Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203897)

It's a great accomplishment to be sure, but I'd expect to see some very fast cars when the engine has been around for 10+ years...

Originally Posted by Superstretch18 (Post 203904)

Sorry if this has been asked before, but can't the standback control the additional injectors for a PI application?

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203913)

the 2.2 ecotec was introduced in 2002 and had a very limited aftermarket support not unlike the mazda.

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203913)

I guess your right if you spent 8G on the car already, but does everyone need to spend that much money to get to the point where they need (or could use) additional injectors? From what I understand, these cars run into fuel problems very quick. Spend 2G's on a bigger turbo and instantly you could use more fuel.

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203913)

How many IM's are already out there? how many of the people spending 8G's on their motor are running stock IM's.

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203913)

I'm not trying to start an argument or anything, just asking some questions since I'm new to the mazda scene. :wiggle:

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203897)

After spending ~$8000 for a built motor and the associated parts and turbo system, your not going to worry about another ~750 for a new manifold if it actually gets you the power you want.

Do you need to spend 8G's on your motor before needing extra injectors? From what I understand, these cars run out of fuel fairly quick. Spend 2G's on a bigger turbo and you instantly need aux. injectors. Do the people who dump that much money into their motors still run stock IM's? I'm not really sure how many companies have good IM's for the speed




It's a great accomplishment to be sure, but I'd expect to see some very fast cars when the engine has been around for 10+ years...

Originally Posted by whoosh (Post 203941)

did anyone read the new book "quoting for dummies"????

BRB....almost done

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203944)

i didnt get that far yet....only on chapter 2


have you thought about changing your name to Dhooosh ?

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203938)

Originally Posted by WIKI

The basic Family II architecture was substantially reengineered in 2000, becoming the Ecotec 2.2, model L61 (or L42 for the CNG version). First appearing in the 2000 Saturn LS1, the L61 spread throughout North American GM products, displacing the Quad 4 and its descendents.

Unlike its notably harsh predecessor, the L61 was designed for smoothness. Dual in-block balance shafts were integral to the design, and all accessories were mounted directly to the engine block to reduce vibration. The oil filter was cast into the block with a removable cover and replaceable paper element.

Displacement for the 2.2 L engine is 2196 cc (134 cu in) with an 86 mm (3.38 in) bore and 94.6 mm (3.72 in) stroke. Compression is 9.5:1 or 10:1, delivering 135 to 143 hp (101 to 107 kW) and 142 to 152 lb·ft (193 to 206 N·m) of torque. The Ecotec line is manufactured in Tonawanda, New York, Kaiserslautern, Germany, and (for Saturn) in Spring Hill, Tennessee. The L61-powered Saturn Ion replaced the Saturn-powered Saturn S-Series.

There are a few variations to the standard L61. The new Chevrolet Malibu uses a version with electronic throttle control and a special unitized exhaust manifold and catalytic converter. The 2003 Saturn L-Series has a high output version with higher (10:1) compression and more aggressive camshaft. The Malibu and Saturn versions also use return-less fuel injection. The 2002 Saturn VUE was the first North American variant of the L61 to be equipped with electronic throttle control, whereas other applications did not arise until 2005 in the Saturn ION and Chevrolet Cobalt. The supercharger and inlet manifold from the 2.0 Ecotec engine can be purchased as an official kit from GM and along with modified software in the ECM, can create a 2.2 supercharged version of this engine.

In 2007 the L61 was upgraded with a second generation cylinder case, Coil on plug ignition, 58x crankshaft position sensing and a 32-bit computer.

The 2.2 L Ecotec is used in the following cars:

Year(s) Model Power Torque
2002–2005 Chevrolet Cavalier 140 hp (100 kW) @ 5600 rpm 150 lb·ft (203 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2004 Chevrolet Classic (Malibu) 144 hp (107 kW) @ 5600 rpm 155 lb·ft (210 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2005–2006 Chevrolet Cobalt 145 hp (108 kW) @ 5600 rpm 155 lb·ft (210 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2007–2008 148 hp (110 kW) @ 5600 rpm 152 lb·ft (206 N·m) @ 4200 rpm
2006 Chevrolet HHR 143 hp (107 kW) @ 5600 rpm 150 lb·ft (203 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2007–2008 Chevrolet HHR 149 hp (111 kW) @ 5600 rpm 152 lb·ft (206 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2002–2004 Oldsmobile Alero 140 hp (100 kW) @ 5600 rpm 150 lb·ft (203 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2002–2005 Pontiac Grand Am 140 hp (100 kW) @ 5600 rpm 150 lb·ft (203 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2002–2005 Pontiac Sunfire 140 hp (100 kW) @ 5600 rpm 150 lb·ft (203 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2005–2008 Pontiac G5/Pursuit 145 hp (108 kW) @ 5600 rpm 155 lb·ft (210 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2003–2005 Saturn L-Series (high output) 140 hp (100 kW) @ 5600 rpm 145 lb·ft (197 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2003–2007 Saturn Ion 140 hp (100 kW) @ 5600 rpm 145 lb·ft (197 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2002–2007 Saturn VUE 143 hp (107 kW) @ 5600 rpm 155 lb·ft (210 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
2001–2005 Vauxhall VX220/Opel Speedster 147 hp (110 kW) @ 5800 rpm 150 lb·ft (203 N·m) @ 4000 rpm
Opel/Vauxhall/Holden Astra
Opel/Vauxhall/Holden Vectra
Opel/Vauxhall/Holden Zafira/Subaru Traviq

Following the GM-Fiat agreement, the 2.2 L engine is also used in

Fiat Croma
Alfa Romeo 159

Originally Posted by whoosh (Post 203945)

that was a good one!
let me find my knee so I can slap it:nana:

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203953)

:banana:


Thats kinda funny that a stock ecotec block can hold 500+ hp but the mazda block that has forged internals cant make it past 300-350. :pat:


how many have blown up bottom ends?

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203927)

Spend 2G's on a gt3071/gt3076/gt3582--expect to spend ~$5000 on a new bottom end within a year...

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203953)

:banana:


Thats kinda funny that a stock ecotec block can hold 500+ hp but the mazda block that has forged internals cant make it past 300-350. :pat:


how many have blown up bottom ends?

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203960)

so where is this coming from then?

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203960)

so where is this coming from then?

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203961)

But how many blocks did different companies blow up to get to that number with the ecotec?? I doubt very much they just hit 500 hp out of the gate with no issues along the way...

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203965)

1 company.....Hahn. no one lese had a turbo kit ( at least at the time) They might have had issues but no blown blocks.

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203965)

what is DCR doing?

Originally Posted by Blackspeed (Post 203965)

I thought I had seen at least 1 manifold? midevil maybe?

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203961)

But how many blocks did different companies blow up to get to that number with the ecotec?? I doubt very much they just hit 500 hp out of the gate with no issues along the way...

Originally Posted by PDXImportRacer (Post 204015)

WOW .. 22k into your Cobalt? I am guessing you took a HUGE hit on that one when you got rid of it.

Originally Posted by Darksun280 (Post 204087)

LOL nah man that was all warranty work. The most my cobalt ever made was 262 whp and ran a 14 flat lol. It was a lemon the dealer tried to buy my car back but I told them if they warranty it no matter how it is when I it get towed in there when i brake it i'll keep it. Bet you they wish they never agreed to that. They had my car for a total of 11 months over a 2 year period. I went 5 months straight in a rental car at 10 dollars a day when they had to replace my transmission axles sub frame all this other shit.

Mind you i put 60 thousand miles on this car in two years 11 of whihc the car was broken and at the dealer. I had 1500 miles on it with in the first 3 days learning to drive stick and in 1 year exact 30 thousand miles. The car fax shows this aswell.

mine was an 05 with a complete 06 interior swaped into it
new trans built from ground up since they had no spare saab trannies back then. Gears 1, 3 and 5 needed to be replaced
new diff since it karate kicked out the side of the trans case
new trans case front and rear.
clutch flywheel
pressure plate
3 axles
5 motor mounts
3 dp with cats
1 mani
1 complete header back system
3 02 sensors
whole knew rebuilt head, valve train (droped 5 valves and 3 lifters), and one exhaust cam since im some how cracked that in half.
new aftertercooler
new aftercooler pump
Needed new piston rings once my oil started to look the color of peanut butter from the coolant mixing in but I decided the cobalt had enough and it now sits in PA where no one is stupid enfough to buy it cause of its mechanical history.

I kept all the dealer shop receipts cause it was was a real work of art.

I'll say this this mazda has EARNED the right to be parted out back to stock for surviving having me as its owner. Beside not being able to make big numbers on this motor i have no real complaints. Cars sturdy as fuck.

Originally Posted by MS6_Auburn_Fan (Post 204095)

WOW I would have never put up with all trouble. You cracked a cam in half that's the first time I've heard of that happening but I guess it's possible

Originally Posted by MS6_Auburn_Fan (Post 204095)

WOW I would have never put up with all trouble. You cracked a cam in half that's the first time I've heard of that happening but I guess it's possible

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 204118)

That was common back when GM liked running the power steering pump off the cam..

Originally Posted by Deadman (Post 203437)

^ you have no idea what your talking about. But whatever you say son.... DI in general has nothing to do with a 400WHP mark. Control of the injectors may actually make some headway for DI on this car (as it has on the VW's) Time will tell

Originally Posted by Darksun280 (Post 204087)

I'll say this this mazda has EARNED the right to be parted out back to stock for surviving having me as its owner. Beside not being able to make big numbers on this motor i have no real complaints. Cars sturdy as fuck.

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203964)

I've been on these different forums from the introduction of this engine in the MS6. I bought my car in Febuary of 06, and since then I have only seen one car with a turbo bigger than a gt28 that didn't blow up. Whoosh's car.

Originally Posted by bf360 (Post 204341)

How many cars with a turbo bigger than a gt30r have blown up?

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 203964)

I've been on these different forums from the introduction of this engine in the MS6. I bought my car in Febuary of 06, and since then I have only seen one car with a turbo bigger than a gt28 that didn't blow up. Whoosh's car.

Originally Posted by Laloosh (Post 204402)

cough:wink1:
2 cars

Originally Posted by whoosh (Post 204409)

true story:bong:

Originally Posted by Darksun280 (Post 204443)

Hey I'm not dead yet.

But I don't count I won't have had it on that long owell.....

Originally Posted by SSinstaller (Post 204370)

I haven't been keeping count, but I can't recall one other than whoosh, that ran a BT for any length of time without blowning up--or recently giving up and going back to stock..

Originally Posted by Smoker6 (Post 204444)

I think that's you. :P

Originally Posted by andre0121 (Post 204493)

actually theres a bt speed6 here that is on stock internals, stock fuel pump, since 2006

Originally Posted by Darksun280 (Post 204443)

Hey I'm not dead yet.

But I don't count I won't have had it on that long owell.....

http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:...bishi-logo.jpg

HOLLA! Whoosh and Loosh looks like I might have a toy to kick you both up and don't the track with this year after all. I'll probably be busting you both up too with only a welded diff and some mud and snow tires.

Originally Posted by palerider (Post 204331)

Need Fueling Solution On Custom GT35RTurbo + Supporting Mods - VW GTI Forum / VW Rabbit Forum / VW R32 Forum / VW Golf Forum - Golfmkv.com

nice little read on my vw board. usp is doing port injection now and has moved on past their low pressure upgrade for the 600whp gti. i think it was unreliable dyno queen, and they are moving on. theyve been posting more and more here ond on vortex about their auxilary system with the custom manifold and secondary injectors.

im telling you. EVERY DI car is gonna end up doing this. they just have too.

Originally Posted by Darksun280 (Post 204443)

Hey I'm not dead yet.

But I don't count I won't have had it on that long owell.....

http://tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:...bishi-logo.jpg

HOLLA! Whoosh and Loosh looks like I might have a toy to kick you both up and don't the track with this year after all. I'll probably be busting you both up too with only a welded diff and some mud and snow tires.