Stock fuel pump rattle (again....)

[mhebert2001]

Topic is fuel pump rattle at tip in.

Ok, I know this topic has been touched on before, including once by yours truly. However, since the last time I posted this question I have researched everything I could find on the topic, and the reason I have not let this go, is that this seems to apply almost exclusively to owners with aftermarket fuel pumps (ie: cp-e)

To be fair there may be one or two exceptions to this, but for all I know myself and those 1 or 2 owners are all part of the same faulty batch of fuel pumps.

What I am trying to determine is how many MS3 owners have experienced, or are experiencing this in gen2’s with the STOCK fuel pumps.

Heck, I would even be interested in gen1 owners as long as their fuel pump is or was stock and they remember this happening while the car was still young.

Thanks for listening. Have a great weekend everyone!

[bigriver]

I have this with autotech internals on stock fuel pump. The autotech uses the stock spring. Cant recall if completely stock pump did the rattle at tip in.

If you were really curious, maybe go to the dealer and have them startup a new ms3 on the lot.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by bigriver I have this with autotech internals on stock fuel pump. The autotech uses the stock spring. Cant recall if completely stock pump did the rattle at tip in. If you were really curious, maybe go to the dealer and have them startup a new ms3 on the lot.

The only dealer that I feel comfortable, and wouldn't be bothered with sales would be the dealer I bought it from. I have contacted them and unfortunately they don't another in stock. They have one in transit but were not sure of the ETA.

[Ace]

What do you mean by "tip in"? I have a rattle noise around 2700+ rpm. I'm stock and have been reading thats it's normal.

[Ace]

Is the noise you're experiencing similar to the one described in this thread?

http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...ed-3-a-116945/

[bigriver]

Originally Posted by Ace Is the noise you're experiencing similar to the one described in this thread? http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...ed-3-a-116945/

There is another thread started by Lex I believe on fuel pump rattle.

Here.

fuel pump rattle

[XLT_66]

My KMD internals do this. I assume it means my engine is going to explode at any moment.

[tddvrrn]

i have a gen1 w/ stock pump and hear this as well, at light loads/part throttle.

i will say, though, that i don't hear mine much right now. however, when the temps dip in the fall and winter, it comes back...

[Ryguy]

Mine was noisy stock and noiser now with the auototech internals. It doesent bother me as long as it works.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by Ace What do you mean by "tip in"? I have a rattle noise around 2700+ rpm. I'm stock and have been reading thats it's normal.

When I say tip in I am talking about the first 1/8 inch of the gas pedal. So the scenario for me would be the following:

I am in 2nd or 3rd gear, normal driving, and let off the gas. Car is coasting along at say 2500 rpm, and then I lightly push the gas to accelerate and I get the rattle.

I does not matter what how long I have been driving. It will do it every time.

Truthfully it is still on my list to prove as normal. I wish I had an AP that I could hook up just to rule out any sort of pre ignition issue.

[Ace]

Hmm...mine rattles around 2500-3100k in 2nd and 3rd and it doesn't matter how much throttle i give it, TIP or almost WOT.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by Ace Hmm...mine rattles around 2500-3100k in 2nd and 3rd and it doesn't matter how much throttle i give it, TIP or almost WOT.

How long do you hear the rattle? Do you still hear it while you continue to accelerate?

[Spoofmastafly]

That's rod knock. Duh.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by Spoofmastafly That's rod knock. Duh.

Please keep your Protec helmet on, its for your own safety little buddy!

[Ace]

Any updates on this?

[scubasteve711]

Dealer just swapped out my pump after it or the RV valve decided to die and give me 400 psi at wot.... Haven't listened for the noise yet but for me on both stock internals and with the autotechs I would here the noise at just barely off neutral throttle inputs..... Around 2500-3000 it was the most pronounced.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by Ace Any updates on this?

Still trying to figure it out. I test drove another new MS3 and thought I heard something similar, but nowhere near as loud as mine, or as easy to duplicate.

Also the tech declared that there was NO sound present. I don't understand how he couldn't hear it but what can you do.

I tried to record it today while driving but you cant hear it.

I tried this recording with the hood up. I think the sound I am hearing in the video is the same as I hear while driving, but that's only a guess.

Any thoughts?

2012 Mazdaspeed - YouTube

2012 Mazdaspeed - YouTube

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by mhebert2001 Still trying to figure it out. I test drove another new MS3 and thought I heard something similar, but nowhere near as loud as mine, or as easy to duplicate. Also the tech declared that there was NO sound present. I don't understand how he couldn't hear it but what can you do. I tried to record it today while driving but you cant hear it. I tried this recording with the hood up. I think the sound I am hearing in the video is the same as I hear while driving, but that's only a guess. Any thoughts? 2012 Mazdaspeed - YouTube

Bump?

[Vader]

I have autotechs, and mine have been doing that for ~25K miles...

Logs look good, and never have any fueling issues.

I'm not worried about it.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by Vader I have autotechs, and mine have been doing that for ~25K miles... Logs look good, and never have any fueling issues. I'm not worried about it.

Do you happen to recall what it sounded like with the stock internals? Was it any different?

[CW42]

I have a 2007 and mine doesn't make that noise at all. I'm kind of worried that I DON'T have it if everyone else does. lol

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by CW42 I have a 2007 and mine doesn't make that noise at all. I'm kind of worried that I DON'T have it if everyone else does. lol

Great ....

LOL

[CW42]

To me, it sort of sounds like the noise our cars make when the timing chain loosens except yours doesn't sound near as erratic (it seems consistent sounding with the throttle) so I guess it might be something else. You never know.

[Ckmazdaspeed3]

So I have a rattle issue that I have been trying to solve. I keep worrying that it is my timing chain, but it is not present at cold start, is very rhythmic when happening, and my timing chain does not feel very loose. Unfortunately Matt at HTP says that does not guarentee that t is not the chain.

Anyway, mine happens sporadically and only at light throttle and light load. Pressing the gas pedal shuts it up and it varies in loudness, but for the most part is a constant speed. The sound is pretty rythmic. I notice it most in 2nd-4th and it is often present when lifting slightly on the gas from light load to lighter load... Logs look fine regarding fuel pressure.

I have never researched this, but is this similar to what you are experiencing?

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by Ckmazdaspeed3 So I have a rattle issue that I have been trying to solve. I keep worrying that it is my timing chain, but it is not present at cold start, is very rhythmic when happening, and my timing chain does not feel very loose. Unfortunately Matt at HTP says that does not guarentee that t is not the chain. Anyway, mine happens sporadically and only at light throttle and light load. Pressing the gas pedal shuts it up and it varies in loudness, but for the most part is a constant speed. The sound is pretty rythmic. I notice it most in 2nd-4th and it is often present when lifting slightly on the gas from light load to lighter load... Logs look fine regarding fuel pressure. I have never researched this, but is this similar to what you are experiencing?

Interesting. The conditions in which your noise becomes noticeable does seem similar to mine.

My engine has less then 2000 miles on it so I would hope it wouldn't be the timing chain, but I guess you never know.

When you say "light load", how light are you talking?

For mine it happens consistently as I transition from coasting to accelerating. However, as soon as the gears are loaded up, and I am accelerating, even slowly, the noise is not present. At least to my ears.

[Ckmazdaspeed3]

Pretty light load, and yeah, as load increases, the sound is quelled.

IT really is more at holding a constant speed with foot very lightly on pedal. I guess I will pull my pump and make sure erything looks pretty.

[Ckmazdaspeed3]

By light, I mean well under 1 and in closed loop only

[LakeSTLMS3]

OP, I've had KMD internals for about 20k miles now and at idle with my hood up, my fuel pump makes the same noise. I noticed it the second I fired up the car after installing my internals. However, the only time I can hear it is if I am standing outside the car. I have side mounts on now and all I hear is the tranny from inside the cabin.

[faeker]

There is a notable difference in noise levels when you swap internals. Dont worry.

tapahatericerfagstalk

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by mhebert2001 Still trying to figure it out. I test drove another new MS3 and thought I heard something similar, but nowhere near as loud as mine, or as easy to duplicate. Also the tech declared that there was NO sound present. I don't understand how he couldn't hear it but what can you do. I tried to record it today while driving but you cant hear it. I tried this recording with the hood up. I think the sound I am hearing in the video is the same as I hear while driving, but that's only a guess. Any thoughts? 2012 Mazdaspeed - YouTube

Ok this is making me fng crazy. I have tried my best to describe the noise I hear. I have posted a recording of it. I have brought it in to the dealer and had a tech go for a ride with me. I have test driven another new MS3 and yet I still don’t have an answer to whether this is normal or not.

Here are the issues or reasons for my continued confusion.

1. Almost everyone who down plays this sound as normal has modified something such as their internals. I can’t help but think that one modification alone might be the noise source in their cars.

2. The supposed top tech at the dealer said he didn’t detect the noise, so there is no point beating that dead horse.

3. The other MS3 I drove “may” have made a similar noise, but I can tell you it was nowhere near as apparent or as consistent as mine. Truthfully I might have imagined I heard something, in an effort to feel better.

So I have figured out nothing!

For those that have not listened to the video, please check it out. I have tried everything I can think of. I really could use a point of view from someone that has not modified their MS3, or can say with conviction that they ALL do this, even unmodified.

I love these cars and have managed to come to terms with other idiosyncrasies because I believe they probably are normal. However, this one I am really not sure about.

Thanks

[faeker]

I'm not sure why you want the noise to be something else, but those of us who have already done internals know the noise when we hear it. here is a vid from my car taken about 10 minutes ago:

internals - YouTube

same......damn.....noise.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by faeker I'm not sure why you want the noise to be something else, but those of us who have already done internals know the noise when we hear it. here is a vid from my car taken about 10 minutes ago: internals - YouTube same......damn.....noise.

I really appreciate you stepping out to record that. Thats super cool. So I say this with all due respect. All I hear is the rattle/ticking of a Mazda engine at idle. Every MS3 I have looked at will make that noise.

What I am talking about, and maybe it isnt that obvious in my video, is a different rattle that you can hear during the transition from revs going down to revs going up. Is not the consistent rattle/ticking you would hear if I let it sit there idling.

Do you know I mean by that?

Also, I am not trying to make it into something different. Because as far as I know it should be different as I have not done any upgrade, internals, or otherwise to my car yet.

[faeker]

I took another listen. There is definitely something going on in there. If the mechanic you went to earlier cant hear it, head to another dealership or get another mechanic to listen to it. I had thought you did internals. Thats obnoxiously loud for stock ones.

tapahatericerfagstalk

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by faeker I took another listen. There is definitely something going on in there. If the mechanic you went to earlier cant hear it, head to another dealership or get another mechanic to listen to it. I had thought you did internals. Thats obnoxiously loud for stock ones. tapahatericerfagstalk

Looks like I am off to the next dealer. Crap...

Thanks bigtime for your help. I will be sure to share the finding with everyone.

[mhebert2001]

Originally Posted by faeker I took another listen. There is definitely something going on in there. If the mechanic you went to earlier cant hear it, head to another dealership or get another mechanic to listen to it. I had thought you did internals. Thats obnoxiously loud for stock ones. tapahatericerfagstalk

Just wondering... what do you think might be causing this?

Why does the internals upgrade supposedly make simular noises?

[Godzilla]

I know EXACTLY what noise you are talking about, it is most evident just before the middle of your video, when you are applying light throttle. I wrote a full reply to your latest post, but I have this same rattle after Autotech internals install, and today the dealer told me that it is a fuel pump, particularly "HIGH PRESSURE FUEL CAP", although the pump diagnosed perfectly during the test. They told me it needs to be replaced, and this is what I am trying to figure out right now.

[mhebert2001]

Ok this is weird I just happened to stumble on my old thread with a reply you just posted.

I just did the Autotech internals last weekend and am having really bad rattling, especially when the motor is cold. This is far worse then with the stock bits.

I am not going to post anything on the forum until I pull the pump back out and visually inspect it as well as try to record the sound.

Until then the best way to describe the sound I am hearing would be a failed hydraulic lifter or massive valve noise.

When I first rolled out of my driveway, until it warmed up, it sounded like a diesel.

Please let us know what's happens with yours.

[faeker]

Originally Posted by mhebert2001 Ok this is weird I just happened to stumble on my old thread with a reply you just posted. I just did the Autotech internals last weekend and am having really bad rattling, especially when the motor is cold. This is far worse then with the stock bits. I am not going to post anything on the forum until I pull the pump back out and visually inspect it as well as try to record the sound. Until then the best way to describe the sound I am hearing would be a failed hydraulic lifter or massive valve noise. When I first rolled out of my driveway, until it warmed up, it sounded like a diesel. Please let us know what's happens with yours.

The stock internals are quiet. Aftermarket ones rattle like pennies in a can. See my vid.

tapahatericerfagstalk

[mhebert2001]

Do they make even more noise when cold?

Aside from that, why are they louder? Is it the button coming off the cam as it rotates that is causing this sound?

[faeker]

Its ridiculously loud on cold starts. I do not know why it is louder. Maybe its because the moving part has more mass.

tapahatericerfagstalk