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 Old 01-07-2011, 09:26 AM   #1
 
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Default 2010 Oil Analysis

Can anyone who has done oil analysis please post up your results so we can get a data base here for other Speed owners to compare with. I would post mine but I have 10% fuel dilution and had 15w/40 in car. My next sample will be with Amsoil XL 5W/30 with new turbo and 20,000miles.

here is a Blackstone report I found on another forum

P.S please list any engine mods.
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 Old 01-27-2011, 04:59 PM   #2
 
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Here is my 2 oil reports.
Sample 1 amsoil heavy duty diesel and Marine oil 15w/40 after 6,320km
spec for oil are AMSOIL - Synthetic Diesel & Marine Motor Oil SAE 15W-40 (AME)

TYPICAL TECHNICAL PROPERTIES
AMSOIL Synthetic SAE 15W-40 Heavy-Duty Diesel and Marine Motor Oil (AME)
Kinematic Viscosity @ 100C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 14.2
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 93.2
Viscosity Index (ASTM D-2270) 157
CCS Viscosity @ -20C, cP (ASTM D-5293) 4386
Pour Point C (F) (ASTM D-97) -42 (-44)
Flash Point C (F) (ASTM D-92) 238 (460)
Fire Point C (F) (ASTM D-92) 256 (493)
Four Ball Wear Test (ASTM D-4172B: 40 kg, 75C, 1200 rpm, 1 hour), Scar, mm 0.35
Noack Volatility, % weight loss (g/100g) (ASTM D-5800) 7.0
High Temperature/High Shear Viscosity
(ASTM D-4683 @ 150C, 1.0 X 106 s.-1, cP 4.3
Total Base Number 12.1

Sample 2 Amsoil XL 5w/30 after 2940km after turbo replacement
spec for oil are AMSOIL - Extended Life 5W-30 Synthetic Motor Oil (XLF)

TYPICAL TECHNICAL PROPERTIES
AMSOIL XL 5W-30 SYNTHETIC MOTOR OIL 5W-30
(XLF)

Kinematic Viscosity @ 100C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 10.9
Kinematic Viscosity @ 40C, cSt (ASTM D-445) 64.8
Viscosity Index (ASTM D-2270) 160
CCS Viscosity, cP @ (C) (ASTM D-5293) 5524 (-30)
Flash Point C (F) (ASTM D-92) 226 (439)
Fire Point C (F) (ASTM D-92) 240 (464)
Pour Point C (F) (ASTM D-97) -43 (-45)
Noack Volatility, % weight loss (g/100g) (ASTM D-5800) 10.5
High Temperature/High Shear Viscosity
@ 150C and 1.0 X 106 s-1, cP (ASTM D-5481) 3.3
Four Ball Wear Test @ 40 kgf, 75C,
1200 rpm, 1 hour, scar diameter, mm (ASTM D-4172) 0.44
Total Base Number (ASTM D-2896) 9.0

only engine mod is a dealer installed Mazda Speed CAI.

My car is a Lemon, no way I can change oil at 8,000km lucky I am using the best synthetic and always changed at 6,000km but last oil change after sample 2 was at 4,000km hence less fuel dilution!
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 Old 01-27-2011, 05:08 PM   #3
 
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Mazdaspeed 3/6 UOA Results
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 Old 02-17-2011, 03:58 PM   #4
 
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as the new Cobb acess port was released, with it is understanding tuning differrances PDF which explains some of the reason for my 10% fuel dilution.

I have also since found out the Logic for ECU for GEN1 And Gen2 is different in the way it reacts to DI fuel pressure drops. If Psi drop below 1600psi then it will increase the injector pulse width,(IPW) which puts an increased demand on the fueling system further dropping the DI fuel pressure.
ECU appears to be calibrated to increase the fuel injector pulse width once it sees DI Fuel Pressure drop below ~1600psi. When this occurs, the ECU will run the engine with excessive fuel hindering torque production.

So I guess with the higher fuel demands of the Intake plus the demands when the car is in boost and the new ECU logic when pressure drops below 1600psi the car begins over fuelling as it increases injector pulse width. My car in stock setup at W.O.T,(wide open throttle) is seeing 1670psi so there is only a 70psi cushion before over fuelling begins with this new ECU logic as the stock CDFP,(Cam Driven Fuel Pump) was not upgraded to reflect the changing demands of this new ECU logic which increases injector pulse width,(IPW) which further strains DI fuel pressure. Hence why Gen 1 does not see this problem as it leans out slightly rather than put increased demands on an already max out Cam Driven Fuel Pump.

Once I get next oil sample back we will see if the Fuel dilution falls back to within acceptable limits or if I am still getting fuel mixing with oil at higher than normal levels.

I took off my dealer instaled MazdaSpeed CAI,T.I.P,BPV,Corksport recirculationtube and intercooler boost tubes.

On a foot note with a CAI,TIP,and cat-back exhaust if you were to run a cobb stage 2 tune the boost would be limited to 14psi as that is all the CDFP can support so if you think the stock turbo is spooling at 15.66psi this fuel system is already within 70-100psi of its limits before over fueling begins!!
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 Old 06-24-2011, 09:43 AM   #5
 
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MCI's official response after only OBD2 testing!!! 10% fuel in oil after 6,000km and viscosity broken down by from a 40-30 grade is normal,5% fuel in oil after 3,000km with slight viscosity breakdown is normal????

MAZDA Canada official response

Please be assured that MCI remains committed to complying with its responsibilities in the the 2010 warranty booklet for the 2010 Mazdaspeed3. As such, where a warrantable defect in Mazda Materials or workmanship is VERIFIED by an authorized Mazda Dealer, then the necessary steps will be taken pursuant to the Mazda warranty. Conversely however, where a warrantable defect has not been confirmed by an authorized Mazda Dealer, then the cost of any repairs will be at my sole expense as owner of the vehicle.

Wow so oil reports are garbage in Mazda's eyes!!! What Mazda dealer does oil analysis lol?? if I had coolant in my oil this would not show in the OBD2 system but a blown engine would be confirmed very easily!!!

MCI wants me to do oil change even sooner than the 3,000km changes I am doing if I am concerned about the fuel in the oil. WoW no more Amsoil synthetic for me, no more frequent changes for me, I will go 4 mth and 8,000km with the great Mazda Mineral oil!!!

will post more documentation on this!!
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 Old 06-24-2011, 09:47 AM   #6
 
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Originally Posted by Kris Speed3 CWP View Post
MCI's official response after only OBD2 testing!!! 10% fuel in oil after 6,000km and viscosity broken down by from a 40-30 grade is normal,5% fuel in oil after 3,000km with slight viscosity breakdown is normal????

MAZDA Canada official response

Please be assured that MCI remains committed to complying with its responsibilities in the the 2010 warranty booklet for the 2010 Mazdaspeed3. As such, where a warrantable defect in Mazda Materials or workmanship is VERIFIED by an authorized Mazda Dealer, then the necessary steps will be taken pursuant to the Mazda warranty. Conversely however, where a warrantable defect has not been confirmed by an authorized Mazda Dealer, then the cost of any repairs will be at my sole expense as owner of the vehicle.

Wow so oil reports are garbage in Mazda's eyes!!! What Mazda dealer does oil analysis lol?? if I had coolant in my oil this would not show in the OBD2 system but a blown engine would be confirmed very easily!!!

MCI wants me to do oil change even sooner than the 3,000km changes I am doing if I am concerned about the fuel in the oil. WoW no more Amsoil synthetic for me, no more frequent changes for me, I will go 4 mth and 8,000km with the great Mazda Mineral oil!!!

will post more documentation on this!!
FWIW, most of the guys here, and other people who have direct injection motors have switched to Pennzoil or Rotella, specifically for its resistance to fuel dilution.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 09:53 AM   #7
 
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holy shit...... Kris Speed3 CWP..... are you still not happy with your car????? like I said multiple times a year ago, just sell your ms3 and get something else

and yes.. Pennzoil Platinum FTW
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 Old 06-24-2011, 11:02 AM   #8
 
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Specifically Pennzoil Platinum 10W-30 due to its low volatility.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 11:57 AM   #9
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10?
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 Old 06-24-2011, 12:49 PM   #10
 
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Originally Posted by Tokay444 View Post
10?

Good eye!
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 Old 06-24-2011, 12:54 PM   #11
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Yup, Pennzoil Platinum is the way to go. The Shell Rotella is good too.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 01:45 PM   #12
 
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in 10w-30
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 Old 06-24-2011, 02:17 PM   #13
 
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FYI - Penn Ultra is on sale at Wally World for $29 + a $3 off coupon = $26 on the 5 qt jug.
I picked up a few at that price!
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 Old 06-24-2011, 03:46 PM   #14
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What makes the Ultra different from the Platinum? From what I read the Platinum gets great reviews.
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 Old 06-24-2011, 03:59 PM   #15
 
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It's more expensive, so it has to be much better right? lol
Not sure to tell you the truth
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 Old 06-24-2011, 04:30 PM   #16
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Up here, the platinum is more expensive than the ultra.
And why would you put that euro 5-w40 in 10-40?
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 Old 06-24-2011, 11:43 PM   #17
 
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Originally Posted by JS + MS3 View Post
holy shit...... Kris Speed3 CWP..... are you still not happy with your car????? like I said multiple times a year ago, just sell your ms3 and get something else

and yes.. Pennzoil Platinum FTW
Are you Ignorant or what??? Do an oil analysis and see what your Fuel dilution is after your service interval, it will probably be 0.5% fuel dilution!! Go f**k your self asshole. Look at my Lab reports there is an issue with fuel entering oil it has nothing to do with type of oil I am using. Amsoil was used to protect my investment hoping MCI would find out why my car runs a fuel dilution of 10% where the maximum allowable is 1.5% from polaris laboratories and 2% from Blackstone labs.

Please do not comment on something you know nothing about!! Oil Analyzers INC. has never received any condemnation from any manufacturer that is higher than 5% but with that said, only with the stipulation that viscosity must not be broken down! So for MCI to say that 10% is normal with viscosity and grade of oil being broken down is a farce!!

Please I love my car but to have it 10-15yrs with OEM engine is not possible with this mechanical issue period!! I have had friends with Gen1 with blown engines after 40,000km stock they do not know why they just get a re-manufactured engine under warranty!

So I guess I will have to try to resolve this issue on my own or give MCI a blown engine which they can diagnose and fix under warranty! What a great solution buy a new car to have engine replace with a rebuilt unit and put it in your car GREAT!! What was the point of buying new??

JS + MS3 before you start flaming asshole or bringing irrelevant info to this thread go get yourself an Oil analysis and post that and then you can join the discussion!!! your input or oil suggestion means shit without facts.

P.S Rotella would be the best choice Amsoil or Total as well but fact is my car will destroy any oil with this mechanical problem! So why would I prolong it with using any of these synthetic oils to have my car not in a warranty period when it does fail??
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 Old 06-25-2011, 12:02 AM   #18
 
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I can only use 5W/30 in my car MCI would just love any excuse not to warranty my car! I have been using Amsoil XL for all my Oil samples with 3,000km oil changes at 5% fuel dilution with viscosity breakdown, besides the first one that MCI had put 15W/40 amsoil heavy duty diesel and marine synthetic prior to new turbo which was 10% fuel dilution at 6,000km and oil was sheared down to a 15W/30.

Now I am using Amsoil OE to try and keep costs down with frequent changes but will probably revert back to mineral oil from Mazda with their oil filter and let the problem Polaris Laboratories found which is not an Authorized Mazda Dealer which of course no defect has been confirmed by an Authorized Mazda Dealer, so therefore there is no warranty defect that an authorized Mazda dealer can fix, run its course so there will be something an Authorized Mazda Dealer can fix during my warranty period.
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 Old 06-25-2011, 12:08 AM   #19
 
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tl

dr

wtf
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 Old 06-25-2011, 05:32 AM   #20
 
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Out of all the people that got banned on this forum, I still do not understand how you continue to exist here, with your insistent rants about chopping exhaust tips off to stop soot flying on your hatch, then you recommend filling the stock exhaust tips with expanding foam, and NOW your wanting Mazda to warranty your fuel dillution when there is NO fix for this mechanically.

You've brought nothing useful yet, and have proven to maintain your terrible credibility. I award you no points, and may god have mercy on your soul.
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 Old 06-25-2011, 06:09 AM   #21
 
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So what are you trying to do? Get MAZDA to replace your engine because of fuel in your oil???

Every one of us get fuel in our oil, hence why we use good oil and change frequently. Most performance cars that run rich get fuel in their oil. Don't know what else to say.

Buy a Hybrid maybe!
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 Old 06-25-2011, 06:10 AM   #22
 
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Platinum 10W-30 has lowest volatility of any Platinum or Ultra. Low volatility equals less crap on intake valves either with or without a catch can. Temps around here make 10 weight work ok for me during the winter.
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 Old 06-25-2011, 08:32 AM   #23
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Kris, you need new piston rings.
/thread.
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 Old 06-25-2011, 02:24 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by ROADWAR View Post
Platinum 10W-30 has lowest volatility of any Platinum or Ultra. Low volatility equals less crap on intake valves either with or without a catch can. Temps around here make 10 weight work ok for me during the winter.
So would I be better off running that over 5-30 Platinum on a stock MS3 in north FL?
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 Old 06-26-2011, 01:50 AM   #25
 
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i just change my oil every 3k miles with Pennzoil Platinum 5w-30 and call it a day.

real simple.
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 Old 06-26-2011, 05:18 AM   #26
 
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Originally Posted by Kris Speed3 CWP View Post
I can only use 5W/30 in my car MCI would just love any excuse not to warranty my car! I have been using Amsoil XL for all my Oil samples with 3,000km oil changes at 5% fuel dilution with viscosity breakdown, besides the first one that MCI had put 15W/40 amsoil heavy duty diesel and marine synthetic prior to new turbo which was 10% fuel dilution at 6,000km and oil was sheared down to a 15W/30.

Now I am using Amsoil OE to try and keep costs down with frequent changes but will probably revert back to mineral oil from Mazda with their oil filter and let the problem Polaris Laboratories found which is not an Authorized Mazda Dealer which of course no defect has been confirmed by an Authorized Mazda Dealer, so therefore there is no warranty defect that an authorized Mazda dealer can fix, run its course so there will be something an Authorized Mazda Dealer can fix during my warranty period.
Kris, have you taken a look @ BITOG (Bobistheoilguy)?... I don't know how much Amsoil is if you are concerned about frequent oil changes, but PP can't be too much more.

If you put any faith into the oil analysis, I've seen Blackstone UOA's that were recommending longer service intervals for PP on the Mazdaspeed3 than 3,000 miles.

Try not to worry so much about the car. It seems that you are going to take good care of it, and some things are simply beyond our control. Enjoy the car for what it is if you can, a sports car...
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 Old 06-26-2011, 05:45 AM   #27
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Something is wrong with his car though.
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 Old 06-26-2011, 09:53 AM   #28
 
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Originally Posted by Tokay444 View Post
Something is wrong with his car though.
Ahh.. I see that now. Thanks and my apologies.

TBH, I hadn't read the actual analysis, because I was under the assumption that he was simply seeing some fuel dilution.

Maybe...that particular oil that you were using is very susceptible to dilution?
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 Old 06-26-2011, 09:56 AM   #29
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even still, 10%
it's as if he doesn't even have piston rings...
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 Old 06-28-2011, 09:01 AM   #30
 
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Originally Posted by BLK MS3 View Post
So would I be better off running that over 5-30 Platinum on a stock MS3 in north FL?
Yep you'd be fine particularly in the Florida temps.
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 Old 06-28-2011, 09:17 PM   #31
 
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 Old 07-27-2011, 12:13 AM   #32
 
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Here is my latest Oil analysis done at 1,500km, Polaris laboratories actually tests for fuel dilution and does not guesstimate based on flash point like some labs do. For gasoline engine oil the max you can test for is 5% fuel dilution this is all that can be tested for. In diesels you can test for 10% fuel dilution because it is less volatile. My first test at 6,000km I had amsoil 15W/40 heavy duty diesel and marine oil, for test 2-4 at 3,000km I had amsoil 5W30 XL and for the most recent at 1,500km I had Amsoil OE 5W/30 all synthetic oils.

There is something wrong when MCI refuses to do any mechanical tests to determine problem, they will only go by OBDII diagnostic which is not what my problem is as it shows electronics are fine. This is not rocket science!!
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 Old 07-27-2011, 12:19 AM   #33
 
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holy fuck kris, i hate you. we don't care. we know this.
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 Old 07-27-2011, 12:20 AM   #34
 
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I have tested a 2010 Speed3 with slight mods and AP and at 3,000km the fuel dilution is 2.6% with fuel dilution making oil come in slightly below grade. CAstrol Edge 5W/30 was oil used. If others have Polaris lab tests please post results as we can actually know what fuel dilution others are seeing and what effects on the oil used.
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 Old 07-27-2011, 12:36 AM   #35
 
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Originally Posted by speedyD View Post
holy fuck kris, i hate you. we don't care. we know this.
I guess you did not get the memo from Haltech!! If you have nothing valuable to say, then don't! ppl like you need to get banned and turfed from forums if you can't keep your negative comments to yourself!! Do not speak for everyone with your ignorant comments!! just do not reply unless you have a oil analysis to share!

Obviously if the Gen2 community is seeing high fuel dilution which is causing viscosity breakdown as shown in oil analysis, then the Mazda service schedule is incorrect in their recommendations for mineral oil and service intervals if the oil is falling below the Manufacturer required 5W/30 after 3,000km!

For Gen2 owners who follow the Mazda service book and go the distance on Mazda recommendation, they could actually be doing harm to their cars whether or not there fuel dilution problem is as severe as mine. At the end of the day it is to help out the Gen2 owners protect their investments that is the end goal. Thats what forums are meant to do help people with a common concern or problem!

SO yes your comments are totally unnecessary!!!!!!
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 Old 07-27-2011, 12:44 AM   #36
 
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Originally Posted by Kris Speed3 CWP View Post
I guess you did not get the memo from Haltech!! If you have nothing valuable to say, then don't! ppl like you need to get banned and turfed from forums if you can't keep your negative comments to yourself!! Do not speak for everyone with your ignorant comments!! just do not reply unless you have a oil analysis to share!

Obviously if the Gen2 community is seeing high fuel dilution which is causing viscosity breakdown as shown in oil analysis, then the Mazda service schedule is incorrect in their recommendations for mineral oil and service intervals if the oil is falling below the Manufacturer required 5W/30 after 3,000km!

For Gen2 owners who follow the Mazda service book and go the distance on Mazda recommendation, they could actually be doing harm to their cars whether or not there fuel dilution problem is as severe as mine. At the end of the day it is to help out the Gen2 owners protect their investments that is the end goal. Thats what forums are meant to do help people with a common concern or problem!

SO yes your comments are totally unnecessary!!!!!!
your threads are unecessary! no haltech did not send a memo about me being able to say holy fuck kris i hate you. it was about new member threads, and your not a new member so go fuck yourself.

im telling you the fuel dilution is nothing new, and thats why we change our oil at 3k miles and run PP.

im never replying to you again.

good day
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 Old 07-27-2011, 09:21 AM   #37
 
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Speedy D if that was the case and your comments on everyone dumping oil at 3,000k were true, why are some dealerships still saying not to use synthetic oil???

SO lets get this straight you have never got an oil analysis to see what your engine is doing, or how the life of your oil is after a period of time and adjust maintenance intervals accordingly. For all you know you could have 2% fuel dilution and no viscosity breakdown at your current mileage and your wasting perfectly good oil, who knows your car might even be able to hit manufacturers recommended interval?? The fact is you do not know and will never know definitively until you have documentation.

There is a saying," those who ask questions look like a fool for a minute, but those who don't remain a fool for life!"

If you want to remain ignorant then that your prerogative but don't flap your gum until you have facts in hands..

Here is a link and for the low price of $28 for the advance kit you can gain some knowledge about your car and not just guess!!
Polaris Testing Kits
Polaris Testing Kits

I would love to see your results posted here, then we would have something to talk about and for anyone else that might be on the same page as you.

p.s if your just guessing on when your oil needs to be changed you might as well put in
5W/40 synthetic as it will not fall below recommended grade as soon.

Thank-you everyone and please check out the best place to do testing that actually measures fuel dilution Oil Analysis, Coolant Analysis, Fuel Analysis, Metalworking Fluid Analysis, Fuel Testing, Oil Testing, Coolant Testing — POLARIS Laboratories™
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 Old 07-27-2011, 10:48 AM   #38
 
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Using synthetic and 3k oil change intervals are not the same jackass. I use Penz Platinum and do 5k intervals now. Before I was using regular oil with 3k intervals. No problems. The oil smells like fuel when I change it. I get over it.
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 Old 07-27-2011, 12:17 PM   #39
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Kris, just change your oil at the recommended service interval, and keep all your receipts. When it blows, you'll still be under warranty and you can stick it to mca.
The rest of what you're saying is falling on def ears.
Donate.
/thread.
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 Old 07-28-2011, 12:22 AM   #40
 
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Originally Posted by Bucker View Post
Using synthetic and 3k oil change intervals are not the same jackass. I use Penz Platinum and do 5k intervals now. Before I was using regular oil with 3k intervals. No problems. The oil smells like fuel when I change it. I get over it.
Not sure what documentation you have to back up those statements of yours, but I have shown Synthetic oil Amsoil and Castrol Edge have both shown viscosity breakdown after 3,000k one with <5% fuel dilution and other with 2.6% fuel dilution.

We would all love to see your Oil analysis from Polaris labs with your Penzoil Platinum at your 5,000km interval to back up half of your statement as we would not expect you to put mineral oil in your car and do your 3,000k interval. Mineral oil will fair worse than synthetic we all know this! So with the knowledge that we have already, the mineral oil if we tested it would be worse than synthetic period!

go to Oil Analysis, Coolant Analysis, Fuel Analysis, Metalworking Fluid Analysis, Fuel Testing, Oil Testing, Coolant Testing — POLARIS Laboratories™ and get an advance test kit for $28 and you can post and discuss results and if you feel so inclined to continue with the name calling "jackass" then so be it!

If you read the first post it explains to post your test results so we can benefit other Gen2 owners not this he said she said B.S and trust me my car runs great with this or that. I thought most MazdaSPeed Forum members were smarter than this!

Pay your $28 to Polaris and then you can say what ever it is you want about what ever product you use and intervals because you have proof that what your doing is correct and working!
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