Besides BT and Built Motor - Is there any other power mods left?

[drenkel]

I don't want to get into the built motor / BT area because this is my daily driver, and while I see lots of people putting down big numbers, I also see tons of problems with built motors and BT's and I need to keep my daily driver reliable.

I currently have:

1. Corksport Intake
2. Corksport TIP
3. UR Catless DP
4. UR Catless Test Pipe
5. ETS 3.25" Intercooler
6. Custom single exit exhaust
7. Turbosmart BPV
8. KMD Internals
9. EVO X Wheels with Nitto NT05 245/40/18 Tires
10. Pro tune at 22 PSI

I'm putting down 342WHP and 387 Torque with current setup.

Are there any other POWER mods I can do without getting into the built engine / BT area?

BTW, I have no E85 in my area so increasing timing is not much of an option for me.

[Squid]

I see your avatar but..

How is EVO X Wheels with Nitto NT05 245/40/18 Tires a POWER mod?

[speed14]

Man you're putting down 342hp and 387tq on K04 without E85/meth? Not trying to knock but that seems awfully high, even for 22psi.

Maybe see if an ex-mani can get you any extra flow?

[Captain KR]

exh mani
pp intake mani
meth kit

[drenkel]

Originally Posted by Squid I see your avatar but.. How is EVO X Wheels with Nitto NT05 245/40/18 Tires a POWER mod?

Before I got those tires and rims I used to spin 1-3rd.... not really a power mod, but I put down a lot more traction now and don't really spin in 2nd and 3rd anymore... it has really improved my acceleration. So I kinda do consider it a power mod even though technically it's not.

Originally Posted by speed14 Man you're putting down 342hp and 387tq on K04 without E85/meth? Not trying to knock but that seems awfully high, even for 22psi. Maybe see if an ex-mani can get you any extra flow?

I thought the manifold was manly for the BT setups, different flanges and such... does that actually provide enough flow to make a power increase on the stock K04? Or does the the stock manifold provide enough flow for the K04?

Originally Posted by Captain KR exh mani pp intake mani meth kit

Thanks Capt.... have not considered meth yet

[captain slow]

Originally Posted by Captain KR exh mani pp intake mani meth kit

+58

[doubleflusher]

That must have been the happiest dyno in the world.

Those are some inflated numbers.

[JS + MS3]

Go to gym and lose some weight?

[maisonvi]

Rockets? Worked on mythbusters.

[Captain KR]

Fapping before you race also works.

[timjs]

Yea I haven't been here long but that's the highest HP I've seen anyone claim from a K04.
Got a datalog we can plug into Virtual Dyno? Im just curious.

[forcedinduktion]

Yea those numbers a off a bit without meth or 85, even then. Maybe with intake mani, exmani, meth and 85. On k04

[ColonR]

I agree with Dawson get an exhaust mani that's good power right there then port your intake mani and get Meth n get tuned for it and you can pull 30+ HP off Meth alone. Then do NOZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ JK BOUT NOT

[phate]

Originally Posted by timjs Yea I haven't been here long but that's the highest HP I've seen anyone claim from a K04. Got a datalog we can plug into Virtual Dyno? Im just curious.

Can I claim higher?

[drenkel]

Thanks for the tips guys, gonna look into the mani's and meth to get some extra horsies.

As far as the dyno numbers, it was on a dynojet, around 45 degrees outside if I remember correctly. Not gonna debate the numbers, been through this debate before and it just turns into an argument. Just because someone has similar mods and has lower numbers don't really mean anything. Different dynos read differently.

My tune is also different from 99% of the guys on here. I have a Piasini tune from Joe at DP tune. He is employed by Mazda to tune their SCCA race cars and really knows his shit, and fine tuned my car quite nicely. So it's kinda like comparing apples to oranges in the tuning department. I diddnt throw those numbers out there to brag or anything so let's please not let this discussion turn into who's dyno numbers are higher. All that matters is we have fast cars that we enjoy

I was just looking for more mod options, and you guys have been very helpful. Thank you very much for the input... looks like my next steps will be manni and meth and then I'll take it back down to Joe and get my tune adjusted again.

You guys are awesome, thanks MSF!

[86AmishMs3]

stop pussyfooting around and go bt.

[dereeek]

medium turbo? BNR3?

[timjs]

Originally Posted by phate Can I claim higher?

Absolutely! I'll make me feel better about my own power goals on the K04. haha

[Bucker]

I claim 350/460 on my K04.

EDIT:
With fucking nitrous. I don't care who your tuner is, the K04 doesn't flow 340+ WHP of air (without chemical assistance).

[darth_speeder]

if i can get 310-315WHP w/out BT upgrade while i finish my truck, ill be a happy camper.

[Spirry]

LOL @ Dyno numbers.

[EdgeAutosport.com]

We have big turbos, meth and manifolds..... just sayin

...+1 on what the msf.org esteemed gearheads have said and maybe a...

...flux capacitor...

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by drenkel Thanks for the tips guys, gonna look into the mani's and meth to get some extra horsies. As far as the dyno numbers, it was on a dynojet, around 45 degrees outside if I remember correctly. Not gonna debate the numbers, been through this debate before and it just turns into an argument. Just because someone has similar mods and has lower numbers don't really mean anything. Different dynos read differently. My tune is also different from 99% of the guys on here. I have a Piasini tune from Joe at DP tune. He is employed by Mazda to tune their SCCA race cars and really knows his shit, and fine tuned my car quite nicely. So it's kinda like comparing apples to oranges in the tuning department. I diddnt throw those numbers out there to brag or anything so let's please not let this discussion turn into who's dyno numbers are higher. All that matters is we have fast cars that we enjoy I was just looking for more mod options, and you guys have been very helpful. Thank you very much for the input... looks like my next steps will be manni and meth and then I'll take it back down to Joe and get my tune adjusted again. You guys are awesome, thanks MSF!

I don't see ported intake manifold on your list of items. Why not get an upgraded stock turbo with ported exhaust housing and some ceramic? That would be a huge bump on power (more than an exhaust manifold would give you) and it would give Joe some additional air flow to work with.

Joe knows how to tune guys... hands down the best tuner I have ever had the privilege to talk with.

Originally Posted by drenkel I don't want to get into the built motor / BT area because this is my daily driver, and while I see lots of people putting down big numbers, I also see tons of problems with built motors and BT's and I need to keep my daily driver reliable. I currently have: Corksport Intake Corksport TIP UR Catless DP UR Catless Test Pipe ETS 3.25" Intercooler Custom single exit exhaust Turbosmart BPV KMD Internals EVO X Wheels with Nitto NT05 245/40/18 Tires Pro tune at 22 PSI I'm putting down 342WHP and 387 Torque with current setup. Are there any other POWER mods I can do without getting into the built engine / BT area? BTW, I have no E85 in my area so increasing timing is not much of an option for me.

That is a very good mod list, talk with Joe and ask him what he recommends. I know we are doing some custom work for him right now so you might want to as about these "items". I don't want to share what we are doing for him because I don't know if he wants the details released yet.

Do you still have your balance shafts in place? Remove those and it would free up some rotating mass.

[kritz]

Really?

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Bucker I claim 350/460 on my K04. EDIT: With fucking nitrous. I don't care who your tuner is, the K04 doesn't flow 340+ WHP of air (without chemical assistance).

How about we get him to do a datalog then post a virtual dyno first before we start calling people out.

Joe over at DP Tune knows his shit. He has done more testing in this platform than anyone I know. Bucker, you are a competent tuner but without knowing the details of how Joe tunes. It would be unfair to attack members for the results that they are making without all the details. Maybe they are correcting for elevation, temp, ect during the dyno pulls. Just something to think about.

[Bucker]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE How about we get him to do a datalog then post a virtual dyno first before we start calling people out. Joe over at DP Tune knows his shit. He has done more testing in this platform than anyone I know. Bucker, you are a competent tuner but without knowing the details of how Joe tunes. It would be unfair to attack members for the results that they are making without all the details. Maybe they are correcting for elevation, temp, ect during the dyno pulls. Just something to think about.

Corrections would do it. The turbo does not flow that much air, it is literally the restriction... you know this, John. I get angry when people spout bullshit as fact and then refuse to back it in any way.

Without alcohol, he isn't making over 320whp. Without nitrous he isn't over 340whp. Reworked K04 of any flavor + ported IM + Exhaust Manifold would give you some good gains, OP.

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by kritz Really?

I cannot go into the details about what Joe is doing with his tuning, but he can get crazy results. He is forced to run a restrictor in his class, yet still makes crazy power.

[jack_hammer]

Lol at people suggesting a vd log to prove dyno numbers

Sent from my LG-MS690 using Tapatalk

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Bucker Corrections would do it. The turbo does not flow that much air, it is literally the restriction... you know this, John. I get angry when people spout bullshit as fact and then refuse to back it in any way. Without alcohol, he isn't making over 320whp. Without nitrous he isn't over 340whp. Reworked K04 of any flavor + ported IM + Exhaust Manifold would give you some good gains, OP.

Correct, but how much power would it make at 24 psi at 5200 RPM with 28 degrees of timing with proper flame propagation.

Bucker, two years ago people said that 300 WHP was impossible on the stock turbo. A year ago 320 was impossible. Today... I don't see why 340 wouldn't be doable with the tuning tables that have been unlocked and the experience that Joe has. I get equally angry when people have a closed mind about progression with a platform that already has a limited knowledge base.

Now, don't take this as an attack on you. I know Joe personally, I know what he is capable of and as a personal associate of his... I trust that his cars do what he claims. This is just my opinion and we know that its not worth much, but there it is!

Originally Posted by broncojd78 Lol at people suggesting a vd log to prove dyno numbers Sent from my LG-MS690 using Tapatalk

I know, I know, but it would at least be something.

[Bucker]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE Correct, but how much power would it make at 24 psi at 5200 RPM with 28 degrees of timing with proper flame propagation. Bucker, two years ago people said that 300 WHP was impossible on the stock turbo. A year ago 320 was impossible. Today... I don't see why 340 wouldn't be doable with the tuning tables that have been unlocked and the experience that Joe has. I get equally angry when people have a closed mind about progression with a platform that already has a limited knowledge base. Now, don't take this as an attack on you. I know Joe personally, I know what he is capable of and as a personal associate of his... I trust that his cars do what he claims. This is just my opinion and we know that its not worth much, but there it is! I know, I know, but it would at least be something.

I am all about opening up more potential if it is there. Just as importantly, if it IS there why is it not HERE? Why would one magical person be capable of producing significantly more flow from an already over-taxed turbocharger? This is a forum for the exchange and sharing of technical knowledge. Thats what we do. We try something, share results, get input, and try something new.

Also, we are not talking theory here. OP claims to have made significantly more power on the stock turbo with the same methods others have used. He did not modify the turbo, he did not add any unique new parts to get magic power, he did not do anything differently other than this tune. I generally hold close to 24 PSI at 5000 RPM (it plummets after) and run much less timing than 28*, but from testing of others on the platform, that is well beyond MBT anyway. Just as importantly, there would be a fuckload of knock with no alcohol with that much boost/ timing.

[kritz]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE I cannot go into the details about what Joe is doing with his tuning, but he can get crazy results. He is forced to run a restrictor in his class, yet still makes crazy power.

Very interesting John, I'll have to have a chat with Kevin. But still very happy dyno!

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Bucker I am all about opening up more potential if it is there. Just as importantly, if it IS there why is it not HERE? Why would one magical person be capable of producing significantly more flow from an already over-taxed turbocharger? This is a forum for the exchange and sharing of technical knowledge. Thats what we do. We try something, share results, get input, and try something new. Also, we are not talking theory here. OP claims to have made significantly more power on the stock turbo with the same methods others have used. He did not modify the turbo, he did not add any unique new parts to get magic power, he did not do anything differently other than this tune. I generally hold close to 24 PSI at 5000 RPM (it plummets after) and run much less timing than 28*, but from testing of others on the platform, that is well beyond MBT anyway. Just as importantly, there would be a fuckload of knock with no alcohol with that much boost/ timing.

Well, if someone can make more why share it? If they share it, it gets copied and you know where it goes from there.

I don't want to share to much about what Joe does, but I can tell you that flame propagation plays a huge part to his tuning. Bucker, don't take offence to this but, Joe has been tuning for years and dedicated himself to this platform. How long have you been tuning? Again, don't take offence to this but maybe he knows more about tuning than you? Just say'in.

[ms6forthewin]

thats some high ass motherfuckin numbers @@
are you sure its 342 or is it actually 242 lol jk.

Heres a solution for you: BNR stage 3 Water/meth injection BOOM!

[Bucker]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE Well, if someone can make more why share it? If they share it, it gets copied and you know where it goes from there. I don't want to share to much about what Joe does, but I can tell you that flame propagation plays a huge part to his tuning. Bucker, don't take offence to this but, Joe has been tuning for years and dedicated himself to this platform. How long have you been tuning? Again, don't take offence to this but maybe he knows more about tuning than you? Just say'in.

No offense taken, more than anything I am hoping to understand whatever concept may allow to get more from this platform. I have only been tuning cars for about 5 years and have only been on this platform a brief period of time.

You mention flame propagation but you still have thrown nothing out there. Its cool if you dont want to talk about someone elses work, but don't talk about it then. Don't allude to things then say "nevermind". It's childish and worthless to us on this forum. I appreciate the products you have produced and the breakthroughs you have made. I don't appreciate the way you try to make it sound like you are THE subject matter expert on the platform but refuse to enlighten others.

[Eric28243]

subbed. Hope we don't blow up bucker's thanks-o-meter.

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Bucker No offense taken, more than anything I am hoping to understand whatever concept may allow to get more from this platform. I have only been tuning cars for about 5 years and have only been on this platform a brief period of time. You mention flame propagation but you still have thrown nothing out there. Its cool if you dont want to talk about someone elses work, but don't talk about it then. Don't allude to things then say "nevermind". It's childish and worthless to us on this forum. I appreciate the products you have produced and the breakthroughs you have made. I don't appreciate the way you try to make it sound like you are THE subject matter expert on the platform but refuse to enlighten others.

I am not a liberty to explain this to you. If you want to see how flame propagation effects power, go cut a window into a cyl head, get the equipment to monitor how it effects power production, and then share it with everyone. This is what Joe did, he spent thousands of dollars doing this. I refuse to take someones hard work and make it worthless, or just give it away. If you view this as childish I am sorry, its a business decision that we have to make sometimes in order to stay a head of the competition.

[helmetface]

Lol I love when the 'knowns' come in and talk smack to the noobs.

<popcorn>

[drenkel]

Sorry guys, I shouldn't have posted my numbers in the first place. I made that mistake a year ago after I got my first tune by Joe with nothing but an intake and TP and got flamed to hell with everyone screaming inflated, and I defended Joe with everyone screaming liar even though I had a dyno sheet to prove it. Still, it was Liar Liar they screamed. I quit the forums for about a month after that, and I should have learned my lesson about posting my numbers but apparently nothing has changed in a year.

There are other tuning solutions out there, but most people here use the AP because they can make modifications themselves and tweak stuff.. and I understand, alot of people like that. The AP is a great product and lots of people love it.

My car was tuned with a different solution, by a guy who is paid by Mazda to tune their race cars. Just because I have made more horsepower than those who use the AP does not mean my tune is superior. Maybe Joe just has more access to the ECU than the AP, or knows some tricks you guys don't. It's also entirely possible that the Dyno local to me reads higher than normal. Either way it's irrelevant.

But again, it don't matter and all this defending and bullshit calling is pretty childish. I did not post those numbers to get everyone in a flaming war, I was trying to post the information on my car and get some advice. I don't know a thing about tuning, that's why I take my car to Joe. I can't tell you what's different about my tune than yours, and Joe does not share any info about his tuning because he doesn't want to be copied.

What I can tell you is that he knows his shit, and if you ever take a visit out to his place you will see multiple Mazdas parked there that MAZDA has provided him with free of charge for R&D. He works on these cars all the time, and not just the speeds. He has regular 3's there, and even a Mazda 2 he's been tuning. He also races them, and tunes the SCCA cars. That should tell you something, don't ya think? Out of everyone available, this is the guy Mazda chose.

Let's just squash this now, you can either believe my numbers or not, it really does not matter to me. This thread has been completely derailed.

I was simply looking for a few extra mods I could do without going into the BT / built engine area and it turned into a tuning war... really was not my intention.

Thank you to the guys who provided advice, it is very much appreciated. I will research all you have said and use that knowledge to better my own car.

For the flamers, just let it go. If you want to create your own thread debating what's possible and what's not, and which tuning solution is better then go for it. Please don't turn my thread into another warzone. This is my last post in this thread. No I will not post my dyno sheet, no I will not post a log for your virtual dyno. I tried that a year ago and even though everything was legit people still called liar liar and said I modified it.

[SofaKingAwesome]

Originally Posted by Squid I see your avatar but.. How is EVO X Wheels with Nitto NT05 245/40/18 Tires a POWER mod?

Damn, too fast!