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 Old 09-29-2015, 02:19 PM   #1
 
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Default How To: Solid Copper Coil Pack Spring Replacment

THIS IS NOT A PERFORMANCE MOD!!!

This mod only helps if you are experiencing "boost blow out" despite what you are gapping your plugs to.

The spring stretch mod does not do anything in my eyes, so I've seen bits and pieces of people putting solid copper in their coil packs to help the spark strength carried from the coil pack to the plug. Well let me tell you it is working great for me, no more blow out and here is how you do it!

Step 1: go to Lowes or Home Depot and buy yourself a foot or two of 4 gauge solid copper wire (go to the wire cutting area in the electrical department) it was less than $3 dollars for two feet for me.

Step 2: cut off a small section of the wire (to square it up to a nice flat surface I found that a brake line cutting tool works really well)

Step 3: cut four pieces of copper to roughly 2.5" (doesn't have to be machine work tolerance but get it as close as you can)


Step 4: pull your coil packs out of your car.

Step 5: separate the boot from the coil pack.

Step 6: pull the spring out (id recommend holding onto them just in case)

Step 7: reinstall the boot

Step 8: reinstall the coil packs (now at this point you need to check something, verify that the coil pack itself is close enough to the valve cover(where the screw goes) so when you tighten down the coil pack you wont crack it and vise versa if you put you coil pack on and the coil pack bottoms out where the screw goes, your copper is most likely too short)

Step 9: start it up! (you may have a misfire, just track down the cylinder more than likely your copper is too short and just cut another piece!)

Step 10: enjoy your boost without blow out any more!!!!
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 Old 09-29-2015, 02:22 PM   #2
 
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Blowout is a cocksucker.

Thanks for doing the write up. I had to hunt down the idea in whatever thread it was in once before.
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 Old 09-29-2015, 02:24 PM   #3
 
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Originally Posted by WetzMS3 View Post
Blowout is a cocksucker.

Thanks for doing the write up. I had to hunt down the idea in whatever thread it was in once before.
I found it in a couple threads but I thought it should be centralized so more people can find it easier and have a full write up on it.
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 Old 11-04-2015, 09:57 AM   #4
 
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I believe this should be a sticky and a retardedly simple and cheap mod that can help everyone.
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 Old 11-04-2015, 10:31 AM   #5
 
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@Raider;

Sticky this fine upstanding citizen!
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 Old 11-04-2015, 11:11 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by 865ms3 View Post
@Raider;

Sticky this fine upstanding citizen!
umm, it's already a sticky?
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 Old 11-04-2015, 02:28 PM   #7
 
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Originally Posted by MS3Shadow View Post

umm, it's already a sticky?
Tapa fail....I'll go be a noob somewhere else now

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 Old 11-04-2015, 03:02 PM   #8
 
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Any possible set back to this in the future?
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 Old 11-05-2015, 11:34 PM   #9
 
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Originally Posted by ms3gt08 View Post
Any possible set back to this in the future?
I'll just fire up the time machine and find out.
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 Old 12-19-2015, 05:45 PM   #10
 
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Originally Posted by blackms3_71 View Post
Any possible set back to this in the future?
the only set back I could possibly see is in like 100 years the copper will corrode if you don't put dielectric grease on the connections but honestly in my opinion, not a scientist, I think the copper will hold up as long if not longer than the stock springs that come in the coil packs.
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 Old 12-19-2015, 07:52 PM   #11
 
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Originally Posted by HOCKEYNUBE View Post
the only set back I could possibly see is in like 100 years the copper will corrode if you don't put dielectric grease on the connections but honestly in my opinion, not a scientist, I think the copper will hold up as long if not longer than the stock springs that come in the coil packs.

Well, what i was thinking of was the resistants in the metal spring vs the cooper rod. I am sure its not that big of a deal but its something that i thought of.
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 Old 12-24-2015, 04:35 PM   #12
 
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Originally Posted by blackms3_71 View Post
Well, what i was thinking of was the resistants in the metal spring vs the cooper rod. I am sure its not that big of a deal but its something that i thought of.
You may be right about the resistance but with a change in resistance is ignored do to these finding on ngk one step colder:

I change my plugs every 8k-10k miles (every other oil change or so) and gapped them to .025 (even on the k04)

Put my 5862 on and ran a base map hitting 24ish psi for a little while with plugs that already had roughly 7k on them.

Got some tuning down and was now targeting 28 psi, had to stop there because I was getting mad boost blowout.

Changed the plugs out and gapped them to .022, still was getting blow out not as bad but was still getting some.

So I found a picture and a comment buried on here in a build thread so I tried that (solid copper deal)

After the solid copper deal I was able to bump the boost up to 32 psi (while the plugs were still gapped at .022) and had no issues

Well after your comment above I wanted to see how much abuse 5k miles did at 32 psi to my plugs.

it blew to gap open from .022 to .028 and I NEVER had an issue with blow out
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 Old 12-24-2015, 05:21 PM   #13
 
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Copper will have less resistance than the steel springs. Copper is an extremely good conductor
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 Old 12-24-2015, 07:54 PM   #14
 
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Will keep this thread in mind if i ever have a issue.
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 Old 12-26-2015, 01:38 PM   #15
 
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Originally Posted by blackms3_71 View Post
Will keep this thread in mind if i ever have a issue.
I mean its a 6-10 dolla mod, may as well get it out of the way if you have a BT or are planning on one.

or save it for a rainy day mod.
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 Old 12-26-2015, 05:45 PM   #16
 
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Originally Posted by HOCKEYNUBE View Post
I mean its a 6-10 dolla mod, may as well get it out of the way if you have a BT or are planning on one.



or save it for a rainy day mod.

No issue on ko4 running 22 psi and spraying meth. But will keep it for a "rainy" day like you said
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 Old 03-03-2016, 07:16 PM   #17
 
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So I got copper wire from lowes today and told the guy I wanted 4 gauge so he cuts me 2 feet. I get home with it and crossreference the item number and it comes up as 8 gauge. It looks identical in size to the above picture though so hoping he is wrong. Going to do this mod next sparkplug change just because I can.
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 Old 04-25-2016, 11:11 AM   #18
 
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Originally Posted by speedfreak44 View Post
So I got copper wire from lowes today and told the guy I wanted 4 gauge so he cuts me 2 feet. I get home with it and crossreference the item number and it comes up as 8 gauge. It looks identical in size to the above picture though so hoping he is wrong. Going to do this mod next sparkplug change just because I can.
Can anyone confirm whether 4 gauge or 8 gauge is correct?
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 Old 04-25-2016, 11:13 AM   #19
 
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Its 4
Gauge. I mic'd it. He put the wrong part number on the tag was all
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 Old 04-25-2016, 11:54 AM   #20
 
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Also to clarify, cut these rods exactly 2.6" long and then take some sand paper and round the tips a little bit. Apply a little dielectric grease on the end going into the boot and the end touching the spark plug. 2.6" is perfect for the coil to still be able to seal the valvecover
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 Old 09-07-2016, 12:06 PM   #21
 
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I have never seen #4 AWG solid wire and I'm an electrician that works in a wire making plant. #6 Is the largest solid wire I've seen. Anything above that is stranded.

Send me a link.

Are you sure that's not a copper ground rod?
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 Old 09-07-2016, 12:09 PM   #22
 
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Originally Posted by Cheapspeed View Post
I have never seen #4 AWG solid wire and I'm an electrician that works in a wire making plant. #6 Is the largest solid wire I've seen. Anything above that is stranded.

Send me a link.

Are you sure that's not a copper ground rod?
Terminology may be different. It can be found at Home Depot, so it's not a rarity or anything.

Southwire (By-the-Foot) 4 Solid Bare Copper Wire-10644390 - The Home Depot
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 Old 09-07-2016, 12:14 PM   #23
 
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He's correct I just looked it up myself. That's a serious grounding wire.

Copper is excellent. Best conductor is silver. But that's a little more expensive.
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 Old 09-07-2016, 12:24 PM   #24
 
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Originally Posted by Cheapspeed View Post
He's correct I just looked it up myself. That's a serious grounding wire.

Copper is excellent. Best conductor is silver. But that's a little more expensive.
Since you looked it up, and are in an industry that would deal with this, do you have any suggested retailers that may be cheaper?

Are there any known lessor quality vendors to avoid?
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 Old 09-07-2016, 01:24 PM   #25
 
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Originally Posted by WetzMS3 View Post
Since you looked it up, and are in an industry that would deal with this, do you have any suggested retailers that may be cheaper?

Are there any known lessor quality vendors to avoid?
I'm working in a plant who competes with Southwire. Copper wire is universally spec'd the same as far as resistance so our calculations can be accurate for code reasons. Copper pipe for plumbing is an alloy that is not as conductive. What he has is fine for the purpose.
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 Old 07-07-2018, 03:26 AM   #26
 
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So the 4g copper rod is supposed to be 3/16 inches or 4.8-5mm in diameter, right?
Did anyone try 6g (5/32"/4mm) diameter copper rod?

It's pretty damn hard to source 5mm diameter copper solid wire in my area, they only sell it in 100 meters rolls and if I ask anyone on construction sites they all use multi-wire cables (with 3 to 5 5mm/0.1" diameter copper wires inside) because they are more flexible and less prone to issues with high temperature variations.
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 Old 07-09-2018, 12:32 AM   #27
 
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So the 4G cable is 5.19mm in diameter, and 21.15mm2 cross section surface.
Around here we have cables rated by the section surface in mm2, so we have cables of 16, 25 or 35 mm2. This means the cross section diameter is 4.5mm/0.177", 5.64mm/0.22" or 6.68mm/0.26".

So now my question for those who made this mod can you please tell me what are the restrictions when working with these coils? Is it the inside diameter of the coil, boot, or it's all about cross section?
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 Old 07-12-2018, 10:56 AM   #28
 
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Good. So I managed to source some 5mm diameter (4g basically) copper wire used in industrial power converters. The copper wire also has a pretty tough layer of enamel .
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 Old 07-12-2018, 11:38 AM   #29
 
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i'm sceptic of this thing.

Secondary voltage is very high, current is very low so the effect of a tiny resistance difference in that circuit would give marginal improvements.
Power = (Volt x volt) / R
You probably get less than 1 ohm reduction by doing this out of a total secondary circuit of few kilo-ohms....Does it really worth it ?
IMo it could create more chances for problems if the rod isn't perfectly fitted with exact spark plug length ? (Air gap is a lot more résistive than a spring.

One could probably get better results by improving 12v power and grounds to the coils instead...There you have low voltage high current and low circuit resistance.
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 Old 07-12-2018, 11:51 AM   #30
 
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Originally Posted by Jeff23spl View Post
i'm sceptic of this thing.
All I can do is try, because I have some issues (spark blow-out) which people reported they solved with this change.
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 Old 07-12-2018, 12:19 PM   #31
 
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ok but it may work just because you put new or different spark plugs too.

the 12v 5-15A power and ground is carried out by, let say 18awg wires (0.75mm2) so enlarging them would have a 1000times more effects. I wonder if the igniter inside the coil would resist to more than 14-15v. So voltage booster exist for fuel pumps that could work the same to increase coil power....
just going from 14 to 16volts could give a 30% more power.
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 Old 07-12-2018, 12:29 PM   #32
 
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looking for the boost a pump to give an exemple, i found that a module already exist to boost coils voltage to 18v
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 Old 07-12-2018, 12:47 PM   #33
 
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Originally Posted by Jeff23spl View Post
ok but it may work just because you put new or different spark plugs too.
Problem persisted after replacing the spark plugs with new ones gapped a bit tighter (0.6mm instead of 0.65).
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 Old 07-12-2018, 04:20 PM   #34
 
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Ok, as far as I can tell the spark blow-out is gone.
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2008 Cosmic Blue Mazda 3MPS
Bilstein B12 + CS Camber plates + Eibach camber arms, SSR Type-F, Michelin PS4 225/40/R18, Cobb RMM, StopTech Street Pads + Stoptech Slotted disks, SouthBend Enduro Stage3 clutch, genpu TMM + CS Insert, TheSpeedLine 2X Rear Cross Floor and Rear Middle Lower Strut bars, Tanabe 4 Point Under Brace, Whiteline Bumpsteeer corection kit
JBR Tru-3" + CS CAI Box, SU TMIC, Cobb XLE, NGK LTR7IX, UR v3 catted DP and res&catted TP, Cobb CatBack, GS EBCS, Autotech internals, GTX3071, CS 3.5BAR, Guardian Angel, CoolingMist WMI, VCTS Delete, stock ported IM
SP63 87.5mm 4032 9.5:1 pistons, Manley rods, CA625+ head studs, Clevite AL main bearings, King rod bearings, CP-e safe seals, DCR VVT, Koyorad radiator.
StratiVersaTuned FTW to 28PSI, self-tuned to 32PSI

2008 Icy Blue Mazda CX7 6 Speed Manual
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 Old 07-13-2018, 06:08 AM   #35
 
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Originally Posted by mituc View Post
Ok, as far as I can tell the spark blow-out is gone.
you mean that after installing the copper pins, it solved the issue ?
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 Old 07-13-2018, 01:33 PM   #36
 
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Originally Posted by Jeff23spl View Post
you mean that after installing the copper pins, it solved the issue ?
As far as I can tell yes, it's gone. I didn't even have to log that (didn't see much in the logs actually), the blow-out feels like an aggressive correction of some sort or like a gentle cut.
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Bilstein B12 + CS Camber plates + Eibach camber arms, SSR Type-F, Michelin PS4 225/40/R18, Cobb RMM, StopTech Street Pads + Stoptech Slotted disks, SouthBend Enduro Stage3 clutch, genpu TMM + CS Insert, TheSpeedLine 2X Rear Cross Floor and Rear Middle Lower Strut bars, Tanabe 4 Point Under Brace, Whiteline Bumpsteeer corection kit
JBR Tru-3" + CS CAI Box, SU TMIC, Cobb XLE, NGK LTR7IX, UR v3 catted DP and res&catted TP, Cobb CatBack, GS EBCS, Autotech internals, GTX3071, CS 3.5BAR, Guardian Angel, CoolingMist WMI, VCTS Delete, stock ported IM
SP63 87.5mm 4032 9.5:1 pistons, Manley rods, CA625+ head studs, Clevite AL main bearings, King rod bearings, CP-e safe seals, DCR VVT, Koyorad radiator.
StratiVersaTuned FTW to 28PSI, self-tuned to 32PSI

2008 Icy Blue Mazda CX7 6 Speed Manual
SU TMIC, Autotech HPFP internals, Cobb XLE, Cobb EBCS
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 Old 07-16-2018, 06:27 AM   #37
 
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I'm glad it works, but i'm still confused because the ohm law alone cannot explain why.
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 Old 07-16-2018, 08:02 AM   #38
 
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Originally Posted by Jeff23spl View Post
I'm glad it works, but i'm still confused because the ohm law alone cannot explain why.
I agree with you in beefing up the delivery system to the coils would yeild far greater results. But maybe the coiled wire in the coil packs is the weakest link and that is really all that needs fixed?
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 Old 07-16-2018, 08:57 AM   #39
 
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Originally Posted by Jeff23spl View Post
I'm glad it works, but i'm still confused because the ohm law alone cannot explain why.
...unless those steel springs start at some point to cause this.
I went out yesterday for a joy ride and the car pulls as hard as it should, it's back below 4s for 60-100mph where it was before, although now it may pull just as hard but in significantly warmer weather now. So I can resume my quest of boosting up to 32PSI and trying to hit 500bhp on this setup.
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JBR Tru-3" + CS CAI Box, SU TMIC, Cobb XLE, NGK LTR7IX, UR v3 catted DP and res&catted TP, Cobb CatBack, GS EBCS, Autotech internals, GTX3071, CS 3.5BAR, Guardian Angel, CoolingMist WMI, VCTS Delete, stock ported IM
SP63 87.5mm 4032 9.5:1 pistons, Manley rods, CA625+ head studs, Clevite AL main bearings, King rod bearings, CP-e safe seals, DCR VVT, Koyorad radiator.
StratiVersaTuned FTW to 28PSI, self-tuned to 32PSI

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 Old 07-16-2018, 11:00 AM   #40
 
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Originally Posted by kTaLgsTo View Post
I agree with you in beefing up the delivery system to the coils would yeild far greater results. But maybe the coiled wire in the coil packs is the weakest link and that is really all that needs fixed?
Good point, the fact it is coiled create an inductive parameter.

There is an inductive resistance value increasing with engine speed but it may also affect spark waveform.

Electronics use coils to transform an high peak of short duration into a lower peak of more duration....We want the opposite here...
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