What are you paying monthly?

[crankshaft]

Too much, IMO. But I justify it because I haven't had a car payment in over 15 years....and I'm gonna drive it till the wheels fall off.

[MS_Driver]

LIke was said before - payments are only part of it. Someone can get on here and say, "my payments are $700/month." and that would be shocking - unless they said they have a 3 year loan at 1% with 0 down for a tech with every dealer installed option.

So, I'm in about $30k OTD including extended warranty @7% (yes, I know it's high - get over it) for 6 years with payments of $470.

[jeek]

Originally Posted by H I F I I feel rather stuck. My current car is barely mobile, and I need to get in a new car before I go back to work (Sunday). I owe about 6,800 on it and because of some mechanical issues they are offering me 4k for it. The upside down equity and the car (2010 speed3 tech) leaves me in the ball park of $450 a month. The finance manager is calling my current bank in the morning and feels confident he can get the payment around $410. I've been through three different dealers and different cars and have ran into this same problem. What do you think?

I wouldn't do this if I were you. You don't seem like you're thinking rationally here. All you need right now is a car that runs and gets you from point A to point B. You can worry about the niceties later. $450/mo as the minimum payment is simply way too much for this car; you'll never have $$ to mod or go to the track. Personally, I'd put more down on the car so you don't pay as much. It doesn't seem like you have this cash available though, so this is fate telling you that it's not your time yet. The banks and dealers will be extra willing to get you on a shitty payment plan, because you'll pay a lot of interest, but you need to do what's best for you -- and it's not that.

What I would do in your situation is, on a spreadsheet or a piece of paper, write out some numbers. First, I'd figure out how much it'd cost to fix up your current car. You need to understand that financing a new car is not going to be an option if you want to be smart. Do like 20 minutes of research and figure out the cost of parts. Can you fix it yourself? You'll save the $$ you'd spend in labor. If not, calculate labor costs or get a quote from your local mechanic.

Next, I'd figure out if it's worth it to just trade the car in at it's current state for a beater at your local used car dealer. I drove around an old 2000 Corolla before I got my MS3. I paid in cash for that car and I was spending practically next to nothing on insurance and maintence was almost nonexistant besides the basic stuff like oil, filters and tires (which were like $50/each on steelies...amazing). I feel that you won't consider this an option as you're most likely thinking that you need the "cool turbo car", but that's the incorrect mindset, unless you're a ricer.

Then, I'd start saving. The more agressive you are, the sooner you'll get the MS3.

This is basic financial advice. If you're contemplating putting yourself into a bind over a car (MS3 or not), then you need to reconsider your priorities. I would advise that you do not bend over backwards for a new car and instead be smart about your current situation.

[bvbull200]

Originally Posted by btstarcher It's not a daily thing. I only live 25 miles from work, but I only work about half the time. The rest of the time I'm either visiting my son (130 miles away) or my family (around 120 miles away). Sometimes I can stay at my ex's, which saves me quite a bit of miles. Also when I'm bored I just drive. So a car I truly enjoy is very important to me. I also have to help out my ex a lot with our son; even after working 12 hours I've had to drive 130 miles to watch him or take him somewhere because she can't. Yeah it's kinda ridiculous, but he's my son; if he can't live with me at least I get to see him alot.

None of that explains 50k - 75k miles every year.

[hawkinsdp]

Originally Posted by H I F I I feel rather stuck. My current car is barely mobile, and I need to get in a new car before I go back to work (Sunday). What do you think?

First, I think you're getting fucked by a dealer who is taking advantage of you by negotiating based upon the monthly rate. First rule of buying a car is that you negotiate the out-the-door price and have your own financing in hand. If they can do a better rate on the financing? Sure. If not, you already know what you're paying before you even walk in the dealership.

Second, I think that if you desperately need a car and you're stressed out about potentially paying upwards of $400/mo for a car, you need to be looking at a cheaper car. Shit, you can buy a brand new base-model Mazda 3 for like $17k. I drove a beater for years until I could comfortably afford something nicer. A good rule of thumb is that your car payment should never be more than 20% of your monthly income.

[CaptObvious75]

Originally Posted by torq You guys are making us Canadians jealous, I bought a new 2010 MS3 w tech in sept of 2010, I had a choice of 0% for 72 months or 2k off if I payed cash. That worked out to about a 3% interest rate which was less than I was paying on my mortgage at the time so I took the 0%. They knocked 1k off for being late in the model year. The kicker is that OTD (with taxes) is was approx 38k. The dealers don't get that many and there aren't any used ones available so they won't really budge. We get hosed by high taxes and 6% import fees as it's not covered under NAFTA. I could afford it and wanted new so no biggie, but it hurts seeing these 20k numbers thrown around ;( By comparison an STI is around 50k OTD up here. so, count yourself lucky.

I got lucky and got a leftover 2010 7 months ago for 25k plus tax

[RussM]

I gather your fairly young so you might want to find out what you would add to that payment total a month when you fully insure the car, me thinks you will be over your head!! Repair you car and keep it, or try and sell it out right and truly get something you can afford, remember 60 months of car payments of $400+ a month plus possible $100 a month insurance won't be your freind!

[bvbull200]

If you are upside down on a car, your best bet it to get in to a situation where you have equity as soon as possible. When you roll that negative equity over to another vehicle, you make it that much more difficult to gain equity in the new car. You $4k in negative equity ends up being $8k the next time you "want" to buy another car.

The more expensive the car, the bigger the amount lost in depreciation. If you need a running car, get something cheap, buckle down, and get the damn thing paid off or, at the very least, to a point where it is worth more than you owe. Then go buy an MS3 when your trade lowers the purchase price, not raises it.

[Ryguy]

The good-$360mo

The bad-72mo

[CaptObvious75]

Originally Posted by bvbull200 If you are upside down on a car, your best bet it to get in to a situation where you have equity as soon as possible. When you roll that negative equity over to another vehicle, you make it that much more difficult to gain equity in the new car. You $4k in negative equity ends up being $8k the next time you "want" to buy another car. The more expensive the car, the bigger the amount lost in depreciation. If you need a running car, get something cheap, buckle down, and get the damn thing paid off or, at the very least, to a point where it is worth more than you owe. Then go buy an MS3 when your trade lowers the purchase price, not raises it.

What if you don't buy another car and get 0% interest vs your other car loan that has interest? Then it makes sense.

Negative equity only matters IF you want to get rid of your car. If you plan on keeping the car until the wheels fall off, then equity means nothing.

I don't even look at cars as an investment, nor should anyone else. You ALWAYS lose money in the end. 99% of the time you never get back what you paid for the car, so as an "investment," its a pretty poor one. No one invests to lose money

[Stingray69]

Just talking monthly payments isn't looking past........ well a month.
Rolling money owed on one car into the next one which will immediately depreciate is going to compound your bad situation.
I personally wouldn't do either but hey you only live once do what you want.
In before OP disregards all the good advice on here and dives in head first.............in the shallow end.

[bvbull200]

Originally Posted by CaptObvious75 What if you don't buy another car and get 0% interest vs your other car loan that has interest? Then it makes sense.

I'm not certain this question even makes sense. The two options are to not buy another car or keep your current car? Isn't that the same thing?

Originally Posted by CaptObvious75 Negative equity only matters IF you want to get rid of your car. If you plan on keeping the car until the wheels fall off, then equity means nothing.

I'm not sure if you read this thread. I'm guessing you haven't. OP has a car that is barely mobile that he needs to get rid of. His negative equity is certainly a factor. Beyond that, he wants to get an MS3. If that is his goal, he absolutely needs to find a way to put himself in a position where he has equity in a vehicle. It could be fixing up his current car or it could be finding an inexpensive replacement vehicle. A good deal on a cheap car makes building equity pretty easy.

By the way, if you drive a car until the wheels fall off, it can be pretty well assumed that you paid it off in that time. Even if the car can only be sold for scrap, you have equity in it.

Originally Posted by CaptObvious75 I don't even look at cars as an investment, nor should anyone else. You ALWAYS lose money in the end. 99% of the time you never get back what you paid for the car, so as an "investment," its a pretty poor one. No one invests to lose money

Well, if we are getting technical, it can/is considered an investment. Not all investments are made with the intention of returning a profit. Buying a car is just an investment in a depreciating asset, with the "payoff" being having your own method of transportation.

Of course, I don't think anyone in here is suggesting that the OP find a car that he can buy, drive, then sell for more than he paid. That simply isn't feasible. The suggestions here are to forego the MS3 for a brief period while he puts himself in a more advantageous purchasing position in the near future. He's only $2,800 upside down. Shouldn't be too hard to get on the right side of things. If not addressed, though, it could snowball quickly.

[ANITIX87]

I am disgusted at some of the approaches I see on here (and elsewhere) regarding finances. Yes, the MS3 is a niche car. Yes, we all really, really, really wanted one when we got it. But putting yourself in the red?! Putting NO fucking money down? It's all just so fucking stupid. I held off buying my MS3 for 4 damn years (first liked it in 2008 when I turned 21 looked at new cars). I bought a POS Ford Focus until I could put 50% down in cash for a Speed. It took my until April 2012 (and a stroke of luck with work), but I bought my 2012 tech CWP in April for 26,680 OTD, with 17K down, and am paying $199/month on 2.99% for 60 months, because I worked hard to save money and build my fucking credit. No negative equity, no outstanding debt (my MS3 is now the ONLY thing I owe money on), etc. Now, granted, I don't own a house so I don't have a mortgage, but the approach some people have (in general, not just in this thread) about using loans and credit cards to their advantage is just sickening. And then we wonder why we're in an economic crisis...

/rant

TIS

[galens47]

0 down. 800 credit score. 2.9% interest. 60 mo loan $470

May refi in a while to lower interest, but not worried now.

G

Sent from my sortasmart HTC

[whyser]

Originally Posted by H I F I Just got back from the dealer, looking at a 2010 GenPu with 29k miles asking 20k...Feeling a little beat up after the number they threw at me, so I'm wondering what are your payments like? Basically I've got some negative equity on my car now (don't ask) and they're throwing out numbers around $450 a month...seems harsh to me. The finance manager is calling my current bank in the morning and feels confident he can get the payment around $410. I've been through three different dealers and different cars and have ran into this same problem. What do you think?

I have to agree with a lot of the people trying to give more sound financial advice here.

They are asking $20k and for monthly payments they are saying $450/month?
I'm going to assume 60 months.
Did you do your math in regards to the TOTAL you're paying rather than the monthly amount?

$450/month * 60 months = $27,000

Even if you were to pay the $410/month through your financial manager, you are paying

$410/month * 60 months = $24,600

All this.. for a 2010 Genpu with 29kmiles for $20,000?

I know quite a lot people nowadays who don't even figure out the total price that they are paying for something, and only look at the monthly payments to see if they can afford it, but that is just poor financial planning.

You said that you were almost $3k upside down or whatever, you can add another $4,600 or $7,000 depending on which way you decide to go.

Now I don't know what your financial situation is like, maybe $450/mo is easily affordable to you, but that you're just being frugal about it. Or maybe you are scraping by, surviving paycheque to paycheque. You haven't said much about it, so perhaps people (including me) are being a little presumptious about your entire situation here.

In anycase, I do agree with the people who have been trying to tell you that
- the monthly payments don't matter (I think it's the total amount that you should be paying attention to)
- buy a cheaper, reliable car (cheaper on gas, insurance, and maintenance) for the time being until you are able to save up enough
- be in as little debt as possible if you can help it

Agree with ANITIX87 that it's because of cheap credit and irresponsible savings is partly why Americans have gotten themselves into this economic crisis.. which, by the way, is FAR from over.

[rdjr74]

2012- tech package- 7500 down on 23750- 320 a month. This includes ext. warranty to 100k on powertrain and limited bumper to bumper. Bought it used with 700 miles on it. Great deal in my opinion. I was at 309 before the added bumper to bumper warranty.

[FamiliaGT]

The only reason i hopped on my car was the price. I got my 2013 for the price of a 2012. I did however set it at an 84 month loan. Reason, becuase the price per month is low enough to leave me with plenty to pay off my tool loans I needed for work within 8 months. After that, I will be free and clear of other debts, then I will refi the car at probably 60 months and focus on paying it off as quickly as I can.

I originally wasnt going to buy the car but, my daily driver is not as reliable as I would like it to be, plus I can comfortably afford the new car.

Having a 740 Credit score certainly helps though. At the lowest interest rate possible, Its easily managable.

Think hard about this one though. Do you NEED this car or just want it? The nice thing is it has room and space in back. But there are other cars out there that fit that description for cheaper, just wont have the Zip the Speed does.

[freshe5b]

I bought my 2011 early September. No options, 16k miles, paid $19,800, $170/mo 6 years with 12k trade.

Keep you options open. Know the MS3s in your area like the back of your hand.

NEVER. NEVER. NEVER. NEVER. NEVER TALK MONTHLY PAYMENT! Ask to see a breakdown of every dime they're going to charge you (buyers order). You'd be surprised what sort of shit they'll throw in there. Make sure YOU know what kind of rate you can get, the dealership will make more money getting you shitty financing terms than they will on the sale of the car.

If you go in there with pre-approved financing don't be afraid to walk out the door if they start throwing numbers you don't like. Whatever you do, don't pay KBB. Not a damn car in the world is worth KBB. Only desperate and under-informed people pay KBB.

[PPD369Speed3]

Originally Posted by H I F I I feel rather stuck. My current car is barely mobile, and I need to get in a new car before I go back to work (Sunday). I owe about 6,800 on it and because of some mechanical issues they are offering me 4k for it. The upside down equity and the car (2010 speed3 tech) leaves me in the ball park of $450 a month. The finance manager is calling my current bank in the morning and feels confident he can get the payment around $410. I've been through three different dealers and different cars and have ran into this same problem. What do you think?

I paid 21500 for mine with about 6500 miles on it.

Dude to be honest if you are having trouble financially this isn't the right car for you. Especially as a daily driver. I have to fill it up every week and that costs $50 dollars a week. I pay 360/month so right there thats 560 a month. Than I pay 250 for insurance. That now equals 810/month. My car is pretty much the cost of rent. My insurance is very high right now because of my age but by my next birthday it will cost down to about 150/month.

You don't want to handle your current debt by adding on more debt. I don't want to sound like an asshole but right now it seems like you cannot afford to drive a 20000 car. Especially this car.

A buddy I work with is currently paying for three cars because of bad financial decisions like this. And he is also paying for a mortgage and he doesn't even own the house anymore. Having a nice car isn't worth fucking up your credit and being in debt. Worry about your debt before you worry about a car.

[PokeyHokie]

Originally Posted by freshe5b NEVER. NEVER. NEVER. NEVER. NEVER TALK MONTHLY PAYMENT!

Agreed. They always try to complicate shit and make it seem like they're giving you a deal when it's anything but.

I brought my own financing in the amount of $15,000, and a check for $10,000 and walked out the door in a new 2012 with tech with 8 miles on it. They didn't want to go that low so I told them I'd have no problem leaving and taking the money to another dealer. They gave it to me.

I financed the 15k for 36 months at 1.2%. I'm paying about $420 a month. I like keeping the loans short. Higher monthly payment but costs me less in the long run.

Originally Posted by PPD369Speed3 I paid 21500 for mine with about 6500 miles on it. Than I pay 250 for insurance.

250 a MONTH? Jesus christ. That's $3000/year. My insurance is $65/month. How the hell can a company get away with charging that?

[mroclimbr]

$180 a month. Bought with 20k miles, slightly modded, from a doctor in Virginia. Put 10g down and get to write off the payments because it's a wagon and I can carry enough hand tools once I get my trailer to the job.

[bstover17]

I bought my 2010 MS3 with 26k miles for $18,000 which comes out to 5 years @ $340 a month but I paid $0 down. I would have paid some down but I just bought a house.
Found it in Ohio and was garage kept with no mods. Erie Insurance considers it a high risk vehicle due to its performance so I pay about $120 a month in insurance.

[PUGENE]

I don't remember what I put down, I don't remember what I paid OTD...I have all the paperwork, I don't know exactly what my monthly is, it's between 240 and 245 but I pay a few bucks over every month so it shows like 160 a month at this point.


I think it was $9k down, but I made the mistake of buying an extended warranty because at the time I was worried about my commute and the mileage I would be putting on....but of course, a week after I got the car I found someone to car pool with so the warranty was wasted money....less commuting = more modding = no more expensive extended warranty (unless there's a magic way to get out of it and get some sort of a refund....)

[rdjr74]

Originally Posted by PPD369Speed3 I pay 360/month so right there thats 560 a month. Than I pay 250 for insurance. That now equals 810/month.

Damn dude! I'm at 460 for six months thru State Farm. I'm sure I'm older then you but still.. DAMN!

[El_Diablo]

My insurance on the MS3 is actually cheaper than the Focus, same insurance specs on both.

[bvbull200]

Originally Posted by PPD369Speed3 Than I pay 250 for insurance. That now equals 810/month. My car is pretty much the cost of rent. My insurance is very high right now because of my age but by my next birthday it will cost down to about 150/month.

I skimmed right by this until some of the other folks pointed it out.

$250/month is absolutely insane. I call shenanigans, too, on it being only due to your age. I'm guessing you are about to turn 25? Must be some tickets and insurance claims that are dropping off your record around the same time. You don't pay $250/month for insurance just because you are young and you don't get a $100/month discount for having a birthday, either.

[PPD369Speed3]

Originally Posted by bvbull200 I skimmed right by this until some of the other folks pointed it out. $250/month is absolutely insane. I call shenanigans, too, on it being only due to your age. I'm guessing you are about to turn 25? Must be some tickets and insurance claims that are dropping off your record around the same time. You don't pay $250/month for insurance just because you are young and you don't get a $100/month discount for having a birthday, either.

Reason #1 I live in philadelphia. Car insurance is insanely high here,
Reason #2 I am 20 years old.
Reason #3 I have 1 claim. Someone t-boned me but they still raise my insurance because of it. That doesn't make any sense to me.

I will be getting a discount when i turn 21 and another discount because it will be 3 years since my last claim. So after my next cycle it will be dropping to about 150/month my agent says. The funny thing is I am with 21st century. If I went with Allstate, statefarm, or any of the big insurance companies I will be paying way over $400 a month for full coverage with 500 deductibles.

I have never gotten a ticket and I will never get a ticket.

[El_Diablo]

The only way that the t-bone raised your rates is if you were found partially or completely at fault.

[Mase]

I don't pay shit a month...

[PPD369Speed3]

Originally Posted by El_Diablo The only way that the t-bone raised your rates is if you were found partially or completely at fault.

I wasn't found at fault at all. My insurance didn't pay out anything.. I got $2000 from the other guys insurance company.

[sheldonross]

I get the anti-monthly payment negotiating tact most are taking, but it can be a useful negotiating tool. You just have to know what you're doing.

I had an android with me and had a loan calculator pulled up on it as I negotiated mine. Pop in the numbers and see what the number should be for a decent rate, time frame and price. Then tell them what needs to happen to get you where you need to be.

Everytime they came back to the table I put in the numbers and figured out the interest rate and what the selling price of the car was going to be. First time they came back, I punched it in and they were trying to put over something like 7% on me. I told them no way.

Eventually got them to finance at 2.9% and knock 1200 of the purchase price to get to the payment I had ballparked at the start.

A bit of a pain, but you can negotiate from any angle as long as you can figure out the total cost.

[Cevaes_64]

Ok, this is a topic that anyone will have a different opinion...

IMHO if you struggle to make a payment then you CANT afford it, Simple...just start saving and do a decent down payment, Now i also don't agree with trowing a lot of cash as of down payment because a car will only loose its value, use that money and invest it in something that will give you more income like your own business or something like that, unless you have a lot of money then don`t do it, and if you have a lot of money you probably wont be looking at this topic =).

Do enough of a DP to have equity out of the door, like 6 o 7 grand, that should cover taxes fees and some principal, also ALWAYS send at least 50 bucks more each month. so if something happens you can sell with no issues.

Look at your vehicles as a service, like you pay the electricity and the water, because you are paying a price and get a service in return (reliable transportation).

The only reason I dont own a MS3 YET im still saving for my DP.... but I do have 2 cars payments... 491 and 256

[pacheco_ms3]

got my 2010 non-tech *new* for 20,500 in jan 2011

id say wait until Dec/Jan then you can get a leftover 12, and enjoy the benefits of buying new!

[Leeland111]

Originally Posted by Rmichel2 I had negative equity from my 2012 Mazda3 Skyactiv. Bought the 2012 MS3 brand new with 30 miles. With 3.5% I had to finance around $37,000 for 6 years @ $568 a month. THAT'S harsh. Lol

I'm surprised they financed that much on a car that stickers for $25k or so.

[Mazdalover01]

im paying 156

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

$710 but that's for a 2012 CTS-V coupe.

[snailmail]

Had the dealers dealing... Got down to 21800 for a '12 at 3% with 4000 down. Paying 300.

I did 90% of my haggling over the phone between 3 dealers, also a plus buyin at the end if the year

[ThizSpeed3]

to much but #YOLO

[I<3Groceries]

Originally Posted by Bubba Ho-Tep $710 but that's for a 2012 CTS-V coupe.

Not as bad as I'd have thought!

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[Mizzle]

tl:dr

Do NOT play the payment game. Get the price you want for the car, the down payment you can afford and then work on the interest rate.

I financed $24,500 at 6%. My payment is approx. $410/mo.