectly smooth. I'll update again after I've got more miles on, but I'm very confident at this point. This bearing crosses to all sorts of other manufacturers, and some come in sizes all the way down to -.75mm. I'll have to find the sheet I wrote all those numbers on when I get home. Anyway, I hope it's not too late for this information to be of use to you. @silvapain, let me know what your machinist thinks.

How have these bearings worked for you since this post? I just went to put the bearings my machinist got me and same thing as OP had going on. I was aware that some people had problems finding the undersized bearings but I thought I was good because the machine guy is very knowledgeable.

[crutch77]

Originally Posted by BZiggy10 How have these bearings worked for you since this post? I just went to put the bearings my machinist got me and same thing as OP had going on. I was aware that some people had problems finding the undersized bearings but I thought I was good because the machine guy is very knowledgeable.

They're working wonderfully. I've got a few thousand miles on my rebuild now, and I've been pushing it hard for a while now I'm self tuning, so I've done a shitload of WOT pulls lately, and one of my map revisions was hitting 380 peak torque. Engine is running silky smooth.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

[BZiggy10]

Originally Posted by crutch77 They're working wonderfully. I've got a few thousand miles on my rebuild now, and I've been pushing it hard for a while now I'm self tuning, so I've done a shitload of WOT pulls lately, and one of my map revisions was hitting 380 peak torque. Engine is running silky smooth. Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk

I'm going to make certain with my machine guy that mine was machined .50 under. I will see what he thinks of these if he doesn't have another solution.

You got the Manley H beam and not the H beam plus right?

You got the Manley H beam and not the H beam plus right?

[BZiggy10]

@
@silvapain

What do yall think about this. I know a few months back you said that one of you have three cranks useless because of no bearings. If crutch77 is running fine for a couple thousand miles sounds like they should be good right?

[BZiggy10]

and @06Speed6

[06Speed6]

Bearings are bearings, if the OD, ID, and width work then I dont see a problem with it. Iirc our rod bearings are odd Evo bearings and our crank bearings are out of a Honda.

And I dont generally buy worn oit parts so it wasnt me haha

[crutch77]

Originally Posted by BZiggy10 I'm going to make certain with my machine guy that mine was machined .50 under. I will see what he thinks of these if he doesn't have another solution. You got the Manley H beam and not the H beam plus right? You got the Manley H beam and not the H beam plus right?

Correct.

Originally Posted by 06Speed6 Bearings are bearings, if the OD, ID, and width work then I dont see a problem with it. Iirc our rod bearings are odd Evo bearings and our crank bearings are out of a Honda. And I dont generally buy worn oit parts so it wasnt me haha

FWIW, these ACL bearings (which I've established are slightly narrower than our stock rod bearings) are from various Subaru engines: EJ16, EJ18S, EJ20E, EJ20T, EJ22, EJ22T, EJ25, EJ25T (WRX motors )

These bearings do have tangs, as stock bearings do. They also have no oil holes, same as stock. Some of the bearings I found in my search had oil holes, some had no tangs.

[crutch77]

@BZiggy10, here's where I ordered them from: Race-Mart Cheap, and good customer service in my experience. I was in a rush, and I called them. They talked me out of paying for expedited shipping and I ended up getting the bearings next day with standard FedEx service. YMMV, of course.

[BZiggy10]

I will check them out. Might be ordering the with the rest of my stuff from Edge Auto with a 7% discount!!

Wow crap those are cheap. NVM just made my decision lol

[06Speed6]

Originally Posted by crutch77 Correct. FWIW, these ACL bearings (which I've established are slightly narrower than our stock rod bearings) are from various Subaru engines: EJ16, EJ18S, EJ20E, EJ20T, EJ22, EJ22T, EJ25, EJ25T (WRX motors ) These bearings do have tangs, as stock bearings do. They also have no oil holes, same as stock. Some of the bearings I found in my search had oil holes, some had no tangs.

Your right, it was a scooby engine.

[crutch77]

@BZiggy10, how's it going? For you and anyone else following this thread who might be wondering about the health of my engine, I decided to post a log from today. This is with about 3500 miles on my rebuilt engine.

I'm in the process of self-tuning, so everybody please feel free to pick my shit apart. FWIW, my knock sensor is active to 7200 rpm.