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MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Troubleshoot/Diagnostics MazdaSpeed 3/6 - Troubleshoot/Diagnostics - Have a problem with the car? CEL Code? Want to discuss other issues? Come on in!


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 Old 03-16-2014, 02:09 PM   #1
 
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Default Car Fell on Jackstand, VVT Shot

Well, at the last NATOR meet I was putting my car down and missed a random jackstand sitting right under the oil filter housing. Luckily one of the guys had one so I went and picked it up. Thanks @captain slow;

Now I just checked my timing chain last week and it had no slack. As I was filling the oil last night, I checked the chain for the hell of it. There's like 1/2" of slack! It literally feels like the chain is about to fall off. I started the car just to see if when it warmed up it would tighten itself back to normal. No luck, but it didn't sound like it was slapping the VC when I did this, which is weird. With 1/2" of slack it should be destroying the VC, if not falling off the actuator. So obviously I am going to need to replace the VVT, but I'm wondering what could've caused this? I don't want to replace the VVT only to find more problems. The only other 2 factors I can think of are that:

1. I just got fully mounted on Friday and when I went to move the grounding cable for the PMM I pulled the wrong 8mm bolt in the timing cover, replaced it, and then pulled the correct one. The I tied the ground strap to that.

2. I've been running e85 being tuned by @rfinkle2; and possibly the VVT was weak and ready to go, and just needed that extra push from the increased timing.

I'm going to be pulling the valve cover tonight to see what's up. Any ideas as to what happened?
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 Old 03-16-2014, 02:50 PM   #2
 
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Is that typical of a bad VVT? Seems like it might be the chain tensioner didn't get set back to tenstioning?
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:05 PM   #3
 
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Originally Posted by sheston View Post
Is that typical of a bad VVT? Seems like it might be the chain tensioner didn't get set back to tenstioning?

Well typically it will go much more gradually. Not just in a week. And usually it will clack against the valve cover. That's what the weird parts are.


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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:08 PM   #4
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A slacked chain has almost nothing to do with a bad VVT.
Chain tension needs to be checked with cylinder 1 at tdc.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:11 PM   #5
 
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Originally Posted by Tokay444 View Post
A slacked chain has almost nothing to do with a bad VVT.
Chain tension needs to be checked with cylinder 1 at tdc.

Thanks Brock. What will I need to fix this then? Tensioner? Am I going to need to replace the whole VVT system? If I do, I'll have to order the kit from edge Monday and hope it gets here Wednesday because that's my only day off.


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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:14 PM   #6
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First set the car at tdc for cylinder 1 and check tension.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:15 PM   #7
 
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Originally Posted by Tokay444 View Post
First set the car at tdc for cylinder 1 and check tension.
I'm not by the car right now. I will be able to when I get home tonight, but that won't be for probably another 4-5 hours.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:17 PM   #8
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Ok.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:23 PM   #9
 
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@Tokay444; What am I looking for if there is/isn't tension? Sorry, I really know almost nothing when it comes to timing. If anybody had a link to a crash course of how the system works that would be awesome. I'm having trouble finding anything. It seems almost all of my search results end up being VVT related, probably because of the mass of VVT problems.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:53 PM   #10
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If the chain is tight at cyl 1 tdc then you don't have a stretched chain or broken tensioner.
The VVT won't have anything to do with chain tension unless it doesn't lock. In which case you would be hearing the notorious clack clack clack clack clack at cold start.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 03:54 PM   #11
 
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Originally Posted by Tokay444 View Post
If the chain is tight at cyl 1 tdc then you don't have a stretched chain or broken tensioner.
The VVT won't have anything to do with chain tension unless it doesn't lock. In which case you would be hearing the notorious clack clack clack clack clack at cold start.

Ok thanks. Is 1/2" slack normal really at any point in the cycle? As how much play on a warm engine should there be at tdc on cylinder 1? Ideally it would be pretty much none, correct?


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 Old 03-16-2014, 04:25 PM   #12
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Yes. It should be taut at tdc, but the tensioner works off of oil pressure.
No oil flow. No tension.
And there are parts of the engines rotation where depending on the cam postions, there will be slack between the gears, if the motor isn't running.
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 Old 03-16-2014, 04:26 PM   #13
 
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Originally Posted by Tokay444 View Post
Yes. It should be taut at tdc, but the tensioner works off of oil pressure.
No oil flow. No tension.
And there are parts of the engines rotation where depending on the cam postions, there will be slack between the gears, if the motor isn't running.

It would make sense to not have oil pressure, considering there was that huge ass leak in the filter housing. I couldn't imagine much pressure could build.


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 Old 03-16-2014, 05:17 PM   #14
 
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Thanks for the info @Tokay444;
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 Old 03-16-2014, 10:08 PM   #15
 
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Well, swapped the oil filter housing and the oil isn't leaking at all anymore. Chain is tight. Awesome. Thanks Brock for answering my questions!


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 Old 03-18-2014, 03:27 PM   #16
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There will be sections of the rotation where the chain isn't tight when not running though. Don't let it freak you out.
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