need help with knock retard

[mr speed]

so i have a 2012 mazdaspeed3 with a custom single exit striaght pipe(muffler delete and resonator delete)...so i only have one pipe coming straight back like the gen 1 with no restriction except for the cats

everything else is stock, and im running the stage 1 map from the AP.

so heres my question, when not punching the throttle knock retard stays at 0, but when i floor it and check the logs it says supposedly that it his 2.9 to maybe 3.4

im trying to figure out why that is, and in sense my question is, is this normal?, could it be becase of my back pressure since i have no muffler or resonator?

on another note the car feels faster with the straight pipe hence the better air flow and single straight exit.

please dont bash on me for anything i may have stated im new to turbo cars...just trying to keep my investment in shape, i appreciate any help

[smoogs12]

You need to post logs.

[Dmurray06]

My guess is either your exhaust is banging up against something causing te knock. Or shitty gas can also cause this. Make sure if it's a 91 octane map you run 91 and the same for 93. Spark plugs also could be fuckeled. Lots of other stuff, but that's the obvious stuff.

[mr speed]

but my issue is that the car only has 7500 miles on it ive had it since april(yes i drive a lot)...so if its not the exhaust, it could be something internal as to what ur saying?

and how would i got about posting logs cause i just got my AP yesterday and i did log the knock when i was testing it out...im not to sure how im supposed to upload it on the forum tho?


edit: i always use 91, and i made sure the map was appropriate to the 91 gas rather than 93

[speed23]

I would suggest getting an e-tune from a tuner on this forum to fix your knock. Best money you can spend.

[Dmurray06]

Load log onto computer, upload saved log into a post.

[mr speed]

well one of my buddys has an 09 speed with all intake parts upgraded, and exhaust parts done...and he knows how to make the custom tune and he will do it for me for free....but i just wanna know one thing, from ur guys experience should the knock retard be off with the stage 1 map...but then again i wouldnt doubt its my exhaust knockin around, this stuffs confusing cause the knock only came at WOT so im guessing it is the exhaust but i dont wanna risk it...i just confused myself lol

[mr speed]

heres my most recent data log, thanks for any help again

[Zbrit00x]

Originally Posted by mr speed so i have a 2012 mazdaspeed3 with a custom single exit striaght pipe(muffler delete and resonator delete)...so i only have one pipe coming straight back like the gen 1 with no restriction except for the cats everything else is stock, and im running the stage 1 map from the AP. so heres my question, when not punching the throttle knock retard stays at 0, but when i floor it and check the logs it says supposedly that it his 2.9 to maybe 3.4 im trying to figure out why that is, and in sense my question is, is this normal?, could it be becase of my back pressure since i have no muffler or resonator? on another note the car feels faster with the straight pipe hence the better air flow and single straight exit. please dont bash on me for anything i may have stated im new to turbo cars...just trying to keep my investment in shape, i appreciate any help

Where in irvine you at

[mr speed]

i live in quail hill off sand canyon from the 405 lol...

[Zbrit00x]

What color is your speed? I live around the corner of culver and the 5. Did you try logging with a safe mode map. Also which station do you fill up at

[snailD]

thats a long fuckin log but it worked for what we needed. honestly that log looked consistent with bad gas, but it is possible that your exhaust isn't hooked up correctly creating noise, not sure how much that would effect the knock sensor however. it owuld be helpful to reduce your knock retard decay rate so we can see how random it really is.

i would say drive it easy til you run low on gas and refill with 93 and see if it goes away, or add a half gallon of e85 and see if that clears up your issue.

another thing to keep in mind is your boost is climbing in the upper rpms, most likely because you dont have the stock exhaust, i believe target boost pressure is 15.5 and you climb to 17. nothing major to worry about but just noting its existence

[smoogs12]

That log is huge.

Log 3rd or 4th gear from 2500-6k. Just mat it. Dont roll onto the throttle.

Also I recommend letting one of the guys on the forum make you a proper tune.

Just because your friend has an intake and exhaust doesn't mean he can tune the platform.




Edit: guess according time snail the log was good for what was needed. Was on my phone so couldn't open it.

Tapa

[mr speed]

well first off for being new here i appreciate your guys help and advice, means a lot hah

on that note that, i have a white speed3, and if u say it might have to do with the gas, its probably cause the gas station right by my house is arco and there gas is SHIT compared to everyone else but its just convenient, if that maybe the issue then i could presumably change the gas i put in...and i paid 70 dollars in a santa ana muffler shop, for a the exhaust job

second as snailD stated, is the spike in boost not supposed to happen, these are the parts where i get confused

[Dmurray06]

I believe stage 1 targets 16 psi peak. A proper tune will stop the spikes.

[mr speed]

well my friend is the owner of OCRace Shop - Subaru Performance Parts Performance Parts Mitsubishi parts Nissan - Homepage and hes got some extensive knowledge on tuning, he just tuned my buddys evo x with just a custom midpipe a greddy muffler from an evo 9 turned into single exit exhaust and cai and hes making 330 wheel...they actually just came back from streets of willow this weekend lol, but thats off topic

btw if anyone needs any parts i can get you guys discounts, like between 50% from cost and retail

[Zbrit00x]

Originally Posted by mr speed well first off for being new here i appreciate your guys help and advice, means a lot hah on that note that, i have a white speed3, and if u say it might have to do with the gas, its probably cause the gas station right by my house is arco and there gas is SHIT compared to everyone else but its just convenient, if that maybe the issue then i could presumably change the gas i put in...and i paid 70 dollars in a santa ana muffler shop, for a the exhaust job second as snailD stated, is the spike in boost not supposed to happen, these are the parts where i get confused

I asked about the station since I thought you'd used arco. That stuff is crap. From the stations in/around irvine I've found the chevron in Culver plaza and the shell off barranca to work best for me. If you need if I have spare e85 you can put some in to see if it clears up. Was your car parked in Beckman high school today by any chance?

[Dmurray06]

No disrespect to you friend, am an sure he's smart. But no one knows how to tune mazdas better than someone who ONLY tunes mazdas. They know how they will react to each bolt on and so on.

[mr speed]

yeah arco is crap, im gonna start putting shell as my buddy told me turbo cars love shell...and no it wasnt at beckman lol, another good friend of mine has the same car, just with black wheels, and he has the garage vary front grill and we both have a black diffuser...i think ive seen your car tho, by uci area...very clean btw

and i mean i dont wanna be bother but if the e85 helps im down to meet up if thats cool with u?

@Dmurray9 i completley agree with you, like i said im new to turbo cars...i used to have a 350z so this is a whole different story lol, and no hard feelings haha

[Zbrit00x]

Originally Posted by mr speed yeah arco is crap, im gonna start putting shell as my buddy told me turbo cars love shell...and no it wasnt at beckman lol, another good friend of mine has the same car, just with black wheels, and he has the garage vary front grill and we both have a black diffuser...i think ive seen your car tho, by uci area...very clean btw and i mean i dont wanna be bother but if the e85 helps im down to meet up if thats cool with u? @Dmurray9 i completley agree with you, like i said im new to turbo cars...i used to have a 350z so this is a whole different story lol, and no hard feelings haha

Yeah think I've met him at a hookah cafe, and I used to work in the store Alex used to work at ( after he left), I just checked and I'm out of e85 right now but since I'm going to be tuning for it I'm going to need to refill sometime soon.

[mr speed]

ooo sick so you know shahin with the white speed(he works at tuttle click mazda btw), alex, and nick...you should come to the alicia meets on thursdays there would be some juicy races for you man, id love to see your car run...btw my name is Iman

[GODspeed7]

Originally Posted by mr speed well first off for being new here i appreciate your guys help and advice, means a lot hah on that note that, i have a white speed3, and if u say it might have to do with the gas, its probably cause the gas station right by my house is arco and there gas is SHIT compared to everyone else but its just convenient, if that maybe the issue then i could presumably change the gas i put in...and i paid 70 dollars in a santa ana muffler shop, for a the exhaust job second as snailD stated, is the spike in boost not supposed to happen, these are the parts where i get confused

Don't ever go for convenience on gas. There are guys on here that go 30+ miles out of their way just for e85. Get quality gas from a quality station. If you have to travel 5 miles for 93, it's worth it.
Next the exhaust mods you have done should not be enough to warrant any sort of spikes. Both cats plus the stock k04 and TMIC are enough of a restriction to keep you dialed in. OTS maps have a +/- 1.5psi. If you want to be really consistent you should get an Etune from a person on here that knows what they are doing. I am using rfinkle2 and he keeps me dialed in not by WGDC as much as he does with the throttle plate. I am usually always within .5 psi of my targets. Try all of that and see where that gets you. I suggest reading a couple articles to get you started.
1. Abilors tuning guide. (a little outdated but a great tool)
2. Lex's knock retard explained
3. Bucker's ATR cheat sheet

[mr speed]

GODspeed7 your deffinatley right, and as for tuning im gonna wait off till i get a intake and downpipe, then ill pay for a tune wether a e tune or dyno...you guys kinda cleared up my dilema, im pretty sure its my exhaust knockin around cause that thing gets a good shaking when i punch it, sounds like a airplane turbine just shooting out air from the back end

[GODspeed7]

AMS is in Chicago and they are some of the best EVO guys around. They will not work on mazdas. Why? Because they know they don't know the platform like a Mazda guy. This is a FWD DI turbo. Not an AWD port injected turbo. Like said above no disrespect to your friend but I am confident that NO ONE knows this platform better than these guys on this forum.

[mr speed]

GODspeed7 then etune it is hah

[Zbrit00x]

Originally Posted by mr speed ooo sick so you know shahin with the white speed(he works at tuttle click mazda btw), alex, and nick...you should come to the alicia meets on thursdays there would be some juicy races for you man, id love to see your car run...btw my name is Iman

I went once and it was full of cocky kids and I didn't really know anyone. You talking about nick with the blue subie?

[GODspeed7]

Originally Posted by mr speed GODspeed7 then etune it is hah

There are many good guys to choose from but I have extensive interaction with rfinkle2 phate Bucker
But all of the tuners are listed somewhere and you will be safe in the hands of many.

[mr speed]

Originally Posted by Zbrit00x I went once and it was full of cocky kids and I didn't really know anyone. You talking about nick with the blue subie?

nick hes got the white evox, and a yellow z06....and yeah the kids there are all cocky our group is chill tho, we just sit back laugh plus we got the fastest cars there so its highly amusing...add me on facebook: iman josheghani

Originally Posted by GODspeed7 There are many good guys to choose from but I have extensive interaction with rfinkle2 phate Bucker But all of the tuners are listed somewhere and you will be safe in the hands of many.

i appreciate the advice man, ill be looking forward to getting a tune done

[DingoDave]

Anyone else find it odd that his LTFTs are 5.47 at WOT. When was the last time you did a MAF CAL and WOT CAL.

Also, this heat isn't helping things either. 96+ degree Intake Air Temps and 120+ BATs. A bad batch of gas could definately be adding to that knock as well.

[mr speed]

Originally Posted by DingoDave Anyone else find it odd that his LTFTs are 5.47 at WOT. When was the last time you did a MAF CAL and WOT CAL. Also, this heat isn't helping things either. 96+ degree Intake Air Temps and 120+ BATs. A bad batch of gas could definately be adding to that knock as well.

yeah the weather was disturbingly hot today, plus shitty arco gas...i think the solution would be the gas for the most part, cause honestly i dont see why my car would be acting up, and from me driving my car and driving my friends identical speed, my car felt faster(everyone tells me i have a factory freak) so idk haha

[mr speed]

Originally Posted by DingoDave Anyone else find it odd that his LTFTs are 5.47 at WOT. When was the last time you did a MAF CAL and WOT CAL. Also, this heat isn't helping things either. 96+ degree Intake Air Temps and 120+ BATs. A bad batch of gas could definately be adding to that knock as well.

well im not to familiar with the accessport so im not sure as to how i would go about calibrating them

[GODspeed7]

Originally Posted by mr speed well im not to familiar with the accessport so im not sure as to how i would go about calibrating them

Read those guides I told you about and after your head is done exploding you will be MUCH better off.

[Dash08]

Try a different Arco.

Arco is the same gas as the more expensive shit, it just has different additives. It doesn't matter where you get gas, it all comes from the same refinery.

The only thing you can do is find a different station that has better tank and pump maintenance.

The reason people think cheaper gas is shitty is because the station owners fail at maintenance. This is why the expensive brands are more desirable.

Chevron, 76, Shell, and Mobil are likely to see a more rigid maintenance plan over the low budget, run down stations.

If you see a station in your area that's been freshly paved. USE THAT SHIT!!! That means they just had their tanks maintained or replaced. They usually check the accuracy of the pumps at the same time.

[DingoDave]

The guides are full of info. Check this thread out too.

MAF Calibration Tutorial

[mr speed]

Heres my most recent log, and its from 2000 rpm in 3rd gear til redline and then shift to fourth

the knock seems to be gone, maybe my ecu just needed to adjust to the new map im guessing...lemme know what you guys think, im slowly catching onto the tuning concept

[smoogs12]

Originally Posted by mr speed Heres my most recent log, and its from 2000 rpm in 3rd gear til redline and then shift to fourth the knock seems to be gone, maybe my ecu just needed to adjust to the new map im guessing...lemme know what you guys think, im slowly catching onto the tuning concept

Did you change anything prior to this log?

Tapa

[Zbrit00x]

also you can take your logs up another approx 1k, the tach in the car reads higher than what it actually is. I guess it wouldnt really make a difference for an untuned ko4..but just for future reference when the mod bug is in full swing!

[fortressofcomfort]

I'd give my left nut for 120+ BATs. I've actually had the HIGH BAT flag come on once. Was idling a while in ambient 100*. Car was slow until LOW BAT flag was tripped (158*F ??)

And this ^^ "This is a FWD DI turbo. Not an AWD port injected turbo." This is an easy test. Ask your local tuner if you should get your fuel pump upgraded. If he says no, or what the one in the tank, then run, I mean drive fast outta there.

[GODspeed7]

Originally Posted by fortressofcomfort I'd give my left nut for 120+ BATs. I've actually had the HIGH BAT flag come on once. Was idling a while in ambient 100*. Car was slow until LOW BAT flag was tripped (158*F ??) And this ^^ "This is a FWD DI turbo. Not an AWD port injected turbo." This is an easy test. Ask your local tuner if you should get your fuel pump upgraded. If he says no, or what the one in the tank, then run, I mean drive fast outta there.

Yeah I think the highest BAT's I've seen sitting in traffic was 170's it scared the shit out of me!