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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:17 PM   #1
 
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Default Holy Inner tire wear!

Just changed out my "Summers" for "Winters" and found this issue.
Background: Tires came w/ car when bought at 38K, now have 58K.
It only happened on the front tires, the back were fine. The whole inner tire was worn down flat but not down to the belts, these were the worst spots.
No uneven tire wear last year when i changed the tires out last Fall.
Installed Eibach springs in late July this year and had an alignment on Sept.14th at the dealer. SEE PICS.
Have KUMHO ECSTA SPT stock.
Really surprised to see this kind of wear this fast, is this expected with the MS3 on Eibach springs? I had minimal wheel shake and no handling issues. Drive the car hard thru the curves and twisties as expected, could have frickin' died had these blown out.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:19 PM   #2
 
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Your RF and LR camber values are too negative. High negative camber will cause inner tire wear like that.

Get adjustable rear camber arms, and either shift the subframe, get camber kits, or hog out the strut tower mounting holes for the front.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:23 PM   #3
 
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Originally Posted by silvapain View Post
Your RF and LR camber values are too negative. High negative camber will cause inner tire wear like that.

Get adjustable rear camber arms, and either shift the subframe, get camber kits, or hog out the strut tower mounting holes for the front.
This can be right, but typically it is the car's toe settings that will cause such drastic wear problems in a shorter amount of time.

I ran -2.5 camber on my last car and and never saw anything that bad.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:24 PM   #4
 
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On the pictures it looks like it was rubbing on something... did you check around the inner fender for plastic/metal wear?
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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:25 PM   #5
 
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Originally Posted by Danish View Post
This can be right, but typically it is the car's toe settings that will cause such drastic wear problems in a shorter amount of time.

I ran -2.5 camber on my last car and and never saw anything that bad.
I wore my V12's out with camber only. -3° in the rear did it. I'm at -1.5° all around now.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:30 PM   #6
 
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Are you saying I currently have too much neg. camber up front? Don't want to burn out my new steelies this winter. The dealer said they had a hell of a time trying to get the front w/I specs and couldn't adjust the front passenger anymore to even get it to specs. I had no issues until i had an alignment done and the Eibach 'drop" is pretty minimal.

Hey thanks thanox2, i'll check the fenders wells, never thought about rubbing, didn't hear or feel anything but i was driving her pretty hard just last weekend.

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 Old 11-28-2011, 02:31 PM   #7
 
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The car doesn't have any camber adjustments stock, aside from shifting the struts around in the strut tower holes. Based on your camber values, I hazard a guess that your subframe has been dropped before and isn't centered.

Lowering the car naturally increases negative camber all around. Your toe settings aren't drastic enough to cause that wear.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 04:20 PM   #8
 
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My car had this issue from factory. Its a common issue from what Ive read that happened with ms3/6. Mazda set the toe rediculously wrong on some vehicles. My stock tires looked like that at 20k. I took it to a buddys shop and had him adjust the alighnment. Now a new set and 33k later n my tires have 60-70% tread left evenly on all sides.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 04:37 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Danish View Post
This can be right, but typically it is the car's toe settings that will cause such drastic wear problems in a shorter amount of time.

I ran -2.5 camber on my last car and and never saw anything that bad.
THIS

Ever since I installed my adjustable ball joints, I've cranked my camber to -2.5 degrees too, but I have ZERO toe. I also run the tire pressure a bit lower to help the tire wear evenly. So far so good. Something like having the tires overfilled can also add to the problem.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 04:48 PM   #10
 
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While I agree, his posted alignment specs clearly show his toe is fine.
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 Old 11-28-2011, 06:16 PM   #11
 
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Get the camber fixed or you will have tire wear.
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 Old 12-02-2011, 08:14 PM   #12
 
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Didnt find any rubbing issues in the wheel wells. I keep my tire pressure at 35F and 33R, a LB over stock. I'm gonna watch my winter tire wear , get new summers and have another alignment. The CARFAX was clean when a bought the car but the dealer said they couldnt get the right front camber w/i specs, seemed kinda weird to me. I guess the Eibach drop was enough to throw things off. Don't see any signs of an accident but you never know.
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 Old 12-03-2011, 10:05 AM   #13
 
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Originally Posted by silvapain View Post
While I agree, his posted alignment specs clearly show his toe is fine.
Yes and no. MS3 factory tolerances are far too wide. And the Toe is still too aggressive. Needs to be at .05* or less, IMO.

The sawtooth pattern indicates a pretty good drag from a toe misalignment. And the camber angle is accelerating that wear exponentially.

Reduce the camber and zero out the toe. Firestone will do it if you ask them. GL.
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 Old 02-26-2012, 04:12 PM   #14
 
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Hows the wear so far? I am getting some crazy inner wear on the front driver side. Thought it was rubbing on wheel well, but can't feel it anywhere or see. Going for alignment this week, hopefully that is the cause. Time to buy 2 new tires, a damn shame when still have 70% tread life.
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 Old 03-03-2012, 09:16 AM   #15
 
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I've recently discovered abnormal tire wear on the inside of the front tires only. I felt around and found now where it could have rubbed. The car drove and felt fine the whole time this was happening.

For my loss, i'm lowered and no alignment so thats obviously the problem. Whats not so obvious is how to fix it.

I've decided on rolling the rear fenders for more space and adding 10MM spacers with extended studs then running 235/40's. Also gonna probably add spc ball joints.

It could have been rubbing during cornering but i never felt anything unusual. Which why i think spacing them out will help with that and give me more room on the inside for the wider tire.

Any feedback on this scenario? If i'm only gonna run 1.5 degrees negative camber do i really need the adjustable ball joints?
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 Old 03-03-2012, 10:52 AM   #16
 
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So wait, you lowered the car and never had it re-aligned??

If that's the case, you're not likely rubbing anything but the road... You have way too much toe and therefore you're seeing highly accelerated inner tread wear.
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 Old 03-03-2012, 12:41 PM   #17
 
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Originally Posted by Nliiitend1 View Post
So wait, you lowered the car and never had it re-aligned??

If that's the case, you're not likely rubbing anything but the road... You have way too much toe and therefore you're seeing highly accelerated inner tread wear.
Yuuup! pretty much. With the crap oem specs and the wide tolerance i didn't see a point with out adjustble BJ's and the specs to have it set to. I drove it that way for 25k before it really started killing my tires. Worn insides or not the tread is beat and they all need replaced anyways. I do however intend to do it right this time.

Either way, i was lazy and cheap about it, and here i am spending the money i would have spent in the first place. Would the tires have lasted longer with a proper setup? Probably. I could have made it to next winter then got new treads. And thats ideal if you run A/S's.

So don't be like me kids, Lowering it, align it, love it.
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 Old 03-03-2012, 12:52 PM   #18
 
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Yeah, a small change in ride height usually has a pretty big effect on your toe settings, at least in the front. You're lucky they lasted as long as they did, honestly.
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 Old 03-04-2012, 04:32 PM   #19
 
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Here is what happened to both of my fronts at the same time on the highway.


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 Old 03-05-2012, 05:41 AM   #20
 
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Well damn! talk about scared straight. I need to quite fuckin around and fix this shit.
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 Old 03-05-2012, 06:15 AM   #21
 
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Originally Posted by Mistersix View Post
Well damn! talk about scared straight. I need to quite fuckin around and fix this shit.


Inner tire wear is not something to fuck around with. I could have seriously hurt myself or others on the highway just because of my neglect to my tires. And the fucked up thing is that they looked just fine on the outside.
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 Old 03-06-2012, 01:36 AM   #22
 
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so about 4 -5 months ago i got rearended by a jeep with cattle gaurd bull shit in my 07 ms3 fucked up the glass the hatch bumper cover and mounts underneath and so on, anyway i had just rotated all four tired afew weeks earlier,the car goes to body shop and i demaned a four whell alignment to be done as it just felt wrong after crash, no lower no suspension other then factory so today i noticed excessive inside tire wear on both front tires... allignments not even 6 months old... i still have the print out but the car feels like its hopping or skid/skipping if i do a full steer lock u turn left or right. any body got advice that would possibly help please thank in advance
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 Old 03-06-2012, 02:59 AM   #23
 
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holy shit @tee.dog what the fuck are you trying to say?...separate your questions/concerns/ideas with punctuation.
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 Old 03-06-2012, 05:35 AM   #24
 
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Ya man, that was tough to read. So what happened when you went back? Or, did you go back to the alignment shop? or, did you.... wait, i'm not sure i understand.
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 Old 03-06-2012, 07:23 AM   #25
 
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How old were the tires when the alignment was done? Because they can say that its your tires just being old. Still odd that with no suspension other than stock, that your having issues like this.
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 Old 03-06-2012, 08:37 PM   #26
 
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Originally Posted by Downmented View Post
How old were the tires when the alignment was done? Because they can say that its your tires just being old. Still odd that with no suspension other than stock, that your having issues like this.
Agreed. maybe he was lowered and went back to stock after the accident? Eh, who knows.
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 Old 03-07-2012, 12:16 AM   #27
 
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I'm running into the same problem on my car. In have an 08 with ~114k and am on stock suspension and am on my sixth set of tires. The stock set of tires lasted about 20k and wore just fine. No problems at all. Then I put a set of rt615's and after about 8 months the Rf tire had to be replaced because of tread separation. So I got two new rt615's put on. Well again about 6-8 months later I blew a tire on the RF. Looked at the tire and the tread had separated. So since this happened twice I figured it was just a shitty batchnof tires so I bought a whole new set of sunlike for the car. Well fate about 9 months same shit happened again so I got two more tires. Then later it happened again about six months later. I had multiple alignments done and was always told it was in spec. Well shitnhappened again a few days ago but caught it really early before the tire could be destroyed. I was pissed when this happened the third time now I'm just beyond pissed because this is costing me so damn much in tires. So in a few days I'm gonna get the car on a lift and inspect all the suspension and see if anything in just completely fucked. Though I don't think it is because the car drives perfect. Hopefully I can figure this shit out.
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 Old 03-07-2012, 05:49 AM   #28
 
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Damn man! I would have thought something was wrong after the first disaster. Like you said though, the car drove fine. Same here, and now my tires are fucked.

And you got alot of miles for an 08 you must drive the shit outta that thing which leads me to two questions.

Why buy expensive soft tires if your commute is so far, and why use such sticky tires on the stock suspension every day?
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I also have inner excessive tire wear here's my thread/info

http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...ellows-114332/
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 Old 09-27-2012, 04:02 PM   #30
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Bringing this thread up again.

I have a Gen1 and at the beginning of the summer installed Gen2 wheels with OEM tires. By the end of the summer, the inside edges of the fronts are basically done. That's in around 6k miles of spirited driving. I haven't had issues like this with my other tires on the car so I suspected alignment which was off so I got it realigned with very little toe in the front and rear.

COBB springs and Koni FSD shocks are installed. I have attached the alignment specs which are fine AFAIK.

However the wear continues.

For all you Gen2 owners, did this wear happen once you switched tires as well? I am thinking the Dunlop design with a very stiff sidewall is putting a lot of wear on the inside edge even with mild camber. Basically I want to narrow this down between either still looking at alignment or if it's a tire issue.

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 Old 09-27-2012, 04:38 PM   #31
 
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Lex: Did you go see Jason at Dale's?

He and I have had discussions about how the "Mazda Spec" for the rear camber is way too wide.

That aside, I thought you weren't supposed to put any lowering springs with Koni FSD's?
Also do you have rear camber arms installed?
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 Old 09-27-2012, 05:33 PM   #32
 
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This tire wear is happening to my car as well. Gen1. Started with the stockers. Car has stock suspension and wore the very inside edge of my stock front tires only, back tires were fine. For my car the passenger side front is worse but the driver’s side front still wears almost as bad. I rotated as much as I could but soon it meant both tires would suffer anyways.

I changed out my stockers and the replacements were mounted on RX8's (235/40/18 Nitto NT-05's) with an alignment (don't have the spec sheet or remember what they the tech set them at or were set at previously from the factory but wasn't told or remember about anything being abnormal) same wear right now in the front inside edges again. (Again back is fine) Fak. Still had a little more life left in em but oh well. I'll replace them and make sure the allignment is zero toe and I guess that's all I can do....
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 Old 09-27-2012, 06:07 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by theurgy View Post
Lex: Did you go see Jason at Dale's?

He and I have had discussions about how the "Mazda Spec" for the rear camber is way too wide.

That aside, I thought you weren't supposed to put any lowering springs with Koni FSD's?
Also do you have rear camber arms installed?
I did not see Jason and the front is actually killing the tires more than the rear but unless I get camber plates can't really do much. Toe is essentially zero. I do not have camber arms either since the COBB springs don't really lower the rear at all. The FSDs are valved just fine for the COBB springs, no issue there and the drop is very mild.
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 Old 09-27-2012, 06:21 PM   #34
 
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Check all of your bushings over and inspect them for play.

The dynamic nature of the rear toe (the way it changes more significantly through the suspension's range of motion than it does with many multi-link setups, providing a passive rear steer effect) on this car can definitely exaggerate tire wear abnormalities due to bushing wear.

The bushings in the "toe links" and the forward trailing arm/"control blade" bushings, as well as the camber arm bushings are all essential to that geometry functioning properly.

We all need to remember that static alignment numbers only tell us part of the story, and that there is a lot going on when the car is moving about which those numbers can't tell us much.
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 Old 09-27-2012, 06:37 PM   #35
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Originally Posted by Nliiitend1 View Post
Check all of your bushings over and inspect them for play.

The dynamic nature of the rear toe (the way it changes more significantly through the suspension's range of motion than it does with many multi-link setups, providing a passive rear steer effect) on this car can definitely exaggerate tire wear abnormalities due to bushing wear.

The bushings in the "toe links" and the forward trailing arm/"control blade" bushings, as well as the camber arm bushings are all essential to that geometry functioning properly.

We all need to remember that static alignment numbers only tell us part of the story, and that there is a lot going on when the car is moving about which those numbers can't tell us much.
Thanks for the tip. Most of the wear I am seeing is in the front however and there is nothing loose about the front suspension (or the rear for that matter). Any tips there? Is the camber really enough to cause severe wear in the front?
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 Old 09-27-2012, 07:38 PM   #36
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Toe not set at 0 will help wear out the inside of the tires, negative camber to an extent will not wear out tires much at all if toe is 0, Toe not set at 0 plus to much negative camber will eat away at your tires

A friend of mine that has had a Mazda 3 hatchback and now has a Speed3 over the last 4 years and has replaced tires yearly. He does rotate his tires every time he does a oil change as well so about every 3-4k miles. He drives about 15-17k per year on the car and still the tires wear out fast. Mazda's factory specs are in my opinion a little on the aggressive as far as toe and camber could be a bit less for most people that just DD there cars. They handle pretty well out of the box for a reason and that is the alignment is a tad on that aggressive side.

If you want better tire life and wear I would run 0 toe all around and no more than -1.5* of camber for a DD.

I have learned this the hard way with doing an aggressive autocross alignment on one of my car having some toe in and out in the front and rear and never changing it back because I loved how the car felt and handled. About 4-5k miles later I was in need of new tires I had the car re-aligned and kept a little negative camber in there I believe -1.5 front and -1.0 rear, but removed all toe front and rear and tires still looked new after 7k miles when I sold the car

Hope this will help you with some. I would just ignore the factory specs as far as toe goes and just 0 it out front and rear and then maybe run a little less camber. Also Have your cars alignment checked at least once a year if not twice a year to make sure everything is staying at the correct settings.

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Dallin
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 Old 09-27-2012, 07:47 PM   #37
 
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Run less air pressure and attack more corners...

The moment I notice inner tire wear is the moment I realize I need to do more aggressive driving.
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 Old 09-27-2012, 08:57 PM   #38
 
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 Old 09-27-2012, 09:13 PM   #39
 
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Originally Posted by Lex View Post
Thanks for the tip. Most of the wear I am seeing is in the front however and there is nothing loose about the front suspension (or the rear for that matter). Any tips there? Is the camber really enough to cause severe wear in the front?
I honestly don't see anything alarming on your alignment sheet, to tell you the truth.

I run similar numbers (about -1.4° camber, ~4° caster, and 1/16" TOTAL toe OUT - in the front) and with regular (perhaps more frequent than most, at ~3K miles or so) rotation I don't have any issues with irregular wear...

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 Old 09-27-2012, 09:29 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by Nliiitend1 View Post
I honestly don't see anything alarming on your alignment sheet, to tell you the truth.

I run similar numbers (about -1.4° camber, ~4° caster, and 1/16" TOTAL toe OUT - in the front) and with regular (perhaps more frequent than most, at ~3K miles or so) rotation I don't have any issues with irregular wear...

Neither do I so this is why I am suspecting the tires are prone to it. I run 32/32 pressures daily.

@theurgy thanks for posting - your front alignment looks very similar and it looks like you have camber arms in the rear. Any strange tire wear and what tires do you have?
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REALLY uneven tire wear .... cause ? This thread Refback 10-18-2013 08:42 PM

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