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 Old 01-09-2013, 07:48 PM   #1
 
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Default The Official "2nd Gear Is Dead" Thread

Well, the dreaded 2nd gear popout/grind is a well known issue for our platform. I'm currently in the process of getting mine fixed(and fighting Mazda for my warranty). It aggrivates me immensely to know that it's such an issue, has happened to multiple cars, and not only do they not fix the issue at production, they give many of us an issue as far as covering it. I've decided to start an official thread on this and see if we can get somewhere with it. Also, in the case of mods/waranties, there are 2 laws: The Lemon Law: http://www.carlemon.com/ As well as the Magnuson-Moss Act, which basically states that a dealer/car corporation cannot deny warranty work based solely on the fact that you have aftermarket parts. They have to actually physically be able to prove the mods caused your issue/failure.
So what I want is:
Year/Model(speed3/6)
Mileage 2nd gear started acting up/went
How it happened/progressed
When it happened ie down/upshifting
Stock? or what mods? Shifter parts ie sts, knob, etc.
Using FoMoCo fluid?
Was it covered/repaired
Did it happen again?

I need anyone who's ever had an issue to post.
2010 Mazdaspeed3
10,500 Miles
Went to downshift to 2nd gear, in a parking lot and it popped out when I let the clutch out. It progressed from there throughout 2 days, to finally not going in at all on an up/downshift
At the time I had intake, blowoff valve, Cobb Accessport, Full Exhaust, full motor mounts, Stage 2 tune
It was covered, and they replaced the trans.
Now, at 35,000 miles the issue has happened again.
Pretty much the exact same situation but at a slower pace. @Raider; would you mind helping me with this? Maybe make it a sticky if you think we should?

@dantes5823; @amggilly305; @NJSPEED3; @TWOptSL0W; @ArcticSpeed3; @bf360; @rigor; @Blck350z; @MS3-a(sore)ASS-rex; @johnheer; @kramer; @JimmyMac; @occschemguy; @MS6 Alan; @clos561; @06Speed6; @mazspeedshiz; @Captain KR; @kteevan;
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 Old 01-09-2013, 07:52 PM   #2
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Same issue, still works tho. It has its days. Also @Payne Racing 67; maybe include trans fluid just to know all the variables, maybe shifter parts as well.

12' Speed3
Not sure on mileage but early teens.
Probably fully bolted already.
Popped out of gear one day.
Sure SSP. Fomoco trans fluid.
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:00 PM   #3
 
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Originally Posted by dantes5823 View Post
Same issue, still works tho. It has its days. Also @Payne Racing 67; maybe include trans fluid just to know all the variables, maybe shifter parts as well.

12' Speed3
Not sure on mileage but early teens.
Probably fully bolted already.
Popped out of gear one day.
Sure SSP. Fomoco trans fluid.
Thanks Noted
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:03 PM   #4
 
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Dan needs to be in here
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:11 PM   #5
 
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A quote from @06Speed6; in his thread:Broken gears, shift forks, and syncros which basically sums up the issue:
"The synchros are crap which makes it hard to get into the next gear which wears or bends the shift fork which causes the synchro to not fully engage which causes the gears to not completely engage which causes the gear teeth to wear and break which causes the gear grind we have and the inability to use a gear."

Originally Posted by BobtailedSnail View Post
Dan needs to be in here
Yes him and Joe, can you tag them? Also @superskaterxes; had the issue at one point
@mrdouble99; @Cmoney82; @Nataphen; @Raysfan; @speed3Texas; @BoostinBA; @MS_Driver; @jellowood; A quote from him: "I have the 2nd gear pop out issue at 19,500 miles. Just took it in today and they're talking with Mazda. Mechanic said he saw on their "Techline" that their were numerous speed 3 issues with bushings and fork issues" @harryclay; @akbrazil; @DISIindahead; @ckurth; @alphasaur; @turd burglar; @sliversurfer3; @reddeerspeed3; @England15j; @speed3sailor;
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:13 PM   #6
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What's the cost for the repair?
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:20 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
A quote from @06Speed6; in his thread:Broken gears, shift forks, and syncros which basically sums up the issue:
"The synchros are crap which makes it hard to get into the next gear which wears or bends the shift fork which causes the synchro to not fully engage which causes the gears to not completely engage which causes the gear teeth to wear and break which causes the gear grind we have and the inability to use a gear."



Yes him and Joe, can you tag them? Also @superskaterxes; had the issue at one point
@mrdouble99;
Im gonna retract part of that. Lets try this again...

The shift fork pads are made of nylon which hardens over hundreds of heat cycles and begins to crack, the cracks weaken the pad and slowly become larger, eventually the pad starts breaks apart and you begin to lose the ability to fully engage the syncro which damages the syncro teeth which lose the ability to hold a gear because they are not fully meshing because the broken shifter pad can no longer push them far enough together.

Thats better.
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:24 PM   #8
 
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36000 miles lost plastic pads on 1st 2nd gear fork
paid to fix myself, voided warranty for catless exhaust. damn dealers
local trans shop $1800.00
never had any grinds just gone, all at once.
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:26 PM   #9
 
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I've only ever driven my Mazdaspeed so IDK if im experiencing the same issue but I do get a second gear grind occasionally.

2006 Mazdaspeed6
110k
Royal Purple MTF


I haven't had it pop out on me, but I did find that if i change the pressure on the shifter I can get it to shift without grinding pretty consistently. If I press to hard to the left when shifting from 1st to 2nd I get crazy grind, 50% wont even go into the gear and is a SOB. I've found by allowing it to be in a neutral position from first to second, I shift with just my pointer and middle finger I get a butter smooth shift. Seems like my alignment is off, if that makes sense. I saw a thread that someone posted about fine tuning the shift knob, i might give this a try and see if that improves the shifting quality.
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:28 PM   #10
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I guess that I should explain something else too, when you pop out of gear you arent actually poping out of gear, the gears are constantly meshed and cannot seperate. Instead they free spin on a shaft and are connected to one half of the syncro, the other half of the syncro is connected to the shaft. The shifter fork pushes both halves of the syncro together which connects the gear to the shaft. So when it pops out of gear, it is actually the splined halves of the syncro poping apart because they arent fully seated.
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 Old 01-09-2013, 08:40 PM   #11
 
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Originally Posted by Lex View Post
What's the cost for the repair?
They said $4000...but the guy literally went in, saw the mods, and said that based on that, and the cars "previous history" they can't do it. As per the Magnuson-Moss Act, they by law, cannot do that. I'd like to know what "previous history" the car has had because it's news to me. The only thing I've ever brought the car in for other than routine maintenence was the first time SECOND GEAR died...which in that case would maybe make the guy think that obviously it's a defect in these cars??
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#HAR Hidden Agendas Racing
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 Old 01-09-2013, 11:40 PM   #12
 
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2010 speed 3
Problem started around 33k miles would only pop out of gear when slowing down for bumps. Now 2 weeks later i have to physically hold it into 2nd.
Car is bolted minus the manifolds and tuned with an act 6 puck, jbr ssp, knob, bushings and mounts
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 Old 01-10-2013, 12:44 AM   #13
 
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Mine started 2 weeks after going big turbo, started popping out of gear then two days later no second at all.18000 miles on 2012
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 Old 01-10-2013, 12:54 AM   #14
 
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all need aluminum fork pads
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 Old 01-10-2013, 12:55 AM   #15
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This is seriously a nightmare. Can't believe this happens to so many people.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 02:41 AM   #16
 
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08 ms3
Pops out of 2nd gear on decel
Started around 40-50k


....also caused motor to explode...twice
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 Old 01-10-2013, 03:17 AM   #17
 
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2009 Mazdaspeed 3

First time happened around 15k miles. Had it rebuilt under warranty. Lost 2nd and 4th maybe 20k later. Received new trans under warranty.

Fully bolted except manifolds on stock clutch. Also had a short shifter which I think is partially to blame. Now just base bushings and a heavy knob and shits butter.

Popped out on decel, had to physically hold it in place. 4th quit life completely.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:11 AM   #18
 
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2010 ms3 - purchased with around 30k and at 38k now.

Mine grinds into 2nd when I try to shift quickly. No issues with it popping out (yet).

Added a JBR SSP, CS RMM inserts, and FO MO CO fluid. Better but still does it on occasion.

Matt
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 Old 01-10-2013, 06:30 AM   #19
 
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2006 MazdaSpeed6(RIP)
44k when purchased.
Problem occurred at around 50k
One day I down shifted into 2nd gear going maybe 20 mph and I noticed it was not in gear anymore. Sometimes the car would grind in this gear as well along with upshifting it would pop out depending on how I would shift I guess you can say but I did notice that would happen sometimes. Now I'm not sure if you guys can tell but while the car is in 2nd gear keep a light hand on the shifter and you'll feel the car coming out of gear there will be a vibration from the shifter. Now the car was completely stock no accidents or anything at this point in time. This issue was not fixed I got hit with the wear and tear bull shit so it was not covered but also, anybody who lives in the upstate NY area do not go to Compass Motors in Middletown NY,10940 they ruined my stock motor and forced me to do a build on my car screw them bastards.


First post was for you Mr. Payne!

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 Old 01-10-2013, 06:38 AM   #20
 
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Mine is only angry when its cold, as soon as it warms up its fine. I also have the fomoco fluid.......

I am sure I will be on this list eventually.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 06:52 AM   #21
 
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Here is a Youtube video showing the issue, and there are numerous comments from others with the issue.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 07:00 AM   #22
 
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Sort of seems like a different material is needed for these shift pads. If people are losing gears with >30k miles, some serious wear is happening here.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 07:44 AM   #23
 
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Mine was Completely gone by 18,000 miles on a 2012 ,,, I'm missing my Subi
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 Old 01-10-2013, 07:53 AM   #24
 
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Originally Posted by danieldolina70 View Post
Mine was Completely gone by 18,000 miles on a 2012 ,,, I'm missing my Subi
Yup its ridiculous. If it doesnt work, join me in going back to the Mustang world???
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 Old 01-10-2013, 08:27 AM   #25
 
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08.5 MS3

33k miles.

I do not have problems popping OUT of 2nd gear, however, I DO have problems getting INTO 2nd gear if i shift anywhere under 2500 rpm from first.

I've found that if i double clutch 2nd it goes in smooth without a problem. While it is a pain in the fucking ass, ive learened to just double clutch that gear without even thinking about it anymore. It's annoying as fuck.

4th seems to do it as well on occasion, but like i mentioned above, its usually when shifting into the gear below 2500 rpm.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 09:10 AM   #26
 
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2010 ms3 purchased at 10k miles, 2nd gear would pop out on downshift when releasing the clutch. After I noticed it happening took about 2-3 weeks till physically having to hold in 2nd. Mods at the time were intake, tip, test pipe, jbr ssp, and shifter base bushings. Stocked out took it in and no issues on warranty exact miles were 20463 at the time if rebuild
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 Old 01-10-2013, 12:24 PM   #27
 
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Odd my tranny has been a beast, 167k on it not one issue...running RL fluid, many 2nd gear 5500rpm drops too.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:26 PM   #28
 
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Originally Posted by dturboman View Post
Odd my tranny has been a beast, 167k on it not one issue...running RL fluid, many 2nd gear 5500rpm drops too.
Because it isnt an issue of power, its an issue of poorly made parts, some are lucky


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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:32 PM   #29
 
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Did pablo tell you about my woes?

car:2008 Mazdaspeed 3

mileage: Bought the car with 63k, noticed the issue about a week after I had it (presumably had the issue prior to buying and I never really noticed it)

How it happened/progressed: 2nd gear engine braking

When it happened ie down/upshifting: I only noticed it while engine braking in 2nd, the gear would pop out. RECENTLY occasionally grinding gears. Seems to have gotten worse and worse over time with the pop out, only a few seconds of engine braking and pops out.

Stock? or what mods? Shifter parts ie sts, knob, etc.: Bought the car with a cobb ap, intake and rmm. Started using a heavy shit knob and it somewhat alleviated the issue for a few months. Also installed full mounts hoping it was a bad mount fucking it up.

Using FoMoCo fluid?: Yup.

Was it covered/repaired: Out of warranty. Bought the car at 63k, had 84.5k when I put in a new transmission.

Did it happen again?: only 1k on the new transmission, knock on wood it doesn't. I always rev matched and I feel that bought me a few K miles as 2nd gear was still usable 20k after noticing the issue, I will continue revmatching. I've kinda learned to drive without 2nd/ease it in to second so I'm hoping to avoid the issue again
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:41 PM   #30
 
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Originally Posted by Payne Racing 67 View Post
They said $4000...but the guy literally went in, saw the mods, and said that based on that, and the cars "previous history" they can't do it. As per the Magnuson-Moss Act, they by law, cannot do that. I'd like to know what "previous history" the car has had because it's news to me. The only thing I've ever brought the car in for other than routine maintenence was the first time SECOND GEAR died...which in that case would maybe make the guy think that obviously it's a defect in these cars??
after having my tranny go out, I had the extended warranty, mentioned the Magnuson-Moss act and they laughed at me basically, just an fyi, it won't help you win your case, at least it didn't me and everyone else I've seen on the forums (mostly subaru) mine was about $3000 to rebuild (with installation, etc)
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:44 PM   #31
 
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Originally Posted by thehead View Post
after having my tranny go out, I had the extended warranty, mentioned the Magnuson-Moss act and they laughed at me basically, just an fyi, it won't help you win your case, at least it didn't me and everyone else I've seen on the forums (mostly subaru) mine was about $3000 to rebuild (with installation, etc)

magnuson-moss really only works if you lawyer up...and that ends up costing you more in the end.

I bought a transmission off the forums, act 6 puck & prolite, and super install from pablo and ended up at ~$2k. It's probably cheaper to buy a new transmission and swap in than rebuild.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:52 PM   #32
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Interesting to see that more gen2 owners have this issue.

Also, the people that have had the issue, have you determined a way to see if the transmission has the problem when out of the car (ie buying used?)
@Tomas; can chime in as well since he's taken his tranny apart at least a couple of times.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:58 PM   #33
 
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@Captain KR and @superskaterxes are having this issue as well....I think
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 Old 01-10-2013, 04:58 PM   #34
 
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Originally Posted by RichieRichness View Post
@ is having this issue as well....I think
Yea he is


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 Old 01-10-2013, 05:05 PM   #35
 
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Mine seems to only pop out once in a very blue moon. Usually when leaving work. I park next to my boss's house and he's pretty old so I don't want to annoy him so I get outta there pretty quickly with the car relatively not warmed up. It's a slight downgrade (and I mean slight) going down tithe stop sign and I'm usually going about 25mph or so. When I let off the gas to slow down it might pop out. It's only doe it a few times and I thought it may have been my fault maybe not putting it in gear all the way. Also I occasionally have trouble going 1st-2nd when WOT. Again, once in a blue moon. Never when I'm racing. Always seems to happen when I'm just trying to show off and it makes me look like a noob grinding gears.

Anyway.

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 Old 01-10-2013, 05:06 PM   #36
 
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07, 61.5k miles, bought at 43.5k miles ~13 months ago, not a single issue. When going from 2nd to 3rd I miss it sometimes, but that's on me. short shift plate/bushings/knob/yaddayadda for 15k miles or so now. I've been to VIR and a race or two, never had a tranny issue.

I know this doesn't really add to the broken tranny thread, but just throwing my experience in there.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 05:11 PM   #37
 
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Originally Posted by Lex View Post
Interesting to see that more gen2 owners have this issue.

Also, the people that have had the issue, have you determined a way to see if the transmission has the problem when out of the car (ie buying used?)
@Tomas; can chime in as well since he's taken his tranny apart at least a couple of times.

I'd only buy used from someone reputable on the forums. Not sure how you'd be able to tell w/o taking it apart.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 05:31 PM   #38
 
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Originally Posted by amoosenamedhank View Post
Sort of seems like a different material is needed for these shift pads. If people are losing gears with >30k miles, some serious wear is happening here.

I agree.

Most on here mod, most on here drive hard(er) than most. This shouldn't even be a problem with heavily modded cars. I understand if you grind every 3rd shift but this shouldn't be happening even if you drive it hard, correctly.

I think someone cheaped out on parts or just another design flaw on the platform.

I have the works shifter wise: Heavy weight, SSP, Anchors, shift weight, Amsoil. I don't have pop out issues as I don't downshift. I don't downshift because I'm afraid it will go toast. I do get resistance mid shift and the usual clunking (clunking within gearbox, not a Motor mount)

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 Old 01-10-2013, 05:33 PM   #39
 
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2011 Speed3. Started at 13k miles, owned the car since new with 21 miles. Randomly started grinding while downshifting to 2nd, then started to pop out, then wouldn't go in gear at all. Mods in sig, Sure shift weight, anchors and JBR weighted knob. Stock Mazda trans fluid
Stocked it out when I took it to the dealership. Was covered under warranty. But was told they got me a brand new trans, but discovered that they lied and just rebuilt the broken parts in the trans. Currently at 25K miles and hasn't happened again. I drag race my car pretty heavily. I put about 300 1/4 mile passes on it last summer.
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 Old 01-10-2013, 05:42 PM   #40
 
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09 MS3
43k

When cold 2nd will grind in if I move straight down from 1st. I have to shift in neutral and then down into 2nd to avoid the grind.

No pop out issues just that nasty grind going into 2nd cold.
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