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04-25-2009, 07:03 AM
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 |  Fixing Jerky Throttle Response with ATR
Wanted to make a new thread with the jerky throttle "fix", maybe for a good sticky candidate or at least easy for guys who are searching to get there answers/solutions once this area starts filling up with more threads. There's nothing I hate more than having to wade through pages of BS in a thread, trying to find my answer to something. There very well may be more "smooth throttle" fixings and discoveries to be had, but this seems pretty significant and VERY easy to implement, so I thought it was definitely worth letting everyone know about.....anyone can do this fix. -------------------------------- Jerky throttle response (part throttle is like full boost or similar) seems to be mainly linked to one or two tables in the ECU, thankfully. Under your Load tables, check out your "Throttle - Requested Load A" and "C" variation tables (they should be identical). If it looks like this, then you are probably having jerky throttle response, which you probably are already well aware of: http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...%203/ATR/1.jpg Here's the fix. I noticed in the official v103 Stage 2 + SF 93 FMIC map, the throttle response was MUCH smoother and better to drive around. I found that this table was the only main difference (at least relevant to throttle response) to another map which was nearly identical, except had very jerky throttle response. It seems like Christian knew about it..I mean obviously he made these changes, but decided not to implement them in all maps for whatever reason. It's been tested and verified by others and myself that you can simple copy and paste over the A and C tables over to your current map and throttle response will be greatly improved. So if you want to fix this in 2 minutes, go to Cobb's site and download the v103 map mentioned above. Here's what your table should look like after the "fix": http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...%203/ATR/2.jpg Here's a link to Cobb's map list site: cobb . MAZDASPEED3 accessport . map listing ----------------------------------------------- OR, just copy and paste this into your "Throttle - Requested Load A" and "Throttle - Requested Load C" tables under the "Load Tables" folder Code: 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.64 0.46 0.34 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.19 0.67 0.68 0.61 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.38 0.68 0.77 0.80 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.58 0.69 0.80 0.90 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.77 0.69 0.81 0.94 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.96 0.70 0.82 0.95 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 1.15 0.70 0.83 0.96 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 1.35 0.70 0.82 0.97 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 1.54 0.70 0.83 0.97 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 1.73 0.70 0.83 0.97 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 1.92 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 2.12 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 2.31 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 
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04-25-2009, 07:42 AM
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Neat, nice find.
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04-25-2009, 11:11 AM
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good work man....DEFF STICKY this now did this change anything with the other issue u were having?
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04-26-2009, 09:55 AM
| #4 | |
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first post updated with exact code.... now you can just copy and paste this directly into your map of choice.
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04-26-2009, 10:13 AM
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Boost doesn't seem to come on as quick. With this map.
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04-26-2009, 12:45 PM
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04-26-2009, 04:50 PM
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once you get used to it the car drives so much better. Feels like an NA car. Very linear power.
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04-26-2009, 07:36 PM
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It runs great....now just need more power 8)
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04-26-2009, 08:50 PM
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Good Intel! How do i get my AP to make maps like that on my laptop?? i still view my data logs in excel.
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04-27-2009, 04:52 AM
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you need to download accesstuner race
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04-27-2009, 06:45 PM
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04-28-2009, 06:55 AM
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ok I tried a slightly different calibration for throttle requested loads tables a and c. This gives more load throughout and maintains the smooth throttle. I like it even better. 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.64 0.46 0.34 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.67 0.68 0.61 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.68 0.77 0.80 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.69 0.80 0.90 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.69 0.81 0.94 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 0.70 0.82 0.95 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 0.70 0.83 0.96 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 0.70 0.82 0.97 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 0.70 0.83 0.97 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50
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04-28-2009, 07:03 AM
| #13 | |
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dread, i'm at work right now, but i just wanted to clarify: can i just copy and paste what you just posted directly into ATR? i'm just hoping the spacings between the entries are correct so that they line themselves up in ATR...  | ||||||||
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04-28-2009, 07:04 AM
| #14 | |
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Dread, how did you come up with this? just trying to understand the logic of the changes made for personal understanding.
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04-28-2009, 07:12 AM
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Yes you can copy the values into the throttle requested load table a and c, just make sure the graph still looks smooth. All I did was increase the values from the table aaron posted giving adding slightly more load at even increments. For example he is requesting 2.31 load at 75% throttle. My map request 2.42. You can increase these values more but would need to reach max load at a lower throttle value to keep the values linear.
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04-28-2009, 07:43 AM
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Its not a huge difference but the car opens up a bit sooner. You may want to add more load. I will probably end up adding more at some point. I want to see how I like this after the map settles in.
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04-28-2009, 07:56 AM
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ya, i'm not looking to go crazy on the load mapping right now. i've noticed that the less aggressive load ramp up appears to help with my LTFTs, which makes sense, since sudden jumps in load must make it hard to keep accurate record of how much air is going through the intake.
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04-28-2009, 09:55 AM
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I just wanted to point out an observation. I pasted both Aaronc7's adjusted table and dread's into the table on ATR and the new values make a huge difference in how they graph out. From 2000 rpms the TPS and load values create a completely linear path up to 100% TPS. The Cobb map was very uneven, undulated a lot and at about 65% TPS abruptly jumped up to 100%. I'm no expert in this but i'd like to understand why the 2 tables would be so different? Is there a reason the orig. tables weren't linear like the ones you guys posted? | ||||||||
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04-28-2009, 10:15 AM
| #20 | |
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04-28-2009, 10:21 AM
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04-28-2009, 10:28 AM
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04-28-2009, 10:31 AM
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It sounds like it was really a "sprint booster" per say but the boosting was actually implemented into the ECU tuning. Not surprising at all considering things like that make the car seem much faster and more responsive.
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04-28-2009, 10:46 AM
| #24 | |
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I never wanted the "boost taper" that haltech/Christian did for 1.02. And in the soapbox hal basically said as much that guys wanted the kick in the pants. The linear throttle is better for driveability and I'm glad now with atr I can choose between the two if needs be.
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04-28-2009, 02:15 PM
| #25 | |
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My gut reaction is it wasn't a Christian decision, it was a corporate decision to listen to just one group of people. I think Cobb looked at the ots maps as "Branded" maps and developed and marketed them accordingly. A brand has to have recognizable characteristics, appeal to a certain customer etc. Why they chose the least informed is anyone's guess.
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04-28-2009, 02:28 PM
| #26 | |
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I do wonder if the throttle smoothing slows down throttle response since car might run richer instead, causing a lower EGT and thus slower turbo spool? My LTFT are within +/- 5% but the car doesn't feel like it's running rich at all...
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04-28-2009, 02:53 PM
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I did some more driving with my updated throttle settings and the power definately comes on quicker and the smoothness is maintained. I may end up pushing it more, but I am pretty content with how it drives now.
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04-28-2009, 09:47 PM
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I know this sounds really bad...but dread, I can't copy and paste your table onto my atr...it just won't do it.
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04-29-2009, 03:26 AM
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Code: 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.64 0.46 0.34 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.20 0.67 0.68 0.61 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.41 0.68 0.77 0.80 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.62 0.69 0.80 0.90 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.82 0.69 0.81 0.94 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 1.02 0.70 0.82 0.95 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 1.22 0.70 0.83 0.96 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 1.42 0.70 0.82 0.97 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 1.62 0.70 0.83 0.97 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 1.82 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 2.02 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 2.22 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 2.42 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 0.70 0.83 0.97 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50 2.50
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04-29-2009, 04:41 AM
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how do you do the code thing
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04-29-2009, 06:38 AM
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you can paste into ATR. First select all the values in dread's code block and copy. Then in ATR select the first cell (top left) by left clicking and then scroll all the way down and right so that you can see the last cell (bottom right). Hold shift and click the last cell, now every cell should be selected (the graph at the bottom should be solid white). Now just hit CTRL+V and it will paste the new values.
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04-29-2009, 06:46 AM
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I know how to paste into ATR I am Dread. My question was how do I post the code on here so you guys can use it.
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04-29-2009, 06:53 AM
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liek this [code][ /CODE] Code: duh
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04-29-2009, 07:12 AM
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haha thanks
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04-29-2009, 08:08 AM
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have you guys done anything with the close loop to open loop delay?
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04-29-2009, 08:09 AM
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yeah, once you do the code quotes it keeps the cell format. I pasted evidence's code and it worked out just as dread's table is. thanks again!
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04-29-2009, 09:23 AM
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what did you set it at? i might have missed it.
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04-29-2009, 09:31 AM
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I'm just using SLS's settings on a tune that Christian did for him.
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04-29-2009, 09:57 AM
| #39 | |
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ok i was asking what value did you use for the delay. i think cobb has it set at 30ms
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04-29-2009, 10:04 AM
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SLS's settings are @ 15, I believe
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| MS3 vs. MS6 vs. CX7 engine failure - Mazda6 / Atenza | This thread | Refback | 11-20-2009 12:20 PM | |
| MS3/ATR: Smooth Throttle Fixes (May 23, 2009) - TorontoMazda3 | This thread | Refback | 05-29-2009 07:35 AM | |
| MS3/ATR: Smooth Throttle Fixes (May 23, 2009) - TorontoMazda3 | This thread | Refback | 05-23-2009 05:19 AM | |
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