register gallery
 

Go Back   Mazdaspeed Forums >
MAZDASPEED SECTION
>
Mazdaspeed 3/6 MZR Gen1 Forums (2006-2009)
> MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Turbo Induction

MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Turbo Induction MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Turbo Induction - Have a turbo, intercooler, downpipe question? Anything turbo related belongs here!


Welcome to Mazdaspeed Forums .

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions and access our other features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload content and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact contact us.

*When you join MSF as a registered user, there will be No Ads.

*Registered Members get access to the Off Topic Area of the Forum

*Registered Members have an opportunity to upgrade their accounts to VIP, which brings a host of goddies for supporting MSF such as Raffles, Additional Forum Access, More PM Storage, The ability to upload more Images and many other enhancements.

*Registered members also get access to the live chat box!
Like Tree8Likes
Reply
 
Bookmark and Share LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 Old 11-11-2014, 09:36 AM   #41
Trail of Fail
 
Dano's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: rock city AR
Posts: 9,484   (View Stats)
iTrader: (2)
Rep Power: 9905
Dano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the worldDano is the leader of the world
Thanks: 10,493
Thanked 19,250 Times in 6,532 Posts
Groans: 37
Groaned at 25 Times in 22 Posts
(Thread Starter)
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

FYI from the other thread. ATP/Garrett Hate - failure GTX3076

Originally Posted by Dano View Post
...

12pk runs some sort of restrictor purchased from ATP but I have no idea exactly what it is nor W(hy)TF ATP doesn't ship their kits with said restrictor if its necessary.



if his kit is like mine then its the non restrictive banjo bolt pictured on the far left which is damn near the same size as an OEM (K04) bolt. He indicates a much smaller orifice size when measured compared to a fully open bolt. Perhaps he is measuring the side port(s) IDK.

soooo LSS (Long Story Short) I don't have an answer I am confident in giving at this point. I am currently running the middle restrictor pictured in my other post.

Originally Posted by cld12pk2go View Post
IIRC from 3.5 years ago, the 0.090'' orifice I mentioned on my banjo bolt that came with my ATP kit was the size of the side hole, not the bottom hole. I believe the bottom was considerably larger.
Originally Posted by Dano View Post
ahhh ha! Now it think we are getting somewhere. The bolt with the largest hole in my pic is from ATP, I now have 2 just like it. One that came with my GT28 and the new GTX30.

AFAIK the side holes are all the same size on a banjo bolt (At least they are on the 2 ATP bolts, 2 ebay bolts, and both ends of the OEM feed line which are banjo on both ends) and its the bottom hole that provides the "reverenced" restriction.

So until more information may prove otherwise, in my mind you are not running an external restrictor.

I'm going to cross post this in the failure thread.

Thanks for the clarification.
So I am pulling the middle "restrictor" bolt out and going with the "open" bolt that comes with the ATP kit. I still don't know what any "official" answer or best practice would be regarding running a restrictor.
__________________



07 Red MS3 GT - E40 - Carrillo Rods - Wiseco Pistons - BSD - JBR 3.5 WidePath - ATP GTX3071 - Forge BPV - GA - Cobb v2 FMIC - CPE EM - CPE DP - CNT CBE - APv3 - Grim EBC - PERM dual port PCV plate - Dano dual OCC - CPE CDFP - Labonte S2 WMI - ACT Street Kit - SUv2 RMM - SU TM - "Stiffy" MM - DG CF wing ext, skirts & front lip - Hotchkis RSB/FSB w PowerGrid Links - Koni FSDs - DBA SX4000 Rotors - Hawk Pads - Silver OZ Ultraleggera - 235/40/18 NT-01
Dano is offline   Reply With Quote
 Old 11-24-2014, 11:02 AM   #42
 
ricardo_yen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: South Africa
Posts: 27   (View Stats)
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
ricardo_yen will become famous soon enough
Thanks: 3
Thanked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

Hi just to post my fail,

Gtx3071
No restrictor
Under 3000kms
Bearing collapsed, shaft broke, both blades damaged,
No recursive action, as the local distributor of Garrett claims it's user error, they can replace chra at a cost
Upgrading to a kamak tdo6sl2 gtx25 with sts 9 blade wheel.... Journal bearing turbos are less finicky than the ball bearing turbos,
ricardo_yen is offline   Reply With Quote
 Old 01-18-2015, 07:45 AM   #43
 
Plimmer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: San Antonio, TX
Posts: 695   (View Stats)
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
Plimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the worldPlimmer is the leader of the world
Thanks: 683
Thanked 944 Times in 467 Posts
Groans: 0
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

OK, I've just joined this club:

Turbo type: ATP GTX3071r
Restrictor used: None found.
Failure Mode: CHRA bearing failure
Oil feed line used: OE
Oil return line used and if modified for length: ATP
Vendor Purchased from: Don't know, local speed shop did work.
Answer/resolution from vendor or manufacturer: Response from ATP below:
"Please note for inspection time, this may take 2-3 weeks to complete. Fee is $50.00.
If you rather skip inspection, we can process the CHRA through the BB service program and cost is $742.74.
If full complete turbo is shipped into us, please factor $100.00 for labor fee."

Symptoms: No boost and obvious bearing noise and play
Turbo mileage: Approx 20,000 miles
Turbo failure after blown motor: No

This thread has a lot of discussion on oil restrictors and feed etc, but what about cooling? I've noticed that my set up is the typical ATP setup where the hot coolant outlet banjo points down before making its way to the EGR nipple.

BUT if you go to the Garrett site:
http://www.turbobygarrett.com/turbob...er_Cooling.pdf
they clearly show how important it is to have the water outlet pointing upward to allow thermal siphoning.

Therefore maybe we are overheating our bearings because no cooling versus in adequate lube.

Either way, when i put my new CHRA in I'm going to ensure I have it installed exactly as described in the Garrett whitepaper.

Update: Not going to pay the $50 inspection fee to hear them tell me insufficient oil or cooling. My own close inspection of the CHRA seems there is plenty oil in the bearings and the shaft does not appear blue from over heating. Just a fail after 20,000 miles. Hopefully my new CHRA will have better engineered bearings and last a little longer.
__________________
Was: 2012 with GTX3071 and BF Goodrich g-Force Rivals
Now: 2015 Mustang GT 5.0, soon to be track toy

Last edited by Plimmer; 01-27-2015 at 06:11 AM. Reason: Update facts
Plimmer is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Plimmer For This Useful Post:
GrumpyMPS (02-25-2015), meicalnissyen (03-23-2015), Revmatch (02-16-2015)
 Old 03-24-2015, 07:11 PM   #44
 
meicalnissyen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 1,158   (View Stats)
iTrader: (4)
Rep Power: 0
meicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the world
Thanks: 503
Thanked 397 Times in 255 Posts
Groans: 9
Groaned at 8 Times in 8 Posts
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

HELL TO THE YEAH!

THIS IS THE BEST OPTION FOR RETURN FLOW

15 a foot at napa

Needed 4 inches
But no kinks, correct length
Full bore from chra to block

Originally Posted by jdmage_mx5 View Post
I think this is a good thread idea to cover GT and GTX failures. So bump bump. @Dano; I know you have a recent failure also.

Turbo type:GTX3071r
Restrictor used: no restrictor using Garrett Turbo BB low profile banjo bolt
Failure Mode: CHRA bearing failure
Oil feed line used: OEM
Oil return line used and if modified for length: OEM modified (cut accordion section out and installed 5/8" steel braided hose to allow better flex.
Vendor Purchased from: original owner purchased from ATP
Answer/resolution from vendor or manufacturer: CHRA exchange with ATP for $742.49
Symptoms: nails on chalkboard sound when turbo experienced any load.
Turbo mileage: 20,000-30,000 miles between two owners
Turbo failure after blown motor: no

I did have some compressor wheel to housing contact. There were some brazing marks on the housing but I was able to smooth it out with some 2000 grit wet sand paper.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 2015-03-24 21.10.04.jpg (1.00 MB, 22 views)
__________________
A democracy, in its purest form, is well represented by a group consisting of 2 wolves and 1 rabbit. Voting on what to have for lunch
meicalnissyen is offline   Reply With Quote
 Old 03-24-2015, 07:23 PM   #45
 
meicalnissyen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 1,158   (View Stats)
iTrader: (4)
Rep Power: 0
meicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the worldmeicalnissyen is the leader of the world
Thanks: 503
Thanked 397 Times in 255 Posts
Groans: 9
Groaned at 8 Times in 8 Posts
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

Oh, and that cat that found the white paper, referring to the 20 degree pitch for coolant flow.

I'm down with that

In spades

I'm learning in a very steep curve that ATP is nothing more than a vendor, making a hotside casting, specific to the mzr flange

Thats about it

Mine was not set to garrett's 20 degree spec (fixed)
No support bracket (fixed)
No heater pipe bracket (fixed)
Comprimised return line (fixed)
Dodgy coolant feed line ( not sure if this will be used or not, proly not) {not}
Shit mechanical geometry on the WG actuator (still chewing on that, may just bolt up the oem, may get a forge actuator, may bend the arm, and fab a bracket)


I'll edit will pics when the lappttoopp arrives tommorow
__________________
A democracy, in its purest form, is well represented by a group consisting of 2 wolves and 1 rabbit. Voting on what to have for lunch

Last edited by meicalnissyen; 03-24-2015 at 07:42 PM.
meicalnissyen is offline   Reply With Quote
 Old 03-24-2015, 08:26 PM   #46
 
Polish_Eagle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Cambridge, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 406   (View Stats)
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
Polish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the worldPolish_Eagle is the leader of the world
Thanks: 138
Thanked 215 Times in 119 Posts
Groans: 3
Groaned at 1 Time in 1 Post
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

According to the service manual, when the oil is 212 degrees Fahrenheit, the oil pressure in the system is 43.1 PSI - 79.9 PSI.
__________________
2011 MAZDASPEED3 Hypnotic Tuned - Rob
CPE HPFP - CPE Catted Downpipe - CPE Catback Exhaust - 3" ETS TMIC - Cobb RMM - AEM Boost Gauge & Vent Pod - CANBus Triple - Corksport BPV - Corksport hood strut - Corksport RSB - Corksport Short Shifter - HTP 3.5" Intake - Damond TMM - Damond Vented CC - Vented Oil Cap - Tokay v2 Seals - GTX3067R - Damond PCV Plate - Built Engine (Manley Rods, 88mm Supertech 4032 Piston) -
Polish_Eagle is offline   Reply With Quote
 Old 05-14-2015, 10:48 AM   #47
 
Jeff23spl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Quebec
Posts: 2,192   (View Stats)
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
Jeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the worldJeff23spl is the leader of the world
Thanks: 160
Thanked 585 Times in 467 Posts
Groans: 3
Groaned at 2 Times in 2 Posts
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

ATP GT2871R
blown seal/bearings
Stock oil feed and banjo bolt
Stock return
Stock cooling feed
custom coolant return with home-depot solid pipes and 90deg

Bought it blown to rebuild, it was seriously burning oil. It didn't ran for long on the previous owner speed. Probably 1 year or less.
I have it serviced with a brand new genuine CHRA...(BB aren't supposed to be rebuilded, i learned it!!!!it was more expensive than expected...)
Then i fond a lot of trapped dust inside the supplyed TIH like if the intake/filter was leaking.
The TIH was provided with a 2'' reducer to fit the mazdaspeed accessory CAI and use one of the oem coupler!!!
I tried this install with the brand new CHRA and i noticed a strange noise when the turbo start spooling. A noise that i think is a surge sound because as soon as i upgraded the intake for a 3.25'', that noise disapear and the response get way better...

I really think it was surging a lot and after a while the thrust on the bearings went away and it destroyed the seals...
__________________
Mazda for life...or until i can afford something better...

2007 rusted Speed6... Forged with meth and a 3076 in progress...
1993 Ford Probe KLZE 143dB
2012 Mazda3 Gs-sky 6.5l/100 when transporting speed parts
1989 GM 6.2 diesel pickup
Wife drive 2010 CX7

2007 speed3 burned (i'm proud to ran 12.7s with it)

...Because French Canadian...

If you check for leaks and you didn't made a test under compressor pressure, you aren't done checking for leaks....
Jeff23spl is offline   Reply With Quote
 Old 08-13-2015, 02:59 PM   #48
 
taf0422's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Andover, MA
Posts: 4,689   (View Stats)
iTrader: (0)
Rep Power: 0
taf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the worldtaf0422 is the leader of the world
Thanks: 17,936
Thanked 4,709 Times in 2,017 Posts
Groans: 192
Groaned at 24 Times in 20 Posts
Not Ranked  0 score     
Default

I just got this reply on my GTX warranty. Started blowing through quarts of oil within 2k miles.

"We did complete the inspection and testing on your turbo unit.

What we found was that the unit is 100% good and is per factory spec.

The ball bearing turbos are more sensitive to the breather/PCV/oil drain issues than the journal bearing BNR unit that you're running now.

I'm going to have to make a couple of installation changes and you will see the issue go away on your car:

1. I'm going to recalibrate the oil supply port at the turbo.
2. I'm going to send you a NEW banjo bolt to use at the oil feed port on your turbo. If you still have the old one, please throw it away."
__________________
precision gen2 5862 coming soon

[SIZE="1"]07 MS3 GT..
Engine:Cobb V3,GTX3076r EWG,Wiseco Pistons/Manley Rods, L19's,JMF, Bosch 3.5bar MAP,CS cat-back,M2 DP, full race manifold,FP internals,FREEK 4",CP-E flange HKS,DO Stage II ss lines,Cobb piping,TR8L,MD RMM&TMM,JBR RSB & FSB,JBR SST,JBR knob,ACT 6puck,JBR EGR delete,CPE Seals,Grimmspeed EBC,JBR BSD,MD Catch Can.Looks:yellow lamin-x fogs,chrome turn signals,side moldings removed,20% tint,CS wheelSuspension/Wheels:Enkei RPF1 17x9,Eibach 5mm spaces H&R springs,koni yellows.

GTX3076r --- 479/412
S4-460/400
Highest HP BNR S3
BNR-S3 424/397
taf0422 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Garrett m33 turbo skiptowncat MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Turbo Induction 9 08-14-2012 03:41 PM
Who DOESN'T run a Garrett turbo Ezekiel81923 2010 MS3 - Turbo Induction 138 08-02-2012 05:20 PM
GARRETT 3" Turbo Inlet Pipe Kit Blackedout1978 2010 MS3 - Turbo Induction 3 03-13-2012 01:51 PM
Failed Thread essejkcamraw MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Fuel, Nitrous & Water Injection 57 11-17-2010 11:16 AM


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:46 PM.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
SEO by vBSEO ©2011, Crawlability, Inc.
vB.Sponsors
Template-Modifications by TMS
©Copyright 2008 ; 2019 Cymru Internet Services LLC | FYHN™ Autosports HQ
Ad Management plugin by RedTyger
Page generated in 0.30438 seconds with 27 queries