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 Old 06-01-2011, 12:07 PM   #1
 
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Default Rear diff locks while turning after SURE diff mount and brace install

Hello,

I just installed the SURE rear differential mount and brace on my MS6. After the install i noticed that if i stop the car, turn the wheel all the way to the right and slowly pull out the right rear wheel will cease, almost as if the brake was engaged on it, and then it lets go. Same thing will happen to the left rear wheel if i go left. Me and my mechanic had a look but we couldn't find anything wrong, we did not open the diff, we dropped the whole bottom to install the parts.

Any suggestions? I'm afraid if i take it to Mazda they will blame the SURE parts, which I'm sure are not the cause of the problem.

Thanks.

Last edited by wettoast; 06-01-2011 at 01:16 PM.
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 Old 06-01-2011, 01:01 PM   #2
 
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whhaaaaa!?
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 Old 06-01-2011, 01:03 PM   #3
 
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wtf does the rear mou nt have to do with the front wheel
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 Old 06-01-2011, 01:18 PM   #4
 
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Originally Posted by jroc View Post
wtf does the rear mou nt have to do with the front wheel

Sorry, brain fart, did not specify that its the REAR wheel thats locking up.
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 Old 06-02-2011, 08:33 AM   #5
 
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completely unrelated unless you bolted it up wrong. Mounts only hold the diff up, not how they operate.
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 Old 06-02-2011, 10:20 AM   #6
 
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Originally Posted by Boostlag View Post
completely unrelated unless you bolted it up wrong. Mounts only hold the diff up, not how they operate.
Exactly, i even watched the mechanic do the work, that is why i am confused, because it was not doing this before the work was done.

Originally Posted by Angr-E1 View Post
Something might be wrong with the gears in the rear diff. Drain the diff fluid and check for metal shavings.
We actually did change the oil, didn't specifically look for any debris, but the oil that drained was clean.

I ended up taking the car to Mazdas stealership as the drivetrain is still on warranty, they looked at it for 15min and said they were not sure what was wrong. However they suspected it may be because the tread on my front tires is deeper than on the rear tires.

I did some research and indeed AWD vehicles require all wheel to be the same circumference, or such problems can be experienced. Whether this is the case here, and what the actual tolerance is, is unknown to me at this point. I will buy new tires as these are pretty worn and see if the problem goes away.

Thanks.

Last edited by wettoast; 06-02-2011 at 10:21 AM. Reason: MSF Database - Automerged Doublepost
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 Old 06-02-2011, 10:25 AM   #7
 
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What? I know the tires need to be pretty close, but I don't think it would causing a wheel to lock up...that doesn't sound right....
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 Old 06-02-2011, 10:32 AM   #8
 
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You should rotate your tires and see if that sorts anything out.
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 Old 06-02-2011, 10:37 AM   #9
 
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 Old 06-02-2011, 11:26 AM   #10
 
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Damn triplejumper18, what caused that to happen?
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 Old 06-02-2011, 12:15 PM   #11
 
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......wow, you didnt get the joke. Tha picture is called internet joke.

Front diff is open, rear diff is limited slip. Meaning as long as the tires on the rear are the same, it doesnt matter too much on the front tire tread depth.

What fluid did you refill with?
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 Old 06-02-2011, 12:34 PM   #12
 
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Originally Posted by jroc View Post
......wow, you didnt get the joke. Tha picture is called internet joke.

Front diff is open, rear diff is limited slip. Meaning as long as the tires on the rear are the same, it doesnt matter too much on the front tire tread depth.

What fluid did you refill with?
Doh, no i did not get the joke

This is very useful information, thank you very much, i will call the stealership with this info and see what they say.

As for the oil, i don't remember the brand, some sort of synthetic LSD oil, the mechanic called Mazda to check whats required though.
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 Old 06-02-2011, 12:41 PM   #13
 
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Im not sure but, i think the rear diff requires no FM in the oil? Im just shooting this off the top of my head, but if your oil has FMs, it could be causing the rear end to bind. I would at least figure out what was actually put in, and do some quick research about people using the same stuff. Although, i was under the impression that the rear end doesnt even engage without traction loss, due to the electric clutch pack, so if your just slowly turning and the rear end is binding, i would def look at the oil put in. I believe Redline 75w-90 is a good oil for the Tcase and rear end. No FM
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 Old 06-02-2011, 12:53 PM   #14
 
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Originally Posted by ccspeedsix View Post
Im not sure but, i think the rear diff requires no FM in the oil? Im just shooting this off the top of my head, but if your oil has FMs, it could be causing the rear end to bind. I would at least figure out what was actually put in, and do some quick research about people using the same stuff. Although, i was under the impression that the rear end doesnt even engage without traction loss, due to the electric clutch pack, so if your just slowly turning and the rear end is binding, i would def look at the oil put in. I believe Redline 75w-90 is a good oil for the Tcase and rear end. No FM

If FM is what i think it is, some sort of additive, then we did not add any. The oil weight sounds correct. To be clear the problem was present before the oil change, we changed it to troubleshoot the problem but it remains.

Just called Mazda, regardless of what i told them about the front open and rear slip diff, they say that all wheels must turn at the same speed so that the computer is not confused.... sigh.

In any case, i do need new tries, so i will buy some as soon as i can and see what happens. I'll update this thread once i get them.

Ty for the feedback guys.
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 Old 06-02-2011, 12:56 PM   #15
 
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FM is friction modifier. But if the problem persisted prior, then ensure you didnt overfill the diff. I dont remember if the rear end is a torsen LSD or VLSD. If it is a VLSD, then overfilling the oil will cause it to bind, as the oil is what makes it lock.
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 Old 06-02-2011, 12:57 PM   #16
 
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 Old 06-02-2011, 01:02 PM   #17
 
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Originally Posted by wettoast View Post
If FM is what i think it is, some sort of additive, then we did not add any. The oil weight sounds correct. To be clear the problem was present before the oil change, we changed it to troubleshoot the problem but it remains.

Just called Mazda, regardless of what i told them about the front open and rear slip diff, they say that all wheels must turn at the same speed so that the computer is not confused.... sigh.

In any case, i do need new tries, so i will buy some as soon as i can and see what happens. I'll update this thread once i get them.

Ty for the feedback guys.
You realize if all wheels are supposed to turn at the same speed, you wouldnt be able to turn. Think about it. Imagine a tank turning.

Your dealer is retarded.

Not to mention the computer has nothing to do with wheels turning (mechanically speaking)
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 Old 06-02-2011, 01:08 PM   #18
 
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Originally Posted by jroc View Post
You realize if all wheels are supposed to turn at the same speed, you wouldnt be able to turn. Think about it. Imagine a tank turning.

Your dealer is retarded.

Not to mention the computer has nothing to do with wheels turning (mechanically speaking)
No argument there, I've tried many in my area, this one is the least retarded.

Not much i can do though, luckily i do need new tires so may as well change them and go from there.
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 Old 06-03-2011, 09:16 AM   #19
 
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So i bought 4 new tires yesterday, and of course the problem is still there. Went to the stealership this morning. Now they are saying that my previous tires may have caused damage on the diff (lol). In any case the guy said he needs to check with Mazda but they most likely will replace the diff. I'm surprised they didn't mention anything about my mounts, their mechanics must be blind. But hey, if they give me a new diff on warranty, ill be happy.
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 Old 06-03-2011, 10:35 AM   #20
 
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Most dealerships do not really care if the mounts get changed out because. 9 of 10 mounts just hold shit in place. they really have no other function then that.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 11:26 AM   #21
 
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* UPDATE *

So after a few weeks dealing with the Mazda dealership i am still having this issue. Mazda has replaced the whole rear differential, it still locks during tight turns. They have no clue as to whats causing this.

At this point i seriously regret installing the SURE mounts and brace, the original parts were actually just fine, nothing was cracked, no sheered blots. Sigh.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 12:54 PM   #22
 
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try disconnecting the wheel speed sensors, and plug on rear diff. See if still occurs. Also is it possible you binded up the e brake cables when doing the install?
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 Old 06-24-2011, 12:57 PM   #23
 
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Originally Posted by laxplayermjd View Post
try disconnecting the wheel speed sensors, and plug on rear diff. See if still occurs. Also is it possible you binded up the e brake cables when doing the install?
I'll pass that info over to the mechanic, thanks!
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 Old 06-24-2011, 10:25 PM   #24
 
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Sorry, but there's just no way the mounts are causing this. They are completely external and do NOT cause any modification to the diff or the way it works. My guess is that you did something wrong putting shit back together, but since Mazda put a whole new diff on there, that seems less likely.

But if you really think it's the mounts, return to stock.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 10:36 PM   #25
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I'm guessing that some damage may have occurred on the electrical connectors for the diff during the install. Could also have to do with the yaw and wheel speed sensors too.

How where the mounts installed? Was the whole rear subframe dropped, or just the diff lowered?
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 Old 06-25-2011, 06:10 AM   #26
 
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Originally Posted by Stealth01 View Post
Sorry, but there's just no way the mounts are causing this. They are completely external and do NOT cause any modification to the diff or the way it works. My guess is that you did something wrong putting shit back together, but since Mazda put a whole new diff on there, that seems less likely.

But if you really think it's the mounts, return to stock.
I agree .. It can't be the mounts .
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 Old 06-25-2011, 07:14 AM   #27
 
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Originally Posted by jracer View Post
I agree .. It can't be the mounts .
Especially since the dealership would have said so, if they were installed wrong. Has to be electronic.
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 Old 05-28-2012, 12:55 PM   #28
 
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I would really like to hear what the cause is because I am experiencing the same problems. Especially if I drive the car for long distances and then its almost every turn. It's worse backing out of parking spaces. I still have stock mounts and I haven't changed the oil yet. The fucking dealership told me it was loose sway bar brushing which ironically temporarily reduced it. Please update with results.


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 Old 06-03-2012, 07:34 PM   #29
 
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Realized its more than likely my diff fluid. Hopefully. Going to buy some Redline and see if it goes away. Was going around the corkskrew thing to get to the top of a parking garage and thought I was gonna blow it out then.

Edit! This thread is old!

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 Old 07-01-2012, 05:33 PM   #30
 
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Shortly after I bought my car I took it around a corner too fast and the back end slid out hitting a curb on the drivers rear. They replaced a bunch of shit on that side but did not do anything with the diff. About 10k miles later I had some noises (honestly do not remember what kind as it was 85k miles ago) and brought the car into my local mechanic and he drained the diff and pulled out a huge chunk of clutch plate. So thinking this was probably the cause of my diff issues I had Mazda replace the diff. (which it was) They did and the EXACT same issues you are talking about happened. Backing out of a spot to the left or right would cause the left or right rear wheel/tire to bind so much that it would NOT MOVE and the car would drag the tire across the pavement for a second and then release. I brought it back to mazda and they replaced the diff again....... To this day I still have the issue but not nearly as bad and not nearly as often. Only when the steering wheel is at full lock and backing out will I sometimes have this problem. Definitely makes me concerned about installing those diff mounts now. Obviously I didn't help much with your problem, but just wanted you to know you aren't alone in it.
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 Old 07-03-2012, 12:26 AM   #31
 
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Highly doubt Diff mounts are the issue, a possible explanation for the Maintanance issue involving stock parts just being serviced or replaced, maybe at some point Mazda revised a part number/Changed an existing censor that most dealers are otherwise obliviose to, seeing as Mazdas known for doing that, As for the op, I'd say check your Pig tail and Wheel speed censors, and as mentioned Examin your Brake cable for the hand brake as well, Since noone seems to have an answer to the issue, I'd say:


1. start researcjing part numbers to see if theres any changes in 06/07 models (Censors, diffs, wheels speed indicators, ect..)

2. examine EVERYTHING under the rear, starting with things you know were touched/moved/loosened

3. Get all 4 wheels off the ground (Lift or stands) and try to replicate problem with the wheels in the air and see whats going on first hand and whats hold the rear wheel that locks, so you can watch and see it and rule out brake cables binding and any other exsterior interfearance, that would tell you atleast if whether or not its internal (in the Diff)
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 Old 06-10-2013, 04:55 AM   #32
 
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Bumpage - old thread i know, but im having same problems exactly less the mounts installed - Its happening every time in a car park. really pissing me off, any further ideas why it would do it while turning only? taken it to various mechanics and no idea from them.
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 Old 06-10-2013, 05:36 AM   #33
 
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Would any lights on the dash come on if you messed up the rear diff eletrical connections?

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 Old 06-10-2013, 05:45 AM   #34
 
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Nope not at all, it would just lock up while engaging clutch, when clutch is fully engaged it doesn't do it. And only happens when turning at speeds of say 0-5km/h or 0-3mp/h
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 Old 06-10-2013, 06:56 AM   #35
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Did you change your fluids like people above did?
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 Old 06-10-2013, 07:03 AM   #36
 
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Have not changed fluid yet, also confused is the diff supposed to be filled up completely or not? Also judging by the others changing fluid didn't help
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 Old 06-10-2013, 07:04 AM   #37
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You need to do some reading.
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 Old 04-05-2015, 05:22 PM   #38
 
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So I might have a little more insight into this issue. Let me just run down what has happened first.

All fluid was filled properly and checked and has no metal shavings or chunks in it.

So a few weeks ago my car after some mildly aggressive driving started to drag the rear wheel around sharp corners and while backing up. You can feel the drivetrain binding and needing the pressure to be released from the wheels. I thought oh crap, the differential went out. I got a used rear end locally from a wrecked MS6 and figured I would just swap the whole thing so I don't have deal with seals and what not.

I swap the rear end out and drive the car, no binding anymore no real wheel dragging. I thought I had fixed the problem. Step on around a corner and notice I have torque steer. That's a first for the car, get on it a few more times and can now spin the front wheels. After a bit of this a realize I have little to no power going to my rear wheels. Check my connections and everything looks solid so I figure damnit, the coupler from the used rear end I got must be bad.

I swap out the coupler (PTO?) on the used rear end for the one that is originally on my car. So now the car has the new(used) differential and the original coupler on it. Go to back out of the driveway and guess what, it binds again just like it did originally. I am a slight bit upset about this, tried the one click on the e brake and it doesn't change anything. I disconnect the electrical connectors on the coupler and nothing changes. I drive without it hooked up around some hard corners with some gas and no torque steer and no front wheel hop.

My car is in Full time AWD mode and the coupler is seized ON. I thinking this is why the wheels hop is with the coupler locked, there has no way to release the rotational differences between front and rear which happen around sharp corners.


Now is there a way to test other coupler I have or the voltage coming out of the connector to see if I have an electrical issue or two bad couplers. I know the one that is seized on is a lost cause.
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 Old 04-05-2015, 11:49 PM   #39
 
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Hey guys I just wanted to give feedback on what my issue was, as explained it would bind on low speed sharp corners in parking lots ect.

In the end it was the rear drivers side and sensor - didn't throw a code but it would not register 0-5mph then flick to 6+mph once moving. Hope this helps some of you
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 Old 04-13-2015, 04:25 AM   #40
 
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Turns out it was a locked coupler in my case. I whacked it with a 4lb hammer a few times and it managed to release. Now it drives fine.
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