ECU Load cap shattered!

[Dano]

"I feel good! nah naw nah naw nah naw nah? I knew I would now"

That the cap is gone!!

[cpolly69]

is it really gone or is it just being avoided?

[hnda etr]

Originally Posted by cpolly69 is it really gone or is it just being avoided?

From my understanding, the load cap still exists, it's just moved up high enough that you don't hit it - if you change your calc load a/b maps to 3.0...

[WhiteNoise]

Originally Posted by Dano2010 your logged Actual AFR should match the Commanded AFR in all the fuel tables. If it doesn't the MAF is off. At that point you can decide what you want to do to make them match. 1) change the MAF around the voltages in your logs that are off. Keeping the MAF curve smooth. 2) change your fuel tables around the areas that are off. Doesn't realy matter which you choose. Having the MAF correct is the best way but takes the most time to get just right

I'm sorry - I'm tired and it's been a late night, and I haven't read the tech. documents or downloaded the latest ATR/docs.

All I'm concerned about is this: Assuming I had a OTS map and I did little beyond dialling in the MAF curve, and I had it working well with the pre-load-cap set of maps, can I keep that curve.

If I copy and paste my MAF curve into the latest maps can I expect the same LTFTs? (Of course, I'm going to take it easy, monitor, record, analyse, etc., but I don't need an upgrade to take me off into crazy tuner land )

[cld12pk2go]

Originally Posted by Dave PK I'm sorry - I'm tired and it's been a late night, and I haven't read the tech. documents or downloaded the latest ATR/docs. All I'm concerned about is this: Assuming I had a OTS map and I did little beyond dialling in the MAF curve, and I had it working well with the pre-load-cap set of maps, can I keep that curve. If I copy and paste my MAF curve into the latest maps can I expect the same LTFTs? (Of course, I'm going to take it easy, monitor, record, analyse, etc., but I don't need an upgrade to take me off into crazy tuner land )

Yes, your MAF curve should still apply just fine as long as your weren't playing load cap avoidance games with it before.

[Dano]

Originally Posted by cpolly69 is it really gone or is it just being avoided?

Guess it depends on how you define "gone". It is now tunable up to 3.0 so IMO it is gone. Has anyone achieved 3.0 load on this platform?

I am currently etuning a 3076 car and only see 230ish so far IIRC. His OTS map dynoed at 345WHP and I have him up 20 g/s at this point without any boost tuning. Just removed the cap and tuned fuel

[SJP0tato]

Something that still seems unresolved to me about the load cap issue:
The fuel/ignition tables still only go to 2.13/2.00 respectively.

Even though we can go up to 3.00 and the ecu will properly recognize it, we can't really seem to tune for much beyond the 2.13 still. I wonder if another version of ATR will be released soon that addresses this?

[Dano]

I haven't looked at my "released" version but I thought that would be in this version. Trey is working on it and I believe what was decided was to scale the load axis acording to what you set as your Calc Load Max values.

i.e. if you set your max to 2.5 the load axis in all tables will go up to 2.5, calc max load to 2.75, axis goes to 2.75.

At lease I hope that's the way they will do it. That way if you don't need big power you will have more resolution in your load axis and if you need big power your axis will cover it.

maybe this will be in the next version. At this point the ECU will just use the values at the 2.13 load point for any higher calc load.

[cld12pk2go]

Originally Posted by Dano2010 I haven't looked at my "released" version but I thought that would be in this version. Trey is working on it and I believe what was decided was to scale the load axis acording to what you set as your Calc Load Max values. i.e. if you set your max to 2.5 the load axis in all tables will go up to 2.5, calc max load to 2.75, axis goes to 2.75. At lease I hope that's the way they will do it. That way if you don't need big power you will have more resolution in your load axis and if you need big power your axis will cover it. maybe this will be in the next version. At this point the ECU will just use the values at the 2.13 load point for any higher calc load.

The version of ATR I got on Friday does not have the load axis scaled above 2 or 2.13. I hope this is resolved in a near future release.

It is still a huge upgrade...

[Dano]

amen! on the huge upgrade. I just DLd ATR on Friday as well so I guess the load axis scaling will be in a future release.

[SJP0tato]

Agreed this is still a win for us.

I've thought about it, I don't think the resolution matters nearly as much for us as previous ECUs I've used. Reason being is we target A:F ratio. Chances are if you want 14.7 at 0.1 load you probably want 14.7 at 0.2-0.8 load too. Same for boost, if your load is 1.2 and you want 11.5 you still probably want 11.5 as you go higher in boost/rpm too.

It isn't like the "old days" where you had to deal with injector pulse width at each discrete point for RPM/Boost levels. In those cases you had to be very specific and needed as many data points as possible so you could manually work out the A:F ratio.
So I don't think a loss of resolution would matter nearly as much on our platform.

[manelscout4life]

dano or anyone else whos been working with cobb,

with theses new maps was the only thing changed the addition of Max Calculated load?
if I open up a 1.06 in the new ATR and change the Max Calc load to 3.0 would it be the same as the 1.07 maps?

I don't feel like recalibrating my maf and doing all that again.

[SJP0tato]

Originally Posted by manelscout4life dano or anyone else whos been working with cobb, with theses new maps was the only thing changed the addition of Max Calculated load? if I open up a 1.06 in the new ATR and change the Max Calc load to 3.0 would it be the same as the 1.07 maps? I don't feel like recalibrating my maf and doing all that again.

You can copy your MAF values over to the new version (along with any other changed values) incase there's anything else different that they haven't disclosed.

[Dano]

Originally Posted by manelscout4life dano or anyone else whos been working with cobb, with theses new maps was the only thing changed the addition of Max Calculated load? if I open up a 1.06 in the new ATR and change the Max Calc load to 3.0 would it be the same as the 1.07 maps? I don't feel like recalibrating my maf and doing all that again.

all you really have to do is open your old map in the new ATR, change the Calc Max load A & B values and resave the map. no need to use the new OTS maps at all.

[manelscout4life]

oh okay thanks thats what i figured

[evidence]

Seems we do really have Trey's ear right now. Wanted to mull over the list of tables real quick before I submit them. Below is a list of all with a load axis. Not sure we want him to ignore any tables really. The CL ones obviously don't need to be scaled up, but would be nice to have complete control. Bolded ones I said aren't required, but should be included if they share tables with the others or are easy enough to implement.

Fuel CL Commanded EQ (base)
Fuel OL Commanded EQ (Throttle Closed)
Fuel OL Commanded EQ (base)
Fuel OL/Part Throttle Commanded EQ (Knocking)
Fuel OL/Part Throttle Commanded EQ (No Knock)
Fuel OL/Part Throttle Commanded EQ (unused)

Ign Table - High Throttle/OL (Knocking)
Ign Table - High Throttle/OL (No Knock)
Ign Table - Low Throttle/CL (Knocking)
Ign Table - Low Throttle/CL (No Knock)

DBW Throttle A
DBW Throttle B
DBW Throttle C

VVT Intake Cam Adv.

Side note.. he said he figured out most of the fueling stuff and has the table mapped out for commanded pressure. Posting more in the wish list thread.

Need input guys: I think I have a method to allow you to set the Load Axis values for tables on a cell by cell basis without it being as difficult as I original thought. It will require some custom code and testing, but the results will be better and it shouldn't take months and months to do. What I need to know from the community are the tables you wish to rescale the Load axis values. Please list them, table by table, using the names as they appear in ATR. This way I'm not wasting time on tables you don't actually use/care to scale. The way it'll work is that I'll add some new tables that are axis values for various groups of tables (ex: The Ign Tables share the same axis value). You can then edit those axis tables and they'll automatically alter the axis values for the table(s) that use those values. I'm also going to bump the Calc. Load range in the ATR from 3.0 up to 5.0. That should give you plenty of head room should someone decide to attempt a 700HP build or something. Trey

[Dano]

Great to hear!!!

Fuel CL cmd EQ base
Fuel OL cmd EQ base
Fuel OL/PT knock
Fuel OL/PT no knock

Both ign high throttle tables.

[Cataphract_40]

500 calc load?!?!

[evidence]

Originally Posted by Cataphract_40 500 calc load?!?!

Just the allowed range, maps will likely be left at 3

[Cataphract_40]

Yeah, but you could theoretically request up to 5.00. and then bad things would happen

[Dano]

nah...hardware wouldn't take you that far....right? I mean 4" MAF some sort of 7786 Garrett monster w T6 1.8 AR back housing.....hahahahah

sorry....i ramble sometimes....but I am glad Trey is on the case....ya know all the scoobie guys have open source so it makes good $ and sense for Cobb to cater at least some to the Mazda world. Small pie is better than no pie at all.....

thank again Ev

[Cataphract_40]

this sucker could probably hit 5.00 load

[Dano]

Hahahaaha

I think we have a winner!!!

[sbspeed]

I'm also going to bump the Calc. Load range in the ATR from 3.0 up to 5.0. That should give you plenty of head room should someone decide to attempt a 700HP build or something.

Trey



700HP?

[super_pablo_]

i went from page 1 to 18 without reading it all, sorry if i skipped it but... are the initial documents from OP unavailable now? I cant download em

[djuosnteisn]

No longer necessary.


Set the CL max in your tune to like 3, and voila.

[Dano]

holy resurrection Batman!

yes CL Max Load A & B to 3 and ur done.

[super_pablo_]

i have done that already... i guess i dont need it then... shoulda read more... lol. I just wanted to compare my tuning with someone else's i guess.. so i wanted to check out his map.
i still have OTS timing tables cause im not comfortable with changing it yet... i need more reading on it. thanks anyway