New Member - Potential Buyer Questions

[ANITIX87]

Hi, all.

Newbie here, so sitting on a cushion, just in case.

A little disclaimer: I'd like to spark a serious discussion to address my questions. While I realize this is a Mazda forum and there will be primarily die-hard fans, I would really appreciate some comparisons, honest opinions, and at least a little less bias than one might expect. Buying a car is no simple matter, and I'm assuming there was a time when many of you were tossing various options in the air. I'm at that stage, and want to make the best decision possible!

First, a little information about myself. I'm 24 years old and live in the New York City suburbs. I have been an avid car fan for years and years, though my primary passions lie in aviation and photography. I know a lot about cars in an engineering sense (my career is in mechanical engineering) and the basics regarding maintenance, upkeep, troubleshooting, etc. However, I'll be the first to admit I'm really not a hands-on guy and modding or doing repairs myself isn't something I see in my future. I have a 9-5 engineering job that prevents too many personal hobbies, and my photography business and tennis leagues take up most of the free time I do have.

I've had my current car (the first one I ever owned) since 2003. It's a 2000 Ford Focus ZX3 hatchback. It just ticked past 78,000 miles, but it's showing its age and has needed way too much maintenance work lately to justify keeping much longer. Therefore, I'm looking at new cars. The three I've narrowed it down to are:
VW Golf GTI
Mazdaspeed3
Ford Focus ST (if it comes to US dealers before I'm ready to buy).

I've test-driven the VW and the MS3, and right now, it comes down to one key question: Am I willing to sacrifice the MS3's far, far superior performance for the GTI's much nicer interior and more supple ride? I'm leaning towards no, because I was very underwhelmed by the GTI's acceleration off the line, but that interior really is absolutely fantastic.

To that end, I've got some questions for the MS3 owners in here, especially the ones who live in the Northeast or Canada, where weather and road quality are notoriously worse than in SoCal or Florida!

1) Suspension - many reviews criticise the MS3 for having much too harsh a ride. When I test-drove, I didn't get the impression it was something I wouldn't be able to live with every day, but the sensation is always different in the driver's seat and the test-drive was way too short to really get a good impression. How does the suspension hold up to little imperfections in the road (I do the vast majority of my driving on local streets at 30-50MPH that have small holes, manholes, and general inconsistencies)?? How does the suspension handle any really problematic, neglected roads (especially after a harsh winter)?? I drive through New York City and the outlying highways a lot, and I cringe at a lot of the stuff my little Focus has to deal with on a daily basis. As I've spend more on suspension repairs and replacements for the Focus than I did to buy the car in the first place, I'd like a car that will be able to handle anything the roads here will throw at it and not break my back (or the bank). I've also got to consider the comfort levels of the passengers, as I tend to be the chauffeur for my friends and especially my girlfriend who gets nauseous easily. Has this been a problem for anybody?

2) The Navigation Package - Again, reviews cite it as being too small and low-resolution to be useful in reading, though the voice commands are clear and accurate. Anybody have more input on this? I'd especially be interested in seeing some images from the driver's point-of-view of the system working and showing directions. I like the things the tech-package offers (HIDs, Sound system, BSM, keyless, etc), but I can't justify the premium if the navigation isn't going to be useful and if I'll find myself using my cell phone more often (or buying a TomTom or something).

3) Winter - This is a big one for those who have experience. Obviously, my first purchase would be a set of winter wheels/tires, but is the 263HP and 280lb-ft something that will make driving in snow/ice miserable even with a great set of M/S tires? Even my current Focus (130HP) makes winter starts on an uphill a tedious task, and I don't want to hate my car for 4 months out of the year.

4) Longevity - Here's my biggest "concern." Whichever car I buy will be in my garage for 10+ years. I tend to keep my cars until I really need a new one and while it's possible I'll be able to afford a more "sensible" daily driver before then, I really want to be confident this next car will make it through the long-haul. In the GTI, I drove 5 minutes and knew it was incredibly built, solid, reliable, and able to handle everyday life. The MS3 really shone when I asked it to perform in ludicrous ways, but some of the features (no power seats and the bad driving position, some of the materials on the inside, the button layout, etc) made me think I may yearn for a nicer place to be a few years from now, when the novelty of having the best-performing hot-hatch wears off. I realize there aren't many high-mileage Gen2 MS3s out there, so it's hard to judge for sure, but I am curious what experiences others have had with repair costs, maintenance costs, and general reliability and "everyday quality".

Thanks to everybody for your input. I really look forward to getting some good insight, having a nice discussion, and getting to know the people on these forums (and hopefully avoiding some flaming).

ANITIX87

[Monotonous ONE]

Sounds like the gti with an extended warranty is what your looking for

[nextgenerationx1]

Gti is not a bad performing vehicle at all. The ms3's performance is not superior to the GTI, although the GTI is a lil more $$$, i believe the 200hp rated stock on the GTI is to the wheels while our MS3 is 260 rated to the crank. so we only really have 30 more whp. but def way more trq. we are heavier by 100lbs. I live on Long Island, but i do a lot of queens driving. its tolerable. just don't lower the car if your in NYC most of the time. I can't say much about the MS3 in the winter since i got mine 3 weeks ago. i'll have to find out this winter! and um i don't have the tech pack but i had it is the 2.5 hatch. i would do without it. thats y i didn't care for the tech pack on the speed3. the navi sucks. both good cars. for me the gti and speed3 is a toss up. u won't be disappointed with which ever u choose. n u won't hate urself choosing the other over the other... drive the speed3 if u haven't already and see for urself.

[marco427]

I can try to answer some of your questions, but having escaped the cruelty of Northeast winters twenty-plus years ago, can only speculate on how your three, possible car choices might fare there.

First of all, don't be put off by the power of the Speed 3. The turbo responds to your right foot, and slippery conditions should not be any more of an issue with it than the other two front drivers.

My 2011 MS3 has the tech package, and this is my first Nav system, so I don't have a base of experience for comparisons, but I find it easy to see (and my eyes are 71 years old), and quite user friendly. My favorite gimmick is the rain sensing wiper system 'though.

Quality is a roll of the dice, but personally, based on my experience with a 1989 GTI that I bought new, I wouldn't have another VW as a gift. Other than a Fiat that I bought a decade and a half earlier, it was the worst piece of junk that I ever owned, and that roster consists of forty-plus cars.

[ahskeetz]

I've owned my 2010 for 14 months now and I can give my opinions on questions 1, 2, and 3.

Suspension - Being a sport-tuned suspension, the ride will be a bit harsher obviously than your focus. It's definitely bearable but if you're always on really shitty roads you might hate it.

Navigation - I for one do not have the tech package, but in retrospect I wish I had added that package, as it doesn't add much to your monthly payment and it gives your car a more premium feel. HIDs are a must, and if you're buying a new 2011 or 2012, you're lucky because you also have adaptive headlights that turn when you turn. The rest of the features are really nice to have as well; it just depends if you wanna spend the extra 2 or so thousand.

Winter - I drove my car through last winter on a set of snow tires and found it more than capable of handling Penn State winters. Get a good set of tires + turn on traction control and you're golden.

If I were you, I would wait until the Focus ST comes out and see what the differences are. It's a newer platform compared to the MS3 so I'm sure there will be some nice to have features. If you can't wait, go with the MS3! My buddy has a GTI and though they are nice, the handling and acceleration is behind the MS3.

Good luck!

[shaftyella]

My buddy just bought a 2011 GTi with the DSG and I had some time behind the wheel. I agree that the interior is MUCH nicer in the VW but the performance is no match. GTi felt much slower to me. Granted his car was stock and mine is modded. Comes down to what's more important to you. He also payed nearly 30k for it and I paid 24k out the door. If I could do it again I'd stick with my MS3 but the stock ride is pretty harsh over bad roads. Mod the suspension and it gets worse. Just my .02

[Spirry]

Originally Posted by nextgenerationx1 Gti is not a bad performing vehicle at all. The ms3's performance is not superior to the GTI, although the GTI is a lil more $$$, i believe the 200hp rated stock on the GTI is to the wheels while our MS3 is 260 rated to the crank. so we only really have 30 more whp. but def way more trq. we are heavier by 100lbs. I live on Long Island, but i do a lot of queens driving. its tolerable. just don't lower the car if your in NYC most of the time. I can't say much about the MS3 in the winter since i got mine 3 weeks ago. i'll have to find out this winter! and um i don't have the tech pack but i had it is the 2.5 hatch. i would do without it. thats y i didn't care for the tech pack on the speed3. the navi sucks. both good cars. for me the gti and speed3 is a toss up. u won't be disappointed with which ever u choose. n u won't hate urself choosing the other over the other... drive the speed3 if u haven't already and see for urself.

What has this guy been smoking? The GTI doesn't even compare performance wise. And don't get me started on their tiny turbo.

[SleeperHatch]

If you can hit 100,000 miles in a VW without and major problems your one lucky bastard. I've talked to mechanics and others that work at my local VW dealer and they all say they would never buy one because they always have problems..if you find the thread there's guys with ms3s that are well over 100,000 and still running strong. Japan built > German built

Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk

[ANITIX87]

Originally Posted by nextgenerationx1 drive the speed3 if u haven't already and see for urself.

I have, and I was actually really surprised at how much faster the MS3 felt compared to the GTI I had driven just days earlier. When testing the GTI, I had to turn left across oncoming traffic. I saw a gap and thought, "Well, this car is much faster than my Focus. I could make this gap in that car, so I'll try it in this one." I hit the gas and...nothing. The lag on it is intolerable. I made the turn successfully, but I was actually afraid I was going to get t-boned at one point because the car wasn't going anywhere. Granted, there's a big difference between an NA Focus and a Turbo GTI, but I was still surprised. That feeling never happened in the MS3.

Originally Posted by marco427 First of all, don't be put off by the power of the Speed 3. The turbo responds to your right foot, and slippery conditions should not be any more of an issue with it than the other two front drivers.

Sounds good.

Originally Posted by marco427 Quality is a roll of the dice, but personally, based on my experience with a 1989 GTI that I bought new, I wouldn't have another VW as a gift.

My dad said if I get a GTI, he won't put a dime into maintenance even if I'm broke, because after his 1989 Golf GTI, he will never voluntarily pay VW for a car. Funny how it's the same story with him!

Originally Posted by ahskeetz Suspension - Being a sport-tuned suspension, the ride will be a bit harsher obviously than your focus. It's definitely bearable but if you're always on really shitty roads you might hate it.

I was afraid of this comment being made by someone. Damn.

Originally Posted by ahskeetz Navigation - I for one do not have the tech package, but in retrospect I wish I had added that package...

I really, really like all the otherp stuff that comes with the Tech package. The HIDs, rain-sensors, and sound system all really appeal to me, too!

Originally Posted by ahskeetz Winter - I drove my car through last winter on a set of snow tires and found it more than capable of handling Penn State winters. Get a good set of tires + turn on traction control and you're golden.

This really, really reassures me a lot. I drove a Ford RS in Switzerland in the summer of 2009 and the winter of 2011 (my uncle owns a Ford dealership and let me take it out for the day the last couple of times I visited). In the summer, on summer tires, the car is blisteringly fast and a joy to drive. On Winters, I had a lot of torque hop in first and second gear, the road noise was intolerable, and even on ice/snow, the wheelspin was enough to drive you mad even when starting in second gear. I hated it.[/QUOTE]

Originally Posted by shaftyella If I could do it again I'd stick with my MS3 but the stock ride is pretty harsh over bad roads

Harsh enough that you ask your friends to drive when you go on road trips? Haha. I don't want to be stuck in a car I'm afraid to drive through New York because of the road quality, or a car I can't go on a long trip in because the suspension is intolerable for more than an hour (or because my girlfriend gets carsick with being bounced around!).

TIS

[davinspeed3]

I pretty much agree with what was said and it also sounds to me that you want a gti. I don't have tech package and live in Florida (so no snow),but I can comment on suspension. It is a sport tuned setup so yes it's a little rough.to me it's feels good on shorter trips but after a full day of driving your butt is going to feel it. Hmm maybe I should word that differently?.lol. Oh well. If your taking long trips alot,and/or your roads around there suck, and really concerned about comfort and your passengers comfort this may not be the car for you.on the other hand,with the ms3 if you passengers start bitching just floor it,take some sharp turns,and scare the shit out of them. Bet that shuts them up.

Can't say much for reliability as i had my car for only 7months and only have 4,300 miles(sits in garage alot).to me the car feels strong. I bought the car because for the money you can't beat it's performance and the overall fun it is to drive. I find the interior nice also. Well it's up to you man. Comfort=GTI. Sporty performance for good price=MS3..

Just remember though. Some of the oddest people I have ever met are VW owners.not sure if something happens to them after buying one or if the where strange before,but buy at own risk.

[ANITIX87]

Originally Posted by SuperSpeed3 If you can hit 100,000 miles in a VW without and major problems your one lucky bastard

Surprisingly, I think you're the first person to make a negative comment about VW reliability in general. I'm not doubting you, but not many people have grouped all the VWs in a group like this. Generally, someone gives a specific example (like my dad's 1989 GTI and the one mentioned by another poster). I guess I need to read up a bit more on VWs reliability history and build quality.

How have standard Mazda3 reliability numbers been? Are they lasting a long time with minor upkeep?

TIS

[Spirry]

Originally Posted by ANITIX87 Surprisingly, I think you're the first person to make a negative comment about VW reliability in general. I'm doubting you, but not many people have grouped all the VWs in a group like this. Generally, someone gives a specific example (like my dad's 1989 GTI and the one mentioned by another poster). I guess I need to read up a bit more on VWs reliability history and build quality. How have standard Mazda3 reliability numbers been? Are they lasting a long time with minor upkeep? TIS

VW's are notorious for electrical problems.

Also, get your self a set of Koni FSD's with cut bump stops = smooth ride.

[SleeperHatch]

Originally Posted by ANITIX87 Surprisingly, I think you're the first person to make a negative comment about VW reliability in general. I'm not doubting you, but not many people have grouped all the VWs in a group like this. Generally, someone gives a specific example (like my dad's 1989 GTI and the one mentioned by another poster). I guess I need to read up a bit more on VWs reliability history and build quality. How have standard Mazda3 reliability numbers been? Are they lasting a long time with minor upkeep? TIS

I cant speak for the regular 3 but if you can make a turbo'd motor that people tend to beat on regularly last well over 100,000 with no major problems I'm sure the regular 3 will hold up just fine

Sent from my PG86100 using Tapatalk

[ahskeetz]

Though I said the ride is somewhat harsh on shitty roads, it's no doubt bearable, unless you're a pansy or if you're GF is 9 months prego and afraid her water may break.

[G26]

Go with the MS3 for sure. I was in the same boat as you, 2000 focus zx3 nearing 100k. I test drove the ms3 and couldn't get enough.

Anyone I have known with a vw or audi the car has had issues.

MS3 Good:
1. Power
2. Ability to handle/make more power
3. Value (everything you get for your price is pretty great)
4. Interior (to me, I love the interior, and it feels made of very high quality materials)
5. Reliability if you don't mod is great, if you mod and *do it right*, it should last easily

Bad.
1. engine has a reputation for being weak, that was caused by inexperience on the platform, it has been proven that the stock motor can handle quite a bit of boost/power
2. Rear engine mount, stock one is a joke, that should be one of your first mods.
3. Gas mileage, if you are getting this car to sip fuel, look elsewhere.
4. Direct injection shits up the intake valves, run an oil catch can that will fix that.

[dizzydtrain]

I didn't bother reading everyone else's reply.

I test drove both and the GTI was too boring and not as involving as a drivers car compared to the speed3. I definitely liked the interior of the GTI and the performance was good, but not great. The speed3 can walk even modded GTI's fairly easily--plenty of that on this site.

It's entirely up to you what you are looking for in a car. The speed3 is a sporty experience that is still practical. The GTI caters more on the touring side of things with a more supple ride and plush interior. It's the kind of car you can take on a long road trip and feel comfortable. The speed3 does a lot of things and does them well-to really well. It won't be as comfortable as the GTI but it's not made to do that either.

Reliability wise the speed3 is more likely to last you. You will get mixed messages from people who have owned a VW in the past but I was not ready to take a chance on a car notorious for electronic gremlims--If you plan on keeping your car for that long then get ready to shell out a ton of money for repair costs for the VW. The speed3 is reliable as long as you take care of it--Now modded is a different story altogether for both. Stock for stock, imho the speed is the winner and it's cheaper to fix.

The tech package is a waste of money imho as well. Plenty of people are upgrading their bose systems and going aftermarket with their headunits. For the price of the techpackage, you get a nice stealthbox sub, component speakers, and HU. If you are ok with the sound and want to keep everything factory, by all means upgrade--it will still be cheaper than what it would cost to get the GTI with comparable upgrades. By the time you upgrade the GTI to what the speed offers, you can be buying yourself a lot more car.

[tddvrrn]

the speed3 suspension isn't too bad, just firm. i replaced my oem struts and shocks at 55k with some sensen shocks ($150 for all 4) and the ride is even better. smoother but still firm. i've also heard koni FSDs are great replacements that smooth things out without sacrificing handling..

bottom line: the stock suspension is fine, but doesn't last the longest. non stock replacements will improve the ride.

other than that, my car has been great so far. i'm at 56k and have put 28k of those on it myself. there have been no issues, just struts/shock replacement. everything else was annoying small stuff that i had sorted out under warranty. it feels like it will last forever. also, it was fine this past winter in the snow, until we got 2 feet. then it bottomed out.

as for vw, my ast car was a passat and i sold it with 147k on the odo and it was still running strong. great car. but a friend of mine has a passat and there is always something going wrong.. it just seems like there are the occasional lemons, as with all car companies, but when vw fucks up they seem to go for the full fuck up, not a half assed job.

[themytb]

I have a severe hatred for german cars/ engineering so I will not clog up your thread with all my hate, but I will say mazda>VW. And one more thing most vw owners I have met were women or fags, so I believe vw ownership may cause wiener love. Be careful.

[Rustysocket]

I am really enjoying my '11 Speed3 with Tech. Solid little car, not so great mileage. Have a new RMM on it's way. (people here are too proud of their used shit so ordered new for less). Car is pig rich from factory, so will need an AP to fix that. Love the torque steer, and the point and shoot power.

Best of all.... I love the front end smile... how can you not be happy with a car that grins at you.


fwiw, I also own a VW. Never had trouble with any of them, do the maintenance.


Only car I would personally not buy again, was the 2012 Focus I bought in may, that spent more time at the dealer than it did at my home. The customer service was shit as was the car. I'd possibly look at an ST in the future, but if it has the MFT electronics in it Ford can fucking keep it. Fucking Bastards

[ANITIX87]

Originally Posted by ahskeetz Though I said the ride is somewhat harsh on shitty roads, it's no doubt bearable, unless you're a pansy or if you're GF is 9 months prego and afraid her water may break.

Thanks for that wonderful analogy. Haha. I'll make sure if she gets pregnant we'll use her car, I guess!

Originally Posted by G26 Go with the MS3 for sure. I was in the same boat as you, 2000 focus zx3 nearing 100k. I test drove the ms3 and couldn't get enough.

Thanks for the info and the rundown. The mods you suggested look interesting. I've read about the rear engine mount issue, but I have to admit I don't really know what it all means. What does the stock one do poorly, that an aftermarket one will fix?

Originally Posted by dizzydtrain I didn't bother reading everyone else's reply.

No need to, when you're giving feedback like that. I really, really appreciate the time you took to write all that out. It's all the information I could have hoped for, in one place. I'll be reading that post a lot between now and when I'm ready to buy. Thanks again.

Originally Posted by tddvrrn bottom line: the stock suspension is fine, but doesn't last the longest. non stock replacements will improve the ride.

As I plan to have my car a long time, suspension replacement will definitely be something I'll hvae to take a look at eventually. Good to know there are third-party options that MS3 owners seem really happy with.

Originally Posted by themytb I have a severe hatred for german cars/ engineering so I will not clog up your thread with all my hate, but I will say mazda>VW. And one more thing most vw owners I have met were women or fags, so I believe vw ownership may cause wiener love. Be careful.

That's an...incredibly...disrespectful post. No chance of "wiener love" here, but I'll keep the risk in mind, I guess?

Originally Posted by Rustysocket I am really enjoying my '11 Speed3 with Tech. Solid little car, not so great mileage. Have a new RMM on it's way. (people here are too proud of their used shit so ordered new for less). Car is pig rich from factory, so will need an AP to fix that. Love the torque steer, and the point and shoot power.

Here's where my car knowledge takes a dive into oblivion. What's an RMM? I'm also quite surprised the car runs rich from factory. I know two people with MS3s who said their cars ran quite lean and while they liked the gas mileage, the performance wasn't up to par.

TIS

[G26]

RMM = rear motor mount. The stock one is the same one off the base mazda3 and can't really handle the torque that the ms3 puts out, so the engine moves around unnecessarily.

It is an ez swap, taking about 1hr and an aftermarket rmm can be had for $80-150.

If their cars were running lean they had issues, the car runs a very rich afr stock 9s and 10s. Most of us with Accessports tune it so it runs between 11.5-12.2 afr.

[Rustysocket]

RMM = rear motor mount.

Can't speak for lean cars, but it is generally accepted that these cars are pig rich from the factory, and the black shit on my pipes and all over the back of my hatch confirms that.

[adlpb]

I've had a bad experience with my VW so I may be a bit biased. My brother owned a VW passat and he had to replace the entire front axle at one point. He had a stock car. I also had a Passat (first car) and spent a lot of money on maintenance, to the point where I had to sell it. They are also plagued with electrical problems, as some have stated here.

[ahskeetz]

Gas mileage depends on how you drive. I use to drive 75 - 80 on the highway and would get 26-27 mpg for a 180 mile trip. I experimented a bit and drove 65-70 for the same trip and got 29mpg. Gas mileage is not bad if you drive with fuel economy in mind, but if you are always on the throttle you'll get as low as 16mpg (lowest i've gotten)

[Ex_WRX_driver]

Ive had my 2011 for 7 months and racked up 15,000 miles already. Nothing but oil changes and tire rotations.


Ima kill my 100K warranty in about 2 years.

Fuck commuting.

[themytb]

Originally Posted by ANITIX87 That's an...incredibly...disrespectful post. No chance of "wiener love" here, but I'll keep the risk in mind, I guess? Here's where my car knowledge takes a dive into oblivion. What's an RMM? I'm also quite surprised the car runs rich from factory. I know two people with MS3s who said their cars ran quite lean and while they liked the gas mileage, the performance wasn't up to par. TIS

No disrepespect intended, playful joking from an anti VW guy.

I have a gen 1, I like it for what it is, I think its the only available fwd car I would buy.
Every problem my car has had(very few) are caused by modding and some mistakes.

I believe this will be the usual story with a speed 3. I believe the story of a GTI is quite different. I also believe you will pay more for a GTI because it is German and too many people believe german engineering is on some higher level, so a higher price is accepted.

also ms3 running to lean = bad tune, lack of tune when needed for mods done, or someone doesn't know what they are talking about.

[tddvrrn]

Originally Posted by ANITIX87 That's an...incredibly...disrespectful post. No chance of "wiener love" here, but I'll keep the risk in mind, I guess?

there is tons of joking around like that on this forum. if you stick around, you'll get used to it. so don't be offended by shit like that, it's never directed at you personally, it's just how some of us are.

if you've ever hung around a mechanic's or body shop, it would all seem pretty tame compared to the banter there...

[sheldonross]

Originally Posted by ANITIX87 Surprisingly, I think you're the first person to make a negative comment about VW reliability in general.

???? What? Hey Mazda's not that much better, but VWs have horrible reliability.

FYI, I believe the CR ratings ranking (21st see the +4 in the rightmost column aka 25th last year) is the best VW has done in about 5 years.

As you can see JD powers still has them 6th from the bottom.

[bms3mtb]

If you want an urban assault winter survival vehicle... wrong type of car.

Winter tire choice will determine how well it handles snow; potholes are another matter - esp. on stock low profile tires, but I haven't had any troubles yet on shitty, over-salted MD roads.

MS3 > VW by sheer $ alone; i didn't even bother test driving the VW b/c the cost was so high, and the MS3 finish is honestly pretty nice given comparison to say a WRX...

Bottom line, I would say this car is for spirited driving. If you want something reliable, soft, and luxurious - again, wrong segment. If you want something with decent reliability, a FUN ride and FUN power, and a nice finish, then you're on the right track.

[PunjabiPlaya]

buy Focus ST

or buy ms3 and be a part of one of the best fucking communities on the web

[ANITIX87]

Originally Posted by ahskeetz Gas mileage is not bad if you drive with fuel economy in mind, but if you are always on the throttle you'll get as low as 16mpg (lowest i've gotten)

Love that you're getting numbers that high. I run around 26MPG on the combined cycle with my Focus and get up to 28 when I'm being frugal. Glad that I won't have to do much worse with an MS3.

Originally Posted by G26 If their cars were running lean they had issues, the car runs a very rich afr stock 9s and 10s. Most of us with Accessports tune it so it runs between 11.5-12.2 afr.

Wow. Even that is quite rich, though I guess the size of turbo demands it.

Originally Posted by themytb No disrepespect intended, playful joking from an anti VW guy.

Fair. I'm not offended, just always wary of others.

Originally Posted by tddvrrn there is tons of joking around like that on this forum. if you stick around, you'll get used to it. so don't be offended by shit like that, it's never directed at you personally, it's just how some of us are.

I don't take that stuff personally. I would just hate for one of my threads (especially one that's not in the "anything goes" forum) to take a bad turn because someone misunderstands something.

Originally Posted by bms3mtb Bottom line, I would say this car is for spirited driving. If you want something reliable, soft, and luxurious - again, wrong segment. If you want something with decent reliability, a FUN ride and FUN power, and a nice finish, then you're on the right track.

The MS3 is exactly what I want in a car, except that the GTI offers something fantastic in its ride quality and interior build. It's not that I only want a luxury car, but I'm wondering if the MS3 is worth the ride sacrifice (and, on the other hand, whether the GTI is worth the performance sacrifice).

Originally Posted by PunjabiPlaya buy Focus ST or buy ms3 and be a part of one of the best fucking communities on the web

It has certainly been interesting on my first day. The ST will join my list if it's out by the time I'm ready to buy. I've driven the Euro-spec ST and the RS500 in Switzerland, and Ford's RS division makes incredibly vehicles.

TIS

[Stingray69]

How fun will nice interior be on a commute? I find the interior in my MS3 to be good quality and very functional. The guys bitching about the Navi must have bad eyes. I find mine functional and big enough to see. It is also nice to have it integrated into the sound system so voice commands turn down audio and come over the speakers. Iv'e had mine 6 months and still enjoy driving it everyday. If you are looking for nice interior and smooth ride buy a cadillac. I don't find the suspension too rough at all. Try driving a 3/4 ton pickup....thats rough. Low profile tires and New York streets might be a problem. Let us know when you pick it up!





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[rghispanic88]

Damn, too much reading.

all i have to say is MS3

[analbumcover]

Originally Posted by Rustysocket fwiw, I also own a VW. Never had trouble with any of them, do the maintenance.

I cant chime in on the MS3 questions but I own 4 VW's. 99 Beetle, 2008 Jetta 2.0T, 2011 Jetta 2.5 SE, and 2012 VW CC 2.0T. The 08 has 65k miles, no problems. The 99 Beetle, bought used @ 125k paid $1500, burns oil like a mofo never left me stranded. The other 2 are too new to be relevant.

The key to the VW's are maintenance...now im gonna find a really, really large piece of wood and knock on it for about half an hour.

edit: VW interior > Mazda. Without a doubt. Its just a fact, the GTI interior is near lexus grade in materials and execution.

[ANITIX87]

Originally Posted by stingray How fun will nice interior be on a commute?

My "commute" every morning is a 7-minute drive to the train station for now. Hopefully, it won't involve my car at all a few months from now when I'm looking to buy. However, my girlfriend lives in central NJ, so I do a lot of distance driving. That's when a nice interior and better drive would be pleasant.

Originally Posted by rghispanic88 Damn, too much reading. all i have to say is MS3

What incredible feedback. That's exactly why I came to this site! Thanks!

Originally Posted by analbumcover The key to the VW's are maintenance...now im gonna find a really, really large piece of wood and knock on it for about half an hour.

And does that maintenance cost an arm and a leg? (Amazing username, incidentally).

TIS

[Monotonous ONE]

sounds like you dont want to turn a wrench too much


disregard ms3 acquire st

[analbumcover]

Originally Posted by ANITIX87 And does that maintenance cost an arm and a leg? (Amazing username, incidentally). TIS

umm, its reasonable. Full syn. oil change at the stealership is $90 (they also use BG MOA so...)

other than than recommended maint., most expensive was the DSG fluid change, $500 every 40k miles, its a reasonably small price for a fantastic gearbox.

[ANITIX87]

Originally Posted by Monotonous ONE Disregard MS3

I said right from the get-go that I'm not a super hands-on guy and that modding wasn't in my future. Having said that, I'm perfectly happy with the MS3's performance. I'll do the basic stuff like RMM, winter wheels, and maybe an RSB replacement, but I don't see myself adding an AP, flashing the ECU, or throwing on thousands of dollars in performance mods.

Originally Posted by analbumcover umm, its reasonable. Full syn. oil change at the stealership is $90

I do oil myself, and I'd get the 6-sp, so those don't apply to me, but nice to hear the dealership doesn't rob you blind.

TIS

[G26]

I just looked at a pic of the GTI interior, that shit looks mad boring. Looks like every other boring ass interior out there.

[adlpb]

I agree, I don't see what the hype is with the interior. It looks plain and old (minus the screen) which is an additional package itself. You can get a screen for the MS3 for $400. The leather seats are an additional $3K or so. No thanks