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 Old 03-17-2013, 08:23 PM   #1
 
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Default Fuel pressure drop

So I was driving from Houston to San Antonio today and after more than an hour of driving I went WOT in 5th gear and around 5-6k rpm I felt my engine stutter and loose power so I let off and slowed down, downshifted and tried it in 4th, same thing around same rpms...
I did one more time and logged it to see what was happening and when I look it shows my fuel pressure drop like crazy then a second later boost gets cut. It also shows my accelerator pedal pos change but I had it to the floor until the boost got cut. (log 20)

I've also attached two other WOT logs wot1 and wot2 which I did yesterday and sent in for an e-tune with stratified. I didn't experience anything bad during these logs at all.

Someone told me it may be bad gas because this happened right after I filled up in a place ive never filled up at before.
I've also been told maybe the spark plugs need to be changed or my fuel pump is bad..

As far as power mods, my car has Autotech fp internals which have been on for ~8k miles, cobb sri/tip, cp-e fmic and catless dp. The fmic and dp are brand new, just put on last sunday.

Ill include the map I'm using as well.
Any opinions would be great. I don't want to go zzb right as I'm getting into my tune :/
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File Type: ptm 4Stage2+SF+TIH+IC 93 v210.ptm (17.0 KB, 8 views)
File Type: csv wot1.csv (28.0 KB, 26 views)
File Type: csv wot2.csv (28.1 KB, 17 views)
File Type: csv datalog20.csv (22.4 KB, 40 views)
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 Old 03-17-2013, 08:37 PM   #2
 
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Aside from being rich, fuel pressure is strong across the board, no major knock. I'd say you just need to get a real tune. 10.9-11.1 is realllllyyyyyy rich. You want to be 11.5-12.1 tops. Any wheel spin/ Was DSC off? @rfinkle2; @ms3blackmica; @atvfreek; can give you more input.
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 Old 03-17-2013, 08:42 PM   #3
 
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Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
Aside from being rich as fawk, fuel pressure is strong across the board, no major knock. I'd say you just need to get a real tune. 10.1-11.1 is realllllyyyyyy rich. you want to be 11.5-12.1 tops.
Yeah I literally just purchased a tune from stratified 2 nights ago and sent them those 2 wot logs and 2 maf logs so I should be getting into a good tune soon.

As far as the pressure drop in log 20 though. Should I be concerned? it did that in 3rd 4th and 5th gear when I was on the road and went wot. But after I got to a friends house to show him it didn't do it again and by that time I was pretty much done with that tank of gas. Just filled up at my normal place and put some b12 injector cleaner in it to be safe.

Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
Any wheel spin/ Was DSC off? @rfinkle2; @ms3blackmica; @atvfreek; can give you more input.
No wheel spin and DSC was on. I was in the middle of fucking with an srt4 caliber when it first started haha
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 Old 03-17-2013, 08:46 PM   #4
 
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Originally Posted by derek13p View Post
Yeah I literally just purchased a tune from stratified 2 nights ago and sent them those 2 wot logs and 2 maf logs so I should be getting into a good tune soon.

As far as the pressure drop in log 20 though. Should I be concerned? it did that in 3rd 4th and 5th gear when I was on the road and went wot. But after I got to a friends house to show him it didn't do it again and by that time I was pretty much done with that tank of gas. Just filled up at my normal place and put some b12 injector cleaner in it to be safe.
Ohhhh woah, wait....I missed that until you pointed it out. Possibly bad gas but keep on eye on it man...seems like the internals could possibly be fuckin up. Your FP definitely should not be dropping THAT low
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 Old 03-17-2013, 08:54 PM   #5
 
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Fuel cut/throttle close?
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 Old 03-17-2013, 08:55 PM   #6
 
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Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
Ohhhh woah, wait....I missed that until you pointed it out. Possibly bad gas but keep on eye on it man...seems like the internals could possibly be fuckin up. Your FP definitely should not be dropping THAT low
So should I be looking into purchasing new fp internals or a whole pump or what?
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 Old 03-17-2013, 09:01 PM   #7
 
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Originally Posted by btstarcher View Post
Fuel cut/throttle close?
Yeah I saw that too. I had it floored until the boost started getting cut so i'm not sure why the throttle pos was decreasing..
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 Old 03-17-2013, 09:03 PM   #8
 
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After looking at the log, I don't think it's fuel cut, but not sure.
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 Old 03-17-2013, 09:11 PM   #9
 
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Originally Posted by btstarcher View Post
After looking at the log, I don't think it's fuel cut, but not sure.
Any ideas on what I should do?
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 Old 03-18-2013, 12:04 AM   #10
 
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@Boost_creep;
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Do you have an AP? Turn on other parameters, like [Accel. Pedal Pos.], [Fuel Inj. Amt], [HPFP Des. Press.], [HPFP Sens. Volt.], [Inj. Duty Cycle and Pulse Width]. It could be the spill valve - if you look at voltage and demanded psi, you should see something. There are threads on cleaning the pump worth a look as well. I think the Relief Valve can cause that too, but I'm not sure how to troubleshoot it.
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 Old 03-18-2013, 04:39 AM   #12
 
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Originally Posted by derek13p View Post
Yeah I literally just purchased a tune from stratified 2 nights ago and sent them those 2 wot logs and 2 maf logs so I should be getting into a good tune soon.

As far as the pressure drop in log 20 though. Should I be concerned? it did that in 3rd 4th and 5th gear when I was on the road and went wot. But after I got to a friends house to show him it didn't do it again and by that time I was pretty much done with that tank of gas. Just filled up at my normal place and put some b12 injector cleaner in it to be safe.


No wheel spin and DSC was on. I was in the middle of fucking with an srt4 caliber when it first started haha
Is that the only log that fuel pressure has dropped that low?
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 Old 03-18-2013, 06:05 AM   #13
 
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Originally Posted by atvfreek View Post
Is that the only log that fuel pressure has dropped that low?
Yeah Justin the 2 that he took before it were fine. Thats why Im not sure what to gather from the last one. Why is the pressure dropping so dangerously low other than the fp acting up


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 Old 03-18-2013, 06:11 AM   #14
 
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Originally Posted by turboKart View Post
Do you have an AP? Turn on other parameters, like [Accel. Pedal Pos.], [Fuel Inj. Amt], [HPFP Des. Press.], [HPFP Sens. Volt.], [Inj. Duty Cycle and Pulse Width]. It could be the spill valve - if you look at voltage and demanded psi, you should see something. There are threads on cleaning the pump worth a look as well. I think the Relief Valve can cause that too, but I'm not sure how to troubleshoot it.
I can turn those all on and try and duplicate the issue again if you think its safe to do so.
Originally Posted by atvfreek View Post
Is that the only log that fuel pressure has dropped that low?
That's the only time I logged the issue. I was able to duplicate it 5-6 times within a few minutes in different gears, all around the same rpm, before I took out the AP and did it one last time to log it and then just took it easy for the rest of the drive.
I know for sure that each time whatever happened happened it was getting boost cut in the higher rpms and that's what made the vehicle start to stutter and loose power. I am not sure if it was dropping fuel pressure the other times, though I would only assume that was why it was cutting the boost since fuel pressure was cut/dropped first?
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What intake are you running?
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 Old 03-18-2013, 06:14 AM   #16
 
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Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
Yeah Justin the 2 that he took before it were fine. Thats why Im not sure what to gather from the last one. Why is the pressure dropping so dangerously low other than the fp acting up


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Originally Posted by derek13p View Post
I can turn those all on and try and duplicate the issue again if you think its safe to do so.

That's the only time I logged the issue. I was able to duplicate it 5-6 times within a few minutes in different gears, all around the same rpm, before I took out the AP and did it one last time to log it and then just took it easy for the rest of the drive.
I know for sure that each time whatever happened happened it was getting boost cut in the higher rpms and that's what made the vehicle start to stutter and loose power. I am not sure if it was dropping fuel pressure the other times, though I would only assume that was why it was cutting the boost since fuel pressure was cut/dropped first?

If you are able to duplicate it, then you need to address that before lex can tune you. I doubt the autotechs have failed, but you never know. The autotechs do over run the relief valve frequently, so it may be the relief valve that has taken the hit. Really the only way to find out is to swap components with a known good component.
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 Old 03-18-2013, 07:17 AM   #17
 
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Originally Posted by atvfreek View Post
If you are able to duplicate it, then you need to address that before lex can tune you. I doubt the autotechs have failed, but you never know. The autotechs do over run the relief valve frequently, so it may be the relief valve that has taken the hit. Really the only way to find out is to swap components with a known good component.
Well once I got to san Antonio and got to another members house to show him we tried a few pulls in 3rd and couldn't duplicate it again. He recommended me change my plugs, said it might be bad gas, and told me to run some b12 injector cleaner. So when the tank was on E I filled up with some 93 that I knew was always good and put the b12 in there.

I can have those other parameters checked and go do a wot or two on a good stretch of road here in a few hours and post up what happens?...

Originally Posted by rfinkle2 View Post
What intake are you running?
I've got the cobb sri/tip combo.
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 Old 03-18-2013, 07:39 AM   #18
 
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Originally Posted by derek13p View Post
Well once I got to san Antonio and got to another members house to show him we tried a few pulls in 3rd and couldn't duplicate it again. He recommended me change my plugs, said it might be bad gas, and told me to run some b12 injector cleaner. So when the tank was on E I filled up with some 93 that I knew was always good and put the b12 in there.

I can have those other parameters checked and go do a wot or two on a good stretch of road here in a few hours and post up what happens?...


I've got the cobb sri/tip combo.
I would go and do it anyways man. Just so that we can look at the logs and either determine what is wrong, or possibly be able to say it was in fact just bad gas.
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 Old 03-18-2013, 07:42 AM   #19
 
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atvfreek and Joey both give excellent advice here. I tend to agree that your rail valve may be starting to go bad.

Have you had any strange idle issues?
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 Old 03-18-2013, 08:12 AM   #20
 
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Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
I would go and do it anyways man. Just so that we can look at the logs and either determine what is wrong, or possibly be able to say it was in fact just bad gas.
for sure, I'll do that here in an hour or so then

Originally Posted by rfinkle2 View Post
atvfreek and Joey both give excellent advice here. I tend to agree that your rail valve may be starting to go bad.

Have you had any strange idle issues?
hmm, I had noticed while idling a few days ago a slight thump/knock that I felt through the peddles. Happened randomly and was real slight then went away.
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 Old 03-18-2013, 09:51 AM   #21
 
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So I went out and did 5 logs, watched fuel pressure the whole time and it never dipped, boost never cut either.

Differences between now and when it happed:
Different gas
B12 injector cleaner
Traction control off
Wasn't running car for over an hour

Logs are attached
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File Type: csv 1st log 3-4th gear pull.csv (18.7 KB, 1 views)
File Type: csv 2nd log 4th gear pull.csv (12.5 KB, 1 views)
File Type: csv 3rd log 4th gear pull.csv (12.8 KB, 1 views)
File Type: csv 4th log 3-4-5 pull.csv (29.7 KB, 3 views)
File Type: csv last 3-4 pull.csv (26.7 KB, 6 views)
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 Old 03-18-2013, 11:45 AM   #22
 
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Default careful, mi amigo

The last log you posted looks ok - AFR is =<11, and your pump is not dropping pressure. Your IDC is 75%, which is within the [60-80?] I've heard as ok, especially since you are running rich.

But - I am not offering to analyze yer log - I just want to push the fact that everything you need, other than the tools and will to get under the hood, is right here, based on my experience.

That, and the fact I would not drive that car without AT LEAST ALWAYS logging and watching your hpfp psi until you fix this - what you have logged is a condition that I believe kills these engines...and whatever the problem was may have just flushed elsewhere, or just be waiting to do it again. There are some great threads on how to work/maintain the HPFP components here.
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 Old 03-18-2013, 12:59 PM   #23
 
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Originally Posted by turboKart View Post
That, and the fact I would not drive that car without AT LEAST ALWAYS logging and watching your hpfp psi until you fix this - what you have logged is a condition that I believe kills these engines...and whatever the problem was may have just flushed elsewhere, or just be waiting to do it again. There are some great threads on how to work/maintain the HPFP components here.
Definitely, that's why I got straight on here for help. I was so scared to go zzb.
I'm going to use more injector cleaner and change my plugs and check the internals and clean them next chance I get.
that and I hope getting this new tune will help out
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 Old 03-18-2013, 09:44 PM   #24
 
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Default the beard will guide you

Here is a great link on taking off the spill valve and cleaning it out.
It comes off easy with a 32mm wrench.
http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...le-hpfp-96970/
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 Old 03-19-2013, 10:56 AM   #25
 
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Originally Posted by turboKart View Post
Here is a great link on taking off the spill valve and cleaning it out.
It comes off easy with a 32mm wrench.
http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...le-hpfp-96970/
hell yeah, thanks man, I'll be doing that for sure!
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 Old 05-14-2013, 08:51 AM   #26
 
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@derek13p I am running the same OTS map (minus the changed commanded AFR to 11.6) you are right now and I had the same hiccup last night. Was in 3rd WOT and i want to say around 4500 RPM car just lost power but I haven't been able to replicate it like you did. I'd like to see what you find out.
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 Old 05-14-2013, 04:01 PM   #27
 
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Originally Posted by mazdaspeed916 View Post
@derek13p I am running the same OTS map (minus the changed commanded AFR to 11.6) you are right now and I had the same hiccup last night. Was in 3rd WOT and i want to say around 4500 RPM car just lost power but I haven't been able to replicate it like you did. I'd like to see what you find out.
Bad gas is what I had. I put some fuel system cleaner in and took it easy till next fill up(drained tank) and then filled up where I knew the gas was good and I haven't had it since.
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 Old 05-14-2013, 04:35 PM   #28
 
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Originally Posted by derek13p View Post
Bad gas is what I had. I put some fuel system cleaner in and took it easy till next fill up(drained tank) and then filled up where I knew the gas was good and I haven't had it since.
Now that I think about it I did goto a different gas station from usual.
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 Old 05-14-2013, 04:57 PM   #29
 
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Originally Posted by mazdaspeed916 View Post
Now that I think about it I did goto a different gas station from usual.
yeah, just fill up where you normally do or in nice parts of town where you know people buy premium.
hope that's all that it was for you.
were the symptoms exactly the same?
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 Old 05-15-2013, 08:40 AM   #30
 
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Originally Posted by derek13p View Post
yeah, just fill up where you normally do or in nice parts of town where you know people buy premium.
hope that's all that it was for you.
were the symptoms exactly the same?
Pretty much identical, did you have a different idle also until you got rid of the bad gas?
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 Old 05-15-2013, 10:44 AM   #31
 
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Originally Posted by mazdaspeed916 View Post
Pretty much identical, did you have a different idle also until you got rid of the bad gas?
hmm, idk, I drove across Texas so the gas was gone pretty fast hahs
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 Old 05-27-2013, 08:38 PM   #32
 
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#Richtune any ideas?
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 Old 05-27-2013, 09:24 PM   #33
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