Trying to get over 300HP

[himurax13]

Originally Posted by 8.5MS3 im at 325 on 93 with a cobb sri and tip, 3" isnt necessary i also hold 19psi @ redline, im on my 3rd turbo but thats a whole different discussion

But on the corn right?

[fortressofcomfort]

Originally Posted by himurax13 I think the power curve/power band is more important.

Ding we have a winner!

A peak of 300hp that falls off quickly on either side is not going to be fast.

A 280hp tune that holds it from 4500-6000rpms will be the faster car.

Oh and I got you all beat. 400whp on a K04. According to VDyno. It was a run down Pikes Peak near the bottom but who cares?

So many variables. Dyno to dyno, self-testing methodologies, settings differences, weather, a ringer, good fuel/bad fuel, fuel with octane booster in it, etc etc. That's why I say get the shit out on the street (or preferably the strip) and see what it will do. 2 cars side by side running down the same piece of asphalt; can't get any more closely matched for comparison than that.

[8.5MS3]

No straight 93

Peak tq @ 4k - 360 lb-ft

300hp @ 4.5k

325hp @ 5500

300hp @ 6k

~280hp @ redline

Chassis dyno, 0 correction factor, 0 smoothing same one double and kmac both hit 500 on

[iggy097]

Originally Posted by himurax13 So true. I don't know why the damn car is so quiet either. OP, without a good tune, forget about getting over 300HP. You might have an easier time getting to 300 if you went with a SRI and TIP that is 3" or more. 1 step colder plugs help with KR at higher boost and timing.

I do have a good tune, just haven't sprung for the dyno yet, as my wife was up my ass on me spending money on the escort 9500ix and some new camera equipment.

I try to work on trade when possible, trying to hold out for a dyno shop that needs some work done before I shell out the cash.

*I think we about covered it here, the dyno finish for the tune is the next step for the bang for the buck. Now let me get back to editing my pron*

[himurax13]

Originally Posted by iggy097 I do have a good tune, just haven't sprung for the dyno yet, as my wife was up my ass on me spending money on the escort 9500ix and some new camera equipment. I try to work on trade when possible, trying to hold out for a dyno shop that needs some work done before I shell out the cash. *I think we about covered it here, the dyno finish for the tune is the next step for the bang for the buck. Now let me get back to editing my pron*

While I am all about getting back to porn, here are a few things to consider:

1. I am fairly certain your tuner gave you some suggestions to increase HP.
2. Since it appears that you are running a stock interfooler, you could probably pick up a used aftermarket TMIC that could put you over the top for $300 or less. You may or may not need to retune. Run some Logs and post them.
3. If you don't have them already, 1 step colder plugs could let you run more timing to get you over the hump. Your tuner can handle that for you.
Its like $40 for a set and make sure you gap them to .026 to .028.
4. You could wait till the ambient temperature drops 20 to 30 degrees. Turbos make more power in cooler weather.
5. You could install a new DP but it is a pain in the ass to install, will cost you a few hundred $, and you will need to retune to get that power.

That is all I have to get the power you want on a budget. If your tuner thinks he can get you more power for $150 on the Dyno, that seems like a bargain.

Honestly though, you have decent power for the mods you do have.

[phate]

Originally Posted by himurax13 2. Since it appears that you are running a stock interfooler, you could probably pick up a used aftermarket TMIC that could put you over the top for $300 or less. You may or may not need to retune. Run some Logs and post them. With E85, we pretty much max out the turbo. The stock intercooler is not a restriction at K04 flow levels, so no power is picked up this way. 3. If you don't have them already, 1 step colder plugs could let you run more timing to get you over the hump. Your tuner can handle that for you. Its like $40 for a set and make sure you gap them to .026 to .028. With just a little bit of E85 (~17% additional), we completely remove the knock limitation in this engine. Timing is already far beyond what his pump gas can handle, but it is a street tune. Only the foolish will push timing on the street, it simply isn't safe. I've had enough cars on the dyno to know I'm not willing to jeopardize someone else's engine with street tuning high timing. I have a comfort limit, and that is where it rides until dyno time. 4. You could wait till the ambient temperature drops 20 to 30 degrees. Turbos make more power in cooler weather. lol, true. We all love cold weather.

Notes in red.
@iggy097 - Let me know and we can do a remote dyno session

[himurax13]

Phate, so in a nutshell, 30%+ E-85 eliminates the need for a FMIC and 1 step colder plugs?

[phate]

Originally Posted by himurax13 Phate, so in a nutshell, 30%+ E-85 eliminates the need for a FMIC and 1 step colder plugs?

From my experience, yes.

But, a lot of guys want to make good power on straight gas, as well, so they benefit from the extra parts when they're running it.

I never cared about making power on 93...it's used to get me to the next E85 station

[himurax13]

Originally Posted by phate From my experience, yes. But, a lot of guys want to make good power on straight gas, as well, so they benefit from the extra parts when they're running it. I never cared about making power on 93...it's used to get me to the next E85 station

So for the K04 guys who wanna go cheap, E-85 lets them skip the plugs and FMIC.

So for someone who still has a K04 and already has the plugs and the FMIC, the difference in power going to E-85 will be much less than someone who has the stock plugs and a TMIC.

That explains the 45hp jump when I go from 91 to E-85 mix. Being in the hippy tree-hugger state, I figure E-85 would be more plentiful around here but it is not. I have to go 35 miles out of my way to get it .

[phate]

Originally Posted by himurax13 So for the K04 guys who wanna go cheap, E-85 lets them skip the plugs and FMIC. So for someone who still has a K04 and already has the plugs and the FMIC, the difference in power going to E-85 will be much less than someone who has the stock plugs and a TMIC. That explains the 45hp jump when I go from 91 to E-85 mix. Being in the hippy tree-hugger state, I figure E-85 would be more plentiful around here but it is not. I have to go 35 miles out of my way to get it .

Yep, you nailed it. E85 is the shortcut, lol.

[shopety2012]

Originally Posted by silvapain Intake, HPFP internals, DP, and AP and you can hit 300WHp no problem. You're being held back by the stock downpipe. Tapadatass

on a dyno jet correct?
i have seen no such numbers on a mustang dyno

[phate]

Here we go, for those that haven't seen it. This is buried in another good thread talking about gains from parts and whatnot:

3" MAF + Stock TMIC = Win?

^^It explains why I say 'no gains beyond intake/downpipe' with E85.

[silvapain]

Originally Posted by phate Here we go, for those that haven't seen it. This is buried in another good thread talking about gains from parts and whatnot: 3" MAF + Stock TMIC = Win? ^^It explains why I say 'no gains beyond intake/downpipe' with E85.

I actually sold my ETS TMIC and I am going back to stock, as I saw literally NO performance improvement with the larger TMIC on 100% E85.


Tapadatass

[ms3rick]

My gs is so low 230-250s depending on temps even with e85 I think I would gain more power from tmic then dp


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[phate]

Originally Posted by ms3rick My gs is so low 230-250s depending on temps even with e85 I think I would gain more power from tmic then dp Sent from my dizzLe using RaWr powers!

g/s is not always a good indicator for power potential.

[ms3rick]

Originally Posted by phate g/s is not always a good indicator for power potential.

Good read, I really want a larger intake then cs, but having horrible luck and in California I have to follow fucking carb laws.. Thanks again for that link!


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[fortressofcomfort]

Originally Posted by phate g/s is not always a good indicator for power potential.

Agreed. All things being equal (hardware and tune) it is a useful number to log and check. I always do. But think about it, that number represents the mass (amount) of air coming into the system; that's a measurement at the VERY BEGINNING of the air's travel through the system. And by system I mean the turbo, intercooler, manifolds, head, exhaust, plumbing, etc. etc. So a car with 230g/s could very well clock a car making 260g/s.

Boost but even moreso timing could radically change the motor's output irregardless of g/s. There is still a correlation but it isn't as direct. You can flow as much air (and therefore fuel) through the engine as you'd like; but how that air/fuel mixture is converted from potential chemical energy into mechanical energy (pistons pushing down on the rotating assembly) happens well after the MAF reading. There are many other variables that are "loosely" related to g/s readings but all in all it is a reasonable way to keep an eye on your engine's health.

So to some extent g/s is like the old adage "it's not how big you are, its how you use it." lol

[phate]

Originally Posted by fortressofcomfort Agreed. All things being equal (hardware and tune) it is a useful number to log and check. I always do. But think about it, that number represents the mass (amount) of air coming into the system; that's a measurement at the VERY BEGINNING of the air's travel through the system. And by system I mean the turbo, intercooler, manifolds, head, exhaust, plumbing, etc. etc. So a car with 230g/s could very well clock a car making 260g/s. Boost but even moreso timing could radically change the motor's output irregardless of g/s. There is still a correlation but it isn't as direct. You can flow as much air (and therefore fuel) through the engine as you'd like; but how that air/fuel mixture is converted from potential chemical energy into mechanical energy (pistons pushing down on the rotating assembly) happens well after the MAF reading. There are many other variables that are "loosely" related to g/s readings but all in all it is a reasonable way to keep an eye on your engine's health. So to some extent g/s is like the old adage "it's not how big you are, its how you use it." lol

lol, I wasn't even meaning that much. 230g/s is not the same as 230g/s in the next car. Hell, 230g/s isn't the same after you change hard parts sometimes I just meant it's a very unreliable indicator. [And vice versa - I've had e85 cars on the dyno making similar power, but the difference in g/s is more significant than the difference in power.]

Then when you want to throw some eth or meth into the equation....it's very easy to skew these things.

[fortressofcomfort]

That's why Dizzy is #1 in my book (just a tiny tiny bit ahead of other very good tuners like Hypnotic and ATVFreeks company and Stratified). I always learn something from Phates or Bucker's posts and they always seem to be in a good mood. I suppose I could say the same thing about Lex and Justin too. It shows their passion is true, their knowledge is bountiful, and taking time to work with the customer (in this sense, answering a question or comment on the forum) shows their true motivation.

[ms3rick]

By the way on vdyno my 230g/s on vd 1.8.9 dj smoothing 6 is 290hp hp and cold 250s is 308hp.


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[minger]

http://www.moccforums.com/forums/ind...?topic=30303.0

They're saying they got this on 91...no way...

[phate]

Originally Posted by minger stock mazda3 dyno video. They're saying they got this on 91...no way...

Every dyno reads differently. Do you know what shop it was at or what kind of dyno?

[lilred]

Originally Posted by minger http://www.moccforums.com/forums/ind...?topic=30303.0 They're saying they got this on 91...no way...

Guy love Cobb hard parts, I wonder if he dyno'd at church

tapafuck

[phate]

Originally Posted by lilred Guy love Cobb hard parts, I wonder if he dyno'd at church tapafuck

My thought, exactly, haha.

[lilred]

Originally Posted by phate My thought, exactly, haha.

To me just stating "STOCK EXHUAST" makes me believe he's under the impresion that its a major bottle neck but I've Subbed to that thread a while ago to se what becomes of it lol

tapafuck

[iggy097]

Originally Posted by himurax13 That explains the 45hp jump when I go from 91 to E-85 mix. Being in the hippy tree-hugger state, I figure E-85 would be more plentiful around here but it is not. I have to go 35 miles out of my way to get it .

Same here, that's why I bring a 5gallon and 1 gallon container and fill them up with corn, along with my tank, that way I only have to go out there once every three weeks, since I get about a week on a full tank.

[8.5MS3]

to add to the g/s indicator being a bad benchmark

@daafish and I dynod same day,he was at 16psi or so and put down 29xhp

I push anywhere from 280g/s - 300 g/s depending on conditions @ 20-21psi

and that was only good for 25ish HP

the gains of running high boost on the k04 are crippled due to how far off the compressor island you get.

tbh i feel almost no difference between 3/4 throttle and WOT

[Onelovesoccer]

Originally Posted by ms3rick Good read, I really want a larger intake then cs, but having horrible luck and in California I have to follow fucking carb laws.. Thanks again for that link! Sent from my dizzLe using RaWr powers!

i'm moving to san diego and pissed that the carb law applies to an intake too. i called up SURE and they stated they've had their entire Aeros line under going carb testing for about two years now. they hope it'll be certified by the end of 2012. i hope so, because i want the full3.

[ms3rick]

Originally Posted by Onelovesoccer i'm moving to san diego and pissed that the carb law applies to an intake too. i called up SURE and they stated they've had their entire Aeros line under going carb testing for about two years now. they hope it'll be certified by the end of 2012. i hope so, because i want the full3.

OOOOOOOO Me too! Be sure to check out Nator out here, we are pretty active!

[Oliverms3]

Originally Posted by lilred Guy love Cobb hard parts, I wonder if he dyno'd at church tapafuck

haha.. lol

[rfinkle2]

G/S is a crappy indicator car to car.

I know someone making 400 hp flowing ~ 330 g/s.

@fortressofcomfort

[fortressofcomfort]

Originally Posted by rfinkle2 G/S is a crappy indicator car to car. I know someone making 400 hp flowing ~ 330 g/s. @fortressofcomfort

Yes, car to car it is a crappy indicator, just like dyno numbers.

Within the same car however, it could be used as part of a set of health measurements, just like dyno numbers, no? I dunno I always log it and check it.

I don't know where I said it is a useful value to compare car to car Rob You know how I hate these car to car number comparison threads.