Deciding, M3 or GTI?

[Mr645]

My 08 R32 lease is about up and was pretty set on a Mazda 3 or Speed 3.

BUT, VW has responded with a $1500 credit toward any new VW because of the number of issues my R32 had.

GTI, manual, would get a base car, cloth (Ugly), lease would run $269

I do like the Mazda 3, a 2.5 manual hatch is $225 mo, but no ones seems to have any except loaded, leather, Nav etc, and bring the cost equal to the Speed 3. and a Speed 3 is $305 mo. Also looked at the WRX, but no one has them in stock, so pretty much gave up on it since there are none to test drive.


I test drove the GTI, and to be honest, I really like the way it drives. Great road feel, nice driving car. The Speed 3 has more features, a little more powerful, but the steering seems to lack any feedback, and the car overall seemed a little unrefined.

I am kind of assuming that the Mazda will be far more reliable and trouble free. My R32 has had 6 DSR repairs, 3 Haldex failures, Gas tank failure, Rack and pinion failure, some electrical issues and an airbag failure. That's just the major stuff. VW has stepped up with 8 lease payments over the 4 years I have owned the R and now $1500 toward a new VW.

Anyway, I'm not looking for a screaming match, I'm 40 yrs old and want a fun to drive, reasonably prices car, with some room. Manual transmission and I may do a track day or two and probably the only mods I would ever do would be brake pads and tires. Just looking for constructive comments regarding positives and nagatives of the Speed3.
Thanks,
Jon

[fortressofcomfort]

This is not a Mazda3 forum, this is a MazdaSpeed3 forum, two completely different animals.

Get the GTI. That's what all the car books say to do.

In all seriousness, if you didn't say WOW after driving a speed3 then this not the car for you.

Oh and pls search. Typically people who have to ask this question will just never appreciate what the MS3 is all about.

[gearhead750]

Did you put the oil on my axehole?

[Tokay444]

FAGGOT.

[Mortose]

I'm not to versed in the lease side of things, but from my opinion/what i know:

Speed3>GTI

More power and better looks.

The problem your going to run into here, is this is a performance/modification site. If your going to lease, then, like you said, your probably not going to do much of that.

[86AmishMs3]

1500 aint much...and chanced are teh dealer will take that into account when negotiating a price (ie negotiate a higher price since you have the voucher)

Speed 3 is good for raw power, will respond decently to bolt ons and tunes.

If you just want a nice DD go with the gti. If you like driving fast and like an asshole buy a ms3.

[melbaro]

Based on your last experience with VW a gti shouldn't even be on that list. Based on the other information you've provided, you should lease a base model 3 and buy a used miata.

[Tweaek]

Fairly sure the overwhelming response you're going to get is a buy a speed3. Best bang for your buck performance wise with great reliability and quite the following and aftermarket support.

You bought an R32 and obviously aren't satisfied enough to buy another or don't want to pay the ridiculous price they want for the POS. A GTI is the same car with a smaller engine with probably an equal aftermarket support for it as the speed if not greater.

Me personally, if the car I already had doesn't convince me to want to own another, I wouldn't be debating between a lower model of the same car and anything else. Especially with the reliability issues you went through.

Just my .02

Good luck

[RdotQelo]

MOAR POWAAAAAAAAA

[bigriver]

Buy the GTI and get off this site. Your gonna fail so it should be in a GTI.

[Elusivellama]

Originally Posted by Mr645 I am kind of assuming that the Mazda will be far more reliable and trouble free. My R32 has had 6 DSR repairs, 3 Haldex failures, Gas tank failure, Rack and pinion failure, some electrical issues and an airbag failure. That's just the major stuff. VW has stepped up with 8 lease payments over the 4 years I have owned the R and now $1500 toward a new VW.

This right here is a reason not to own a VW, in my opinion. Shit just fails on them...

I know several people who own a Gen 1 MS3 and they, for the most part, report only the odd minor issue here and there. Nothing at all like what you're describing on your VW. My own car is a 2010 MS3 (build date Sept 2009) and the only thing I've had to bring it back for was to get the headlight assemblies replaced due to the halogen DRLs causing heat damage to the inside of the plastic covers. Oh, I had a windshield cowl rattle TSB done, but that's just removing some plastic and putting felt pads.

Anyway, I'm not looking for a screaming match,

*shrug* It's always nice to see someone else want to get into a MS3.

I'm 40 yrs old and want a fun to drive, reasonably prices car, with some room. Manual transmission and I may do a track day or two and probably the only mods I would ever do would be brake pads and tires. Just looking for constructive comments regarding positives and nagatives of the Speed3. Thanks, Jon

I really don't think the only mods you'll do are brake pads and tires. Almost everyone here has an upgraded rear motor mount, and the majority have upgraded motor mounts elsewhere. At the very least, going stage 1 will net you numbers that are closer to the advertised numbers on this car at the wheel (instead of at the crank).

I test drove the GTI before I bought my speed. Despite the nicer interior (in full leather), non smiley faced grille, better fuel economy etc, I felt that it was just not powerful enough. I was aware that you could 'chip' the thing and get a power boost, but the MS3 was less expensive in terms of MSRP, better to finance (0%), had more power to start with and I felt that it handled better. And of course, I freely admit that I'm biased against VW because of their rep for crapping out. My family has had several VWs in the past - never again, lol.

In the end, it is your money. You will get biased opinions on this site, just as you would if you were posting on a VW forum somewhere. For me, it boiled down to VW reliability issues, lack of power and higher overall cost. It will be my only car, and I really don't want to go down to the parking garage one morning to find that it won't turn over, or to find out that some shit is going haywire while I'm driving through rain or snow, or whatever....

[BLK_MS3]

After all the issues you had with your VW, why would you even think about getting another one? Get the Speed3, it's a fun little car, and more reliable then a VW.

[makjur]

I went from 05 1.8t GTI to my 2010 MS3 and never looked back

[Dmurray06]

Lease=waste of monies

[cesaros]

Thought this thread was comparing the BMW M3 to the GTI...was about to kill myself. Still might after actually reading OP.

[Naaman]

GTI is more livable and probably the better DD, but the Speed3 is faster/better looking/more fun, IMO. Regular MZ3 will be the most "practical" but wont be nearly as fun as the other two.

Speed3 is cheaper to maintain and mod, and it responds better to the mods. Since that isn't your goal, then it doesn't really matter. VW's aren't guaranteed to break (some last forever), but it'll be more expensive when it does. That said, if you're leasing and the dealer will take care of you, that doesn't really matter either.

Eh. Get the GTI. MS3 > GTI > MZ3. It'll probably suit you just fine.

[Mazda Lover]

Its been said before but why go VW again with all the issues you had before? As for the which to get...stock to stock the MS3 is the better performer. Especially if you plan to go to the track. For one it has a real LSD vs the fake e-diff the GTI has which will cook your brakes in 2 laps, more power, better suspension, etc. The VW is just more refined with a nicer interior. I compared the WRX, GTI, and MS3 back to back and for me the MS3 was FTW hands down. MZ3 is nice too though.

[jtt]

Nice. I've had an 08 .:r for about a year before I got tired of the dsg and the slow/ crappy mpg for a 2011 ms3. I do kinda miss some of the creature comforts (heated seats), but I love my ms3.

If awd is what to are looking for, a golf r maybe your best bet. If to don't mind the fwd, look no further than a ms3.

[Somnospeed]

Originally Posted by Mr645 My R32 has had 6 DSR repairs, 3 Haldex failures, Gas tank failure, Rack and pinion failure, some electrical issues and an airbag failure. That's just the major stuff.

Ok... tell me again why you would even remotely consider buying a VW again?? I guess maybe you enjoy driving rental cars and loaners over the MS3??

[Mr645]

Originally Posted by Somnospeed Ok... tell me again why you would even remotely consider buying a VW again?? I guess maybe you enjoy driving rental cars and loaners over the MS3??

Thanks for those with constructive informations. Yes, I had written off VW, and European cars in general. My wifes car, a Volvo C70 and our previous cars, BMW M5 and BMW X3 are all poorly built, poorly engineered cars. But I enjoy driving and the I love the way the German and Italian cars drive.
Now yes, my R32 has been a nightmare with problems, but I also keep in mind that VW is paid for 8 lease payment of over $400 each, and now $1500 more. This $1500 has nothing to do with the dealer, I would use it to cover the inceptions at the start of the lease.

I have to think that all VW's are not as problematic as mine.

Anyway, I have never owned a Mazda, and I am looking to drop my monthly car cost because my wife Volvo C70 lease is up at the end of the year and we're going to replace it with a CTS-V or a Jag XF and bring that lease payment up.

Ok, so what's with the Speed 3 steering? It felt numb compared to the regular 2.5L hatch.

The 2.5L engine was responsive and while a little low on power, acceptable. I would need a set of wheels and tires but otherwise a nice solid cheap car.

The Speed3, plenty of power, ready to go, and since it's a turbo I would probably end up doing a basic tune just because it's so easy to do and the results would be very noticeable. same with the GTI.

So basically no issues with the Mazda's, as with typical Japanese cars, rock solid build.

Why motor mounts?

And it seems that even some Mazda 3 enthusiasts here feel the GTI is a better driving car.


Oh, in South Florida I have shopped two dealers, Delray Mazda and Gunther. Any thoughts?

Thanks again,
Jon

[Mr645]

Originally Posted by jtt Nice. I've had an 08 .:r for about a year before I got tired of the dsg and the slow/ crappy mpg for a 2011 ms3. I do kinda miss some of the creature comforts (heated seats), but I love my ms3. If awd is what to are looking for, a golf r maybe your best bet. If to don't mind the fwd, look no further than a ms3.

Thanks,
YES, DSG takes what has the potential to be brilliant and totally destroys it. I was about to buy a GTI back in '08 and could not get other the goofy wheels and red grill strips, saw the R32 in the distance and spent an hour driving both cars back and forth. Fell in love with the engine and brakes. Decided I could get to know DSG. BIG mistake!!!

Thought about the Golf R, but looking to lower monthly and sure it may be faster, but there is no replacement for displacement. Sure, lag may be minimal on todays turbo 4's, but it's zero on a 3.2L V6

[iggy097]

Originally Posted by Mr645 The Speed 3 has more features, a little more powerful, but the steering seems to lack any feedback,

That's odd. My wife drives a leaser honda civic, and I can wiggle the wheel probably a good 3" either way before the car responds, very squishy feeling. Now on the other hand, my Speed 3, the instant I move my hand left or right, the car responds.
Granted I do have a JBR rear sway bar, and that definatly improved the handling, but I don't recall it being even remotely sluggish to start.

The rear sway bar can be found used for 150 dollars and makes your car feel like it's on rails. Very easy install, one that you could get away with on a lease vehicle I'm sure.

[anavrinIV]

you're considering getting a 2.5L hatch so your WIFE can drive a cts-v? grow a pair and get a car with power.

[SlickDevil]

MS3 > GTI

[Tokay444]

This fag/vag is just talking shit.
"previous cars M5... Getting cts-v or Jag... Or maybe ms3... But probably MZ3."

[Mistersix]

If you wanna lower your payment and get better mpg but still have something decent to drive then go with the MZ3.

If you don't want all the options then just wait it out. The one you want will come around. You said you like the steering feel and you don't seem to car about the power. You've answered your own question. Fuck the german car get the MZ3, sky-active, 40pmg. Your over thinking it.

[Atlanta]

Originally Posted by IAM Based on your last experience with VW a gti shouldn't even be on that list. Based on the other information you've provided, you should lease a base model 3 and buy a used miata.

Plus 100. If I had so many problems with a vehicle like you have the last thing I would ever consider is getting another one.

Sent from TapaDatAss

[Mikey]

Originally Posted by Mr645 The Speed 3 has more features, a little more powerful, but the steering seems to lack any feedback, and the car overall seemed a little unrefined. Thanks, Jon

Are you kidding my a lil more powerful than the GTI. There is no contest on power and the MS3 is unrefined gtfo. TROLL

[2011speed]

get a gti , slam it n put some audi wheels on it like the rest of the fags do whicj is all they're good for

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk

[travis9935]

Originally Posted by Tokay444 This fag/vag is just talking shit. "previous cars M5... Getting cts-v or Jag... Or maybe ms3... But probably MZ3."

Hmmm high roller cars to sport compacts?

[StayBroke]

how long do you lease your cars for? I no people that lease say 21k cars for 275 month for 3 years. I call them stupid because for idk say year or so more close to the same payment it can be yours, then when you do pay it off you could resale and have so much more money.

[jkmags]

well, as others have said.. going to a speed3 website will get you the same answer(s) you would get at a VW site (just on the other side of the argument),. If I was looking at a fun car and didnt worry about snow (since your in Florida) i would look at the 5.0 Mustang, I would imagine you can find a base one for under 30 if they have some older New stock.

To answer your question about which to get I would go with the Speed3, I looked at both the GTI and Speed3 when I was shopping and you cant beat the price of the Speed3

MotorWeek Road Test: 2010 Mazda Speed 3 vs. 2010 Volkswagen GTi - YouTube

MotorWeek Road Test: 2010 Mazda Speed 3 vs. 2010 Volkswagen GTi - YouTube

and

DRIVEN Mazda MAZDASPEED3 - YouTube

DRIVEN Mazda MAZDASPEED3 - YouTube

[jtt]

Originally Posted by Mr645 Thanks, YES, DSG takes what has the potential to be brilliant and totally destroys it. I was about to buy a GTI back in '08 and could not get other the goofy wheels and red grill strips, saw the R32 in the distance and spent an hour driving both cars back and forth. Fell in love with the engine and brakes. Decided I could get to know DSG. BIG mistake!!! Thought about the Golf R, but looking to lower monthly and sure it may be faster, but there is no replacement for displacement. Sure, lag may be minimal on todays turbo 4's, but it's zero on a 3.2L V6

This may sound completely odd, but have you thought of a v6 coyote mustang? 300hp, u can grab one for less than 20k, and it'll get 30mpg.

You can later add the suspension bits from th BoSS, but keep payments and insurance lower compared to your other options.

But I have to agree, drove the gti and was meh. Drove the ms3 and didn't want my r32 anymore.

[CaptObvious75]

MS3 > GTI

Why? because racecar... this is why I bought a MS3 over a GTI/GLI:

- Real LSD (no electronic brake magic band-aid solutions)
- More stock power and torque
- Most likely better reliability stock vs stock
- Cheaper than the GTI fully optioned out (In Canada anyways)
- Can turn off both stability AND traction control
- This Genpu is more refined than the last gen

The only areas I see the GTI win in vs the MS3 is:

- Better steering wheel (it's beyond sex)
- Better dynaudio sound system vs the Bose system
- Might be a bit better on fuel
- Slightly better road trip ride
- Makes stated power at the wheels vs Mazda's power at the crank

This is as unbiased an answer you will get on here. The Mazdaspeed3 was the far better vehicle for ME... there is a reason why this car is highly regarded and win's almost all comparison tests. I find the GTI is more of a DD and the MS3 is more of a weekend track car IMHO

[Vinnie]

Originally Posted by Mr645 Thanks for those with constructive informations. Yes, I had written off VW, and European cars in general. My wifes car, a Volvo C70 and our previous cars, BMW M5 and BMW X3 are all poorly built, poorly engineered cars. But I enjoy driving and the I love the way the German and Italian cars drive. Now yes, my R32 has been a nightmare with problems, but I also keep in mind that VW is paid for 8 lease payment of over $400 each, and now $1500 more. This $1500 has nothing to do with the dealer, I would use it to cover the inceptions at the start of the lease. I have to think that all VW's are not as problematic as mine. Anyway, I have never owned a Mazda, and I am looking to drop my monthly car cost because my wife Volvo C70 lease is up at the end of the year and we're going to replace it with a CTS-V or a Jag XF and bring that lease payment up. Ok, so what's with the Speed 3 steering? It felt numb compared to the regular 2.5L hatch. The 2.5L engine was responsive and while a little low on power, acceptable. I would need a set of wheels and tires but otherwise a nice solid cheap car. The Speed3, plenty of power, ready to go, and since it's a turbo I would probably end up doing a basic tune just because it's so easy to do and the results would be very noticeable. same with the GTI. So basically no issues with the Mazda's, as with typical Japanese cars, rock solid build. Why motor mounts? And it seems that even some Mazda 3 enthusiasts here feel the GTI is a better driving car. Oh, in South Florida I have shopped two dealers, Delray Mazda and Gunther. Any thoughts? Thanks again, Jon

dude read up! no one said our cars are " easy to tune" if you researched the motor mount... even the slightest bit, you would realize why it's essential. my friend has the 2.5 hatch and it feels like driving a boat compared to the speed3...

youre posts are making me feel like this is all an april fools joke

[desertmike680]

Good write up! This is what happened to me: I had an 06 Speed 6 for 3 years, I went into an 08 Certified Pre owned Infiniti g37 Sport, in which was the biggest piece of shit lemon, headache I have ever owned (only had the car for 9 and a half months), took a huge financial hit for the damn car (due to the infiniti being worth 11k less then what I owed), went back to Mazda and picked up a 2012 Speed 3. There was nothing more then wanting to get back into a Mazda.

[Kellerspeed3]

IMHO, I researched, test drove, and fortunately for me money wasn't too much of an issue, all types of cars. The WRX, Ralli-art hatchback, the mind-numbing quick Evo, 2.5 Mazda hatchback, why can't they turbo that engine, on and on. I picked a 2010 speed3, best bang for the buck, sure some of those cars had more power stock but the friggin Evo was almost $40,000 new! Fuck that, found a Red Mazda certified 2010 speed3 with 6500 miles, tech package, extended warranty, TTL, total cost 30,000 and change. Another grand in some mods and I'm ALL good! In the end it's your $$ but for me I couldn't be happier with my choice! I know your looking for a DD, but the combo of power and price is something you might want to consider in your search. If you stay out of the boost and use your sixth gear a lot you'll get 24-27 MPH highway too, so it's win-win. If your like me you'll be lucky to get the 18 city Mazda says the car gets but I'm always in a hurry, good luck.

[doctavus]

30k for a used speed3????????????????????????????????????

Even with it being out the door, damn!!!

[anavrinIV]

Originally Posted by Kellerspeed3 found a Red Mazda certified 2010 speed3 with 6500 miles, tech package, extended warranty, TTL, total cost 30,000 and change.

you got seriously ripped off on that...guys are getting new 2012s for under $25k out the door

[Rustysocket]

30k for a used speed...... assfucking good time.