You guys using Amsoil, are you using MTF or MTG?

MTG, get it i swear by this!

Where can one buy the Amsoil mtg???

Right from their website, they even sell hand pumps to make putting it in the hole even easier. ;)

i've used mtg and that other stuff (motorcraft) and without a doubt amsoil is better.

Yeah, I've had this motorcraft stuff in for almost 3000 miles...it's not living up to my expectations. It feels about the same as stock (maybe mildly improved) but it causes my trans and lsd to WHINE like crazy. It's getting annoying, and I'm thinking about switching to the Amsoil.

Edit: anyone know the exact part number for this stuff??

look into the transmission fluid section of amsoil's website. it's the piss colored one.

Just to chime in on all the complaints about LSD noise, you have to add the Ford friction modifier when doing the change. This fluid doesn't have any and the stock fluid did.

:edit:

Found this on BITOG that could be of concern:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums...47#Post1278047

"That fluid, XT-M5-QS, is not GL4. It says it is suitable where GL4 is specified. It is made by Castrol and is not available in the US under the Castrol label.

Ford specifies it for use in the Contour / Mystique / Cougar / Focus MTX75 5 speed manual transaxle. It is very nearly a 10W40 synthetic motor oil but with a very high TBN. Last I knew, Royal Purple cataloged their 10W40 synthetic motor oil as their recommended replacement although many Contour owners use Royal Purple's manual transmission oil instead. XT-M5-QS works especially well in the MTX75 transaxle, but I would be reluctant to use it in other transmissions. It's additive package falls way short of that of other gear oils."

Interesting... You would think there would be some sort of warning on the bottle, maybe being more specific to its intended application then.

But hell, we used to use a concocktion of GM Syncromesh, Redline, and 75w90 dino in our early WRX's. To make them shift smooth.

You cannot just read that one post in isolation, read the whole BITOG thread and get the whole story, including what may be in the bottle.

http://www.opieoils.co.uk/p-739-cast...productDetails
"Castrol SMX-S can be recommended for most manual transmissions where API GL1-4 lubricants are required. It has been used successfully as a problem solver in the manual transmissions of a number of manufacturers.

SAE 75W-85

API GL1-4"

I'm not trying to poke holes in anybodys theory. But how can we be sure the Castrol SMX-S is actually whats in the Motorcraft XT-M5-QS. Because all I am seeing is hear say on those forums. In either direction with the stuff.

For those that have talked about adding LSD additive, the most intelligent and accurate posts I have found about the issue are on another forum:

Mazda Forums - View Single Post 35 - For those that have LSD noise after switching to MT90

Mazda Forums - View Single Post 40 - For those that have LSD noise after switching to MT90

We cant be sure, unless someone wants to do an analysis of both and report back with results.
But it is reported that that Motorcraft oil is made by Castrol.
The motorcraft oil was made for trannies that have shifting problems.
The Castrol SMX-S "has been used successfully as a problem solver in the manual transmissions of a number of manufacturers."

So the theory is that the Motorcraft stuff is repackaged Castrol SMX-S.
The only way to prove it would be an oil analysis of both.

Is it the same?.......Personally...... I dont care either way.
It solved my problem, which was caused by the Mazda/Subie dealer putting some crap in there that made the shifting get worse and worse and worse when they replaced one of my drive shafts. My guess they put some Subie GL-5 stuff in there that was screwing up the syncros.

EDIT: after a little more searching it is definitely not exactly the same, because the viscosity is different. The Motorcraft is 75/90 and the Castrol is 75/85

My main concern is whether or not it's good long-term. Also, if the trans is identical between Gen1 and Gen2 beyond ratios, then it would stand to reason that any lower-viscosity fluid would do the trick and this just happened to be the first someone tried.

I've emailed Mazda asking them about all this to see what input, if any, they'll have.

Haha you just voided your warrentee.

Seriously good luck getting a legitimate response back. They are probably going to tell you theres nothing wrong with the car, just the driver.

Shit I bought this Ford motorcraft stuff but now I'm not so sure I even want to use it. It seems like people are getting better results with Amsoil which is that I used to begin with (it’s good but I think it’s time for another change because I’m at around 47k miles). I guess I’ll try to sell the Ford motorcraft fluid and buy some more Amsoil.

i dont have any problems getting into gears but i have 60k miles and im hearing the diff noise (wah wah wah).what would you guys recommend i use to quiet it down? id like to pick it up on my lunch break tomorrow

the amsoil mtg?

Until further evidence supports the Motorcraft stuff is any better, I'd definitely go Amsoil.

I think the real evidence is from those who have tried both, and it seems that they are leaning towards Amsoil. I just bought some, and if I'm not happy, I'll try the motorcraft and I'll report back here of course.


EDIT: Finally replaced whatever was in my tranny and now the "wah wah" is much louder. Before, I could barely hear it and not very often. Now, it's very noticeable. Transmission seems to be more notchy, but not in a bad way. I haven't had more than a couple minutes driving with it, but so far I don't really see an improvement... it's just different.

First, they told me to use what's specified in the manual.
They also informed me that Mazda makes the transmission themselves.
After calling them out, they told me to ask the dealership. (hah.)
They then sent me to MazdaTechInfo.com.
They said to use what's in the manual.

*facepalm*

Straight GL-4 75W90......... doesnt call for addition of friction modifier.
The Gen2's call for 75W80 IIRC

no no, I know what it calls for. The Motorcraft fluid, from what I've found, is only kind-of GL-4. Either way, the reason people get diff-whine is because the OE fluid has a friction modifier and the Motorcraft stuff doesn't.

At any rate, I'd just like to know if it's really an Aisin BG6 with different ratios among the vehicles. Also, I'd like to see if the 75W-80 would be suitable long-term in the Gen1 to see if it would help the syncros spin-up faster due to less resistance.

how often r u guys swaping tranny fluid?

After having a long discussion with a transmission and axle rebuilder a while back.
He recommended change at 20k miles and then treat it as a lifetime fill.
He said most break-in and wear occurs in the first 20K, so dump that fluid to get the metal particles out, and then that replacement fluid is all you will need.

Will the warranty cover the switch from Gen1 to Gen2 fluid?

put the motorcraft in last weekend and it is pretty good stuff. havent really seen such a dramatic difference in it like some guys are sayin but it is a little better. good enough i would recommend whenever it is time to swap out fluids, but not rush out and buy it on a whim IMHO

i'm uding royal purple in my tranny and its suppoesed to have friction modifiers in it, but it still wines like a bitch and grinds first when cold sometimes. no wonder people are breaking shifters in this car!!!!

I find this interesting. I can't seem to find the maintenance interval for the tranny fluid in our Owner's Manual, but it seems like everyone says to change it out every 30K. Is the 30K interval kinda like how everyone says you need to change out the oil every 3K? Curious to find out out how 30K came about.

Not trying to argue as I plan to change mine out at 30K. I did the same with my WRX when I owned it for six years - changed out the fluid every 30K.

I have a stage 1 short throw shifter with base+ bushings along with the ford fluid and let me tell you...



AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!! =)
It may be Impossible to mis-shift!!! SO SMOOTH AND PRECISE!
MUST HAVEE!!

Everything I've read elsewhere puts the Ford fluid in the Focus transmission category, which is a different trans than we have. That being said, Amsoil is likely better than anything Motorcraft.

Anyone have contact info for Aisin? Let's just ask them. :P

2008 MS3 here and I recently changed to the XT M5 QS Motorcraft fluid at 37000 miles. I have rear and side motor mounts as well as solid shifter bushings and a home made shift plate. I have become used to the constant transmission whine and sloppy shifting although the shifting was somewhat improved by the plate. I was skeptical about the Motorcraft fluid but I can tell you that the improvement with this fluid was immediate and very noticable. The tranny is much quieter now. Shifting has a different feel. It's a subtle difference but it is an improvement. I'll report any changes over time.

Anybody swapped out the transmission fluid in a Gen2? Is this motocraft stuff 75/90? Is there an equivalent motocraft fluid, or would it be better to go with amisol? If you have tried an alternative transmission fluid, have you noticed an improvement?

I'm all about improving the shifting feel in the car, I just don't want to make it worse if the stuff in there is already good.

so do we need to add a friction modifier or not? i read through this whole thread and didn't see any definite answer as to whether we need to add it or not.

No.

don't do that. Long story short...it may diminish the LSD noise, but it will decrease the effectiveness of your transmission's synchros, shortening their life.

Im about to change my trans fluid to the motor craft, hopefully this helps. This may be a stupid question but when i looked up the R & R on all data it said you should replace the plug and washer in the drain and fill hole, is that really necessary?

No.

If by 'replace' you mean buy a brand new one, no.

If by 'replace' you mean 'screw the old one back in the drain hole once i'm done draining', then yes, otherwise things will go very wrong very quickly

Lol I ment by getting a new one but thanks!

So, none of you have bothered to replaced the crush washers? I think they're like a $1 part. I just picked up some of the Motorcraft fluid but am wondering if I should wait till I can get some new washers before draining and refilling.

I didnt replace mine when i did the swap.

Me either; if you do want to replace it you should be able to find one at most any auto parts store.

I was one click away from buying the motorcraft now im second guessing, and considering the amsoil.

Anyone else tried both?
I really want a smoother quieter tranny BUT i DO NOT want the whiney diff.

Anyone running the amsoil having noise problems?

I run the Ford synthetic and the only time I notice any whine is when the fluid is cold and/or I'm making a very sharp turn at parking lot speeds.

i have royal purple in mine now and i get the same result, not much improvement over the stock feel though thats why im switching to the ford fluid.

In my case the feel improved to the point that I found the car to be much more enjoyable to drive.

Subbed for future maintenance

Swapped out the MT-90 for the Motorcraft stuff yesterday. Turns out the dealer who changed the fluid for me last time over-torqued the drain plug, AND forgot to put in the crush washer. Some of the fluid may have leaked out, contributing to my rough shifting. When I poured the used oil back into the containers, I had only a bit more than 2 qts. I moved the crush washer from the fill plug to the drain plug, since I can replace the fill plug washer anytime without losing oil.

Last night, shifting felt the same as with the old MT-90, but today it seems to have improved noticeably. I guess there's some truth in what everyone's saying about it taking a while to for the new oil to work in.

Have you noticed the low speed tight turn "whine"?

alright so i just read this entire thread and im convinced i should give it a try... ive been recently grinding 3rd when flooring it, and the 1st-2nd shift is loud as fuck.

i found the link for the motorcraft shit, but wheres the link for the amsoil one everyone thinks is better...
i dont wanna read the hole shit again.. anyone post the link?
thanks

anyone?

come ON!!!... link for amsoil?

scan through and look for links - they're a different color.

Seriously, it's only 4 pages.

I have it bookmarked on my home computer, but im at work, ill post it later.
I too am torn on amsoil vs motorcraft.
Anyone running the amsoil getting the low speed tight turn diff whine?

I have had the amsoil in for 8K and I don't have any whine or noise problems, but I didn't have any with the OEM either. The Amsoil made my shifting feel marginally better/smoother.
My issue is the resistance I still feel when going into 2nd gear. I wonder if this FORD Focus special GL-4ish would help me slide into 2nd any smoother??
Thanks!!!

its redline mt-90 can be found at streetunit, jsc speed, maybe pg along with ebay and amazon. su was cheapest at the time when i purchased mine about a month ago.

I'd like to see some posts by people who have tried more than one type, so far there seems to be 3 types people like:
Motorcraft
MT-90
Amisol

If anybody has swapped out one for the other, I would love to get your impressions and before/after comparisons.

isnt the amsoil and mt90 the same thing? I looked for amsoil and the redline kept coming up so i assumed they were the same. several places i found the product titled as amsoil but the pic was redline.

I've tried MT-90 and XT-M5-QS. The redline gave me LSD chatter. The Motorcraft does not. Case closed in my book

I'm glad you asked, because I didn't even notice it was gone! I guess it's easier to notice new noises than the absence of old ones. It was always there with the MT-90, but I can't seem to reproduce it with the Motorcraft.

So doing research on the web, there seems to be another fluid that is highly recommended, although I am uncertain as to well it would work with our tranny. It's called GM syncromesh Friction modifier, and people seem to swear by it on other forums. Only thing is they have different trannys and I don't know if we'd necessarily get the same results.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that what you've got there is a *drum roll* fricton modifier and is therefore an additive to transmission fluid, and would not work well if you put only it in the transmission. Plus it probably comes in tiny containers (a few oz). Am I right?

Actually, no - It's a manual transmission oil with friction modifiers put into it at the factory. It comes in quart-sized containers (being the smallest container you can get it in).

Although I did hear about it when I was looking around honda/acura forums IIRC. Could have also been a focus forum, as I've been looking around for the best manual transmission oil available for our transmissions.

edit:
http://halplant.com:2001/images/phot...n_Modified.jpg

Ah, I see - friction modified, not modifier. Gotcha. Well if you want to take a stab at it, go for it. Let us know if it feels smooths or not, and whether or not you get any LSD chatter.

that stuff worked well on my 96 cavalier. I was told that it needed to be rebuilt with 2nd gear and synchro being bad. changed fluid to that and drove it hard for another 60k with no issues ever again. It was a getrag tranny too.

If you read back (im too lazy to go find the quote) but our "cone style" differential does not need or react well to a friction modifier.
The motorcraft or amsoil is all you will need, Adding a friction modifier will not "help" our situation only create a new one.

Any confirmation that mt-90 and amsoil are the same thing? or very similar?

MT-90 is Redline Oil (Manual 75w90 GL 4 Tranny Fluid
MTGQT-EA is AMSOil (Manual 75w90 GL 4 Tranny Fluid)
XT-M5-QS is Motorcraft (Manual 75w90 GL 4 Tranny Fluid) (GL 4 according to their Data Sheet)

None of these are 75w80. The only oil I can find that's 75w80 is Esso. The viscosity #s are all consistent with each other but the Esso #s are a bit lower. Which makes sense given the weight difference.

Redline #s
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 15.6
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 90
Viscosity Index 185

AMSOil #s
Kinematic Viscosity @ 100°C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 14.7
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40°C, cst (ASTM D-445) 84.5
Viscosity Index (ASTM D-2270) 181

Motorcraft #s
Viscosity:
cSt @ 100°C 15.4
cSt @ 40°C 76.0
Viscosity Index 211

Esso #s (Esso Gear Oil BV 75W-80 GL 4)
cSt @ 100°C 8.2
cSt @ 40°C 47.1
Viscosity Index, ASTM D 2270 149

Saw something on another MSF Thread:
Redline 70w80 states on website that it's good for 75w80. Here are the numbers.
Vis @ 100°C, cSt 10.6
Vis @ 40°C, cSt 56.2
Viscosity Index 183

A higher VI is 'better', right?

Stolen from Wikipedia:
Viscosity is a measure of the resistance of a fluid which is being deformed by either shear stress or tensile stress. In everyday terms (and for fluids only), viscosity is "thickness". Thus, water is "thin", having a lower viscosity, while honey is "thick", having a higher viscosity.

Anyone please correct me where I'm wrong here...
Basically the thicker an oil (higher viscosity) the more resistance in the engine/transmission/differential and the thinner an oil (lower viscosity) the less resistance. A higher viscosity imparts more protection to the parts of the component but provides more resistance. Basically as standards have gotten tougher they've been reducing, a bit, the Viscosity recommendations. They are trying to balance proper lubrication of components with MPG, Emissions, etc. This is why some oils make it harder to shift. There's less and less tolerance, and the oil actually gets in the way of the parts working together because they don't flow easily enough.

This is where friction modifiers can play a part. It helps make the oil more slippery so every thing meshes easier and allows for thinner oils to keep parts protected. But friction modifiers aren't always a good idea when you need friction to perform, like a wet-clutch on a motorcycle.

One reason the '10 shifts better is the lower viscosity.
I've asked around if the Gen1 can run GenPu fluid and everyone acts like I'm asking the meaning of life.

The meaning of life.....the universe.....and EVERYTHING....:

"42"

soooo i been reading the whole thread, im guessing some people had good experience with amsoil and others with motorcraft, or depends on the car lol im on 27k 08 with short thrown plate and metal SU bushings. i would ask which fluid i should get but i guess it doesnt matter either one amsoil or motor seems to work fine

edit heres the links

Amsoil http://www.amsoil.com/catalog.aspx?code=MTGQT-EA

Redline http://www.streetunit.com/Redline_MT...p/red50304.htm

Motorcraft http://k-mansparts.com/items/focus/M...5qs-detail.htm

I just replaced my tranny fluid with the Motorcraft fluid, and it feels a lot smoother. I'll post an update once I get a few hundred miles on the new fluid. The install was easy. I found that jacking up the passenger side of the car allowed the fluid to drain easily. I would also recommend removing the plastic cover under the engine to make draining easier.

I seriously didn't not much difference with the Motorcraft, i was actually happy with the OEM stuff. It whines on sharp turns for me but it is a little smoother than the OEM fluid.

One thing that actually improved my shifting was the re-adjustment of the link on the shifter itself, there's a video on youtube and i think it's from the guy that sells the shifter plate.

So I installed the PTP IM gasket last weekend, and ever since then my tranny whine/'wah-wah-wah' at low speeds has been a bit louder. Did a log and noticed my WG was working a bit harder than normal so figured I had a boost leak. Turns out the hose from my OCC onto the IM was kinked when I reinstalled and was indeed leaking. Fixed this up and no more leaks. To my surprise, the tranny noise quieted down quite noticeably. Something in the system must use vacuum to operate? Not sure why else a leak would cause the audible change. Just a heads up as something to check for you guys with a louder tranny.

I've been running MT-90 since 500 miles. It's been said to swap it out at 20k (I'm 24k) to get the crap from break in out, then your set for good, so I have some Amsoil I'll be throwing in this week. I'll comment on my experience with the 2 shortly.

I swapped out the OEM stuff at 7K miles due to a bad 2nd gear grind problem. Put in MT-90 and the grind problem got better but didn't go away. Shifting was improved overall though. Just changed again at 39K miles and put in the Motorcraft stuff this time. 2nd gear still isn't perfect when cold, but the overall shift feel is much improved even over the MT-90. I'll be using the Motorcraft from now on.

I hate to poop all over this thread with my negativity... BUT
I have been following this thread for a while now with the plans of using the motorcraft fluid. And being really optimistic because of all the positive feedback people are giving.
I wanted it mostly because i live in SLC, UT and the winters here are a bitch and cold weather shifting is a joke.

So i finally got my Motorcraft fluid $57 later my tranny feels almost exactly the same as it did with the stock fluid.. Cold shifting feels the same so does warm shifting. I was hoping it would help with my sometimes "crunchy" 1-2 shift but it didn't, if anything it made it worse.

I will propbably either try amsoil in the spring or the BG syncromesh. I used BG in my DSM and it was awesome.

Side note: 2 other local ms3 owners swapped to the same fluid the same day i did, and their thoughts were mixed. But that could just be the placebo effect and hopes that the $57 "upgrade" you just did actually made a difference..

Dissapointed :(

Glad to hear the other side.

If I were to try another oil it would be Redline MT-85 75W85 GL-4 Gear Oil
Or even Redline MTL 70W80 GL-4 Gear Oil
Those may need some friction modifier, but I would try it without first, it is easy enough to add afterward.

Why those fluids?

The 75/85 is recommended in mitsubishi and sentra gearboxes which are very similar to ours. Mitsubishi and Nissan however spec a thinner fluid than Mazda.......... and now Mazda for the gen 2 specs a similarly thinner fluid. Actually, their fluid spec is similar to MTL 70W80 GL-4 Gear Oil which is also listed as an alternative to XT-M5-QS

If you try either let us know how it works out.

The other fluid I would like to try is the Mitsubishi Diaqueen Transmission fluid BUT it is even more expensive than the ford stuff.

^which friction modifier would you use?

Any, it doesnt really matter IMO.
Just try whatever fluid you are trying without FM first.
Then IF needed add the minimum required to make the diff noise acceptable.

how many miles you put on the new fluid. most say that it gets better with time

Only a few hundred.. I drove a good 40-50 miles in one trip and it feels better. I don't know if it has to do with it getting hot or what but it felt fine.
But with my commute only being 6 miles to work and 6 home, it wont get up to that ideal temp so its a bit of a let down. Especially when one of the main reasons i bought it was to improve the cold shifting.
Hopefully it improves because im about to drain it.

I drove all over today Austin and by the time I got home the shifting felt great, not sure how many miles I have put on the new fluid but I am hoping it is getting better with age.

Seems to.. It felt tons better today..

Ill post up again in a couple of days, hopefully with more positive feedback.

i kind of find it weird that it gets better over time.... enlighten me on why this would possibly happen? could it be your just getting used to it?

So I work for Chrysler and we have a 75-80 Full Synthetic M/T Fluid.. What is in the Motorcraft stuff to make it better for our cars than another when they are all synthetic

I would try that Chrysler stuff, especially if you have a Gen2 let us know how it is.

Thanks for this.

Did the tranny oil change yesterday and went with Amsoil.
I hate it. Much worse than stock. LSD whines like crazy accelerating out of tight turns in 1st gear. Gears don't feel smoother engaging at all. On the contrary. Feels like they clonck and grind more. I never really had any major grinding issues on the stock oil. Only did the change as a part of maintenance.
Only have 30 miles after change. Is there are break in period or somthing similar?
I am thinking If it does not get better in another 200 miles I'll change it for something else.

Edit:
09 MS3
25K miles

http://i1211.photobucket.com/albums/...01223-0957.jpg

Go for the XT-M5-QS

yeah, but I've read a few posts in here where people have tried both Amsoil and Motorcraft and they said Amsoil was better. Idk, might try it anyway

I've tried both Amsoil and the Motorcraft stuff I would say the Motorcraft works better for the transmission. However I use Amsoil for the motor.

Im still not enjoying any benifit at all from the motorcraft.. I changed it because my car has 48k, if it doesn't improve with warmer weather i will be going back to stock oil.
I had zero problems with stock oil and now i have a crunchy second gear.. Not awesome.

I ordered some motorcraft and will change the amsoil for it. Post to follow.
Will keep the amsoil in a container after draining just in case I want to put it back.

The amsoil has gotten a little better after 200 miles.

first trans fluid change at 30k miles to redline and now at 67k with no problem whatsoever....wonder why other ms3 trans would have problems, would not change to anything else until redline fails lol, if other trans fluid work for you stay with that brand

I've still got some redline sitting around, I might give that a shot and see if it helps.

Any consensus as to when to change the tranny fluid? Or is what FFF posted a good enough interval?

15k miles max from 0 miles, i would say every 30k miles after that.

So I am new here and I am too stupid to figure out how to post a new thread. I do not actually own a mazdaspeed3, however I am installing the same transmission that the ms3 has in my automatic car as a project. I would like to know what you guys are at RPM wise while traveling 65 mph. Thanks!

luckily no problems just whine since day one