Why buy a MS3?

[Polaren]

I believe Killface is still looking for one. I happened to find mine just outside Toronto. Not sure of the OP's location.

[eliwwjd]

Well did you finally buy the ms3 2013?
I also looked around for a while before purchasing mine. Originally I wanted a sti but the price was insane $52K also and a lot of insurance companies don't insure the car neither the evo because of the many accidents with sti and evos. I ended up calling the mazda distributor in Puerto Rico there were 2 coming by ship and guess what I separated a red one 2013 tech package. These cars are not seen to much here in the island. On this shipment there were only 2 coming and both were sold before even touching the dealer. Guess what! one of them was mine(red velocity mica)
It cost me 31,260 compared to 52K sti and 48K Evo, plus I needed a hatchback car so my only 2 options were sti, focus or ms3. Sti to overpriced and insurance didn't cover it, focus st looses value to fast here in P.R. and the other option was the ms3 which was the winner!!! They were able to insurance the car with no problems and a cheap price!
The only difference is AWD my friend. If you race from a roll, with mods you can easily take on one, I mean if its the case that you want to race every subbie you find. I've had my car for a year and I'm so glad I bought it, great value for what you get. What I like is that is kind of like sleeper because people think its a mazda 3 but when I pull on them, they know what the deal is!!!! they are not common in this island! Ive had mazda all my life and they are great cars. Just give them there proper maintenance and they will give you great service. Think about this, you are going to be driving a one of a kind ride that is not common like subies and evo's and that not everybody has. MAN JUST GO AND GET THE MS3 2013 AND DON'T THINK ABOUT IT TWICE! YOU WON'T REGRET IT!

[Jokerface]

Originally Posted by Polaren As for importing you have to pay conversion, taxes (13%) and if it isn't built in North America then the import tax which is I believe 6% or so. So price + conversion + 19%. Doesn't make for cheaper cars all the time.

If those numbers are correct, then it could be substantially cheaper for the OP to drive down and pick up a brand new 2013 MS3 here in the U.S..

For example, mine stickered at just shy of $28k, and is a 2013 tech. My negotiated price after rebates was about $26.5k last summer, and I didn't do particularly well, partially because the dealer was a scumbag and dicked around with the numbers, which I didn't catch until a couple of weeks later. There have been many that have posted they've picked up 2013s with tech in the $23-24k range recently, apparently as they're aggressively moving old stock. Even if you figure a brand new one, with the option package the OP is looking for, at even a price of $25k, adding in the 19% you're suggesting:

$25,000 x 1.19 = $29,750.

That's more than $2k cheaper than what he's being quoted for a non-tech. Tech is a $2k+ option, so it's probably more along the lines of being $4k cheaper, even with the canadian penalties. Providing the penalty estimates are accurate of course...

OP, try this. Go to Mazdausa.com and use their inventory search function. Find something close to the border in your area and see what hits you get. I just checked Michigan and Ohio and found a black one with tech. Might be worthwhile to look.

Sent from Tapatalk 4...this app kinda sucks.

[alaskazero]

I live in alaska, its subaru this and evo that and AWD can beat anything all day...


I bought my MS3 so I can show them how well it handles during winter and how its still faster than them...so far so good...until I blew my motor.

Now that ill be fully built and BIG TURBO, none of them want to race me or even hangout with me anymore

All in all MS3 is better and safer if you have a family, end of story.

[Killface]

"Canada pricing is always fun, MS3 are more rare here as well."

I live in Saskatoon SK. Basically that is what the dealer told me when I said his prices were whack. Said that they are rare and they have most of the mazdaspeeds in western Canada. But there is a reason they aren't selling them, the prices are TOO FUCKING HIGH. When I go for a test drive I will try to drive the price down, and if they don't negotiate I will walk. I figure if I don't cave they will eventually give me a deal just to get one off the lot.

[it's toasted]

Originally Posted by alaskazero I live in alaska, its subaru this and evo that and AWD can beat anything all day... I bought my MS3 so I can show them how well it handles during winter and how its still faster than them...so far so good...until I blew my motor. Now that ill be fully built and BIG TURBO, none of them want to race me or even hangout with me anymore All in all MS3 is better and safer if you have a family, end of story.

how did you blow?

[Killface]

I got a few questions about driving manual(been practicing on my brother's truck) that maybe you can answer for me. Keep in mind my brother's truck is old and slow, so the gears are short.

I have been getting fairly smooth shifting up, but my weaknesses right now are downshifting and starting from a stop. Is there a best way to slow down to a stop or is it just preference? Personally what feels natural to me is to hold the clutch down while lightly breaking and rowing the gears down. Is this bad to do? I have heard of people when coasting to a stop put it in neutral and coast and brake when needed. Is this a good method? What is the right way to do it.

What is the correct way of downshifting? coast-clutch-rev-shiftdown-release clutch slowly? I cannot seem to downshift smoothly and I am fearing I am putting unnecessary wear on my brothers truck. Can someone give me a better breakdown of how I should be doing this. Honestly it feels really pointless to downshift though in residential areas (50km/hr maximum). It just feels natural for me to shift up and then I stay in 4th at 50km/hr, let it coast and when I get closer to the stop I hold the clutch and slightly break as i row down and come to a complete stop. Again is this wrong to do? What should I be doing?

As for starting I think it will just take practice and getting used to where the truck's clutch starts catching.

Thanks. This is all I can think of at the moment.

[Polaren]

Originally Posted by Jokerface If those numbers are correct, then it could be substantially cheaper for the OP to drive down and pick up a brand new 2013 MS3 here in the U.S.. For example, mine stickered at just shy of $28k, and is a 2013 tech. My negotiated price after rebates was about $26.5k last summer, and I didn't do particularly well, partially because the dealer was a scumbag and dicked around with the numbers, which I didn't catch until a couple of weeks later. There have been many that have posted they've picked up 2013s with tech in the $23-24k range recently, apparently as they're aggressively moving old stock. Even if you figure a brand new one, with the option package the OP is looking for, at even a price of $25k, adding in the 19% you're suggesting: $25,000 x 1.19 = $29,750. That's more than $2k cheaper than what he's being quoted for a non-tech. Tech is a $2k+ option, so it's probably more along the lines of being $4k cheaper, even with the canadian penalties. Providing the penalty estimates are accurate of course...

You're very much correct. Although have to factor in current CAN to USD conversion.
29,750.00 USD = 32,409.78 CAD

Pick it up, other fees for getting it license. US cars re-sale for less in Canada if there is a Canadian equivalent. It isn't worth it unless you are saving $5K or more at least IMO.

As for the OP living in Western Canada, SK or AB their prices tend to be higher..for really no reason.

[it's toasted]

Originally Posted by Killface I got a few questions about driving manual(been practicing on my brother's truck) that maybe you can answer for me. Keep in mind my brother's truck is old and slow, so the gears are short. I have been getting fairly smooth shifting up, but my weaknesses right now are downshifting and starting from a stop. Is there a best way to slow down to a stop or is it just preference? Personally what feels natural to me is to hold the clutch down while lightly breaking and rowing the gears down. Is this bad to do? I have heard of people when coasting to a stop put it in neutral and coast and brake when needed. Is this a good method? What is the right way to do it. What is the correct way of downshifting? coast-clutch-rev-shiftdown-release clutch slowly? I cannot seem to downshift smoothly and I am fearing I am putting unnecessary wear on my brothers truck. Can someone give me a better breakdown of how I should be doing this. Honestly it feels really pointless to downshift though in residential areas (50km/hr maximum). It just feels natural for me to shift up and then I stay in 4th at 50km/hr, let it coast and when I get closer to the stop I hold the clutch and slightly break as i row down and come to a complete stop. Again is this wrong to do? What should I be doing? As for starting I think it will just take practice and getting used to where the truck's clutch starts catching. Thanks. This is all I can think of at the moment.

Good to know you're learning, the skill of driving manuals is definitely becoming a lost art (now i sound old and cliche. ) Anyway, to answer your question about downshifting, you ultimately want to learn how to 'rev-match' when down shifting. This means as soon as you press in the clutch to downshift, you want to lightly blip (or aggressively blip depending on how fast you were going and how fast you're slowing down) the throttle to appropriately match engine speed to the next gear ratio. DOWNSHIFTING = clutch in + blip gas + into gear + clutch out = smooth downshift. The less your drivetrain has to compensate by matching RPM's on downshifts, the less wear and tear over all. Eventually you'll get good and we can discuss heal and toe which is essentially the same thing except that you're adding an additional step of hitting the break during more spirited downshifts. It'll become second nature and you won't even think about it, that's when manual transmission cars come into their own. Check youtube out for some video tutorials, I believe there are some good ones. Safe practicing!

[usgiorgi]

^^^ I taught myself how to revmatch and heel toe in my WRX. It definitely takes some getting used to, but the feeling of getting it down is awesome. Plus having smooth downshifts is great.

Watch Ayrton Senna's NSX video on youtube. He's heel toeing in loafers....

[it's toasted]

Originally Posted by usgiorgi ^^^ I taught myself how to revmatch and heel toe in my WRX. It definitely takes some getting used to, but the feeling of getting it down is awesome. Plus having smooth downshifts is great. Watch Ayrton Senna's NSX video on youtube. He's heel toeing in loafers....

your avatar and "loafers" comment made me think of this... http://www.tubechop.com/watch/2510703

[crankshaft]

Originally Posted by Killface I got a few questions about driving manual(been practicing on my brother's truck) that maybe you can answer for me. Keep in mind my brother's truck is old and slow, so the gears are short. I have been getting fairly smooth shifting up, but my weaknesses right now are downshifting and starting from a stop. Is there a best way to slow down to a stop or is it just preference? Personally what feels natural to me is to hold the clutch down while lightly breaking and rowing the gears down. Is this bad to do? I have heard of people when coasting to a stop put it in neutral and coast and brake when needed. Is this a good method? What is the right way to do it. What is the correct way of downshifting? coast-clutch-rev-shiftdown-release clutch slowly? I cannot seem to downshift smoothly and I am fearing I am putting unnecessary wear on my brothers truck. Can someone give me a better breakdown of how I should be doing this. Honestly it feels really pointless to downshift though in residential areas (50km/hr maximum). It just feels natural for me to shift up and then I stay in 4th at 50km/hr, let it coast and when I get closer to the stop I hold the clutch and slightly break as i row down and come to a complete stop. Again is this wrong to do? What should I be doing? As for starting I think it will just take practice and getting used to where the truck's clutch starts catching. Thanks. This is all I can think of at the moment.

I don't agree. For normal daily driving:
When slowing to a stop keep the car in whatever gear you were cruising in while braking/coasting, until the rev approach idle speed. In the MS3, I press the clutch just above 1k RPM. This is best for mileage and wear. For slowing to a turn, I essentially do the same thing, then shift to the right gear to accel, release, and go thru turn rolling in the throttle. I never downshift to use the engine as a means to slow the car. Brake pads cost less than engines/transmissions/clutches.

[Killface]

Originally Posted by crankshaft I don't agree. For normal daily driving: When slowing to a stop keep the car in whatever gear you were cruising in while braking/coasting, until the rev approach idle speed. In the MS3, I press the clutch just above 1k RPM. This is best for mileage and wear. For slowing to a turn, I essentially do the same thing, then shift to the right gear to accel, release, and go thru turn rolling in the throttle. I never downshift to use the engine as a means to slow the car. Brake pads cost less than engines/transmissions/clutches.

So if you are coming up to a red light you just coast in say fourth(the gear you were already in), and then brake when needed, come to a stop and switch gears to first? And I suppose if you were doing this and the lights turned green you would stop coasting/braking and then shift into an appropriate gear to get going again? Seems like an easier method then downshifting to slow and then eventually brake.

[crankshaft]

Originally Posted by Killface So if you are coming up to a red light you just coast in say fourth(the gear you were already in), and then brake when needed, come to a stop and switch gears to first? And I suppose if you were doing this and the lights turned green you would stop coasting/braking and then shift into an appropriate gear to get going again? Seems like an easier method then downshifting to slow and then eventually brake.

Correct.

I ruined the engine in my first car because I didn't know that my aggressive downshifting was bad. Never downshift in order to have the engine slow the car....you downshift when you are preparing to accelerate.

[Killface]

Originally Posted by crankshaft Correct. I ruined the engine in my first car because I didn't know that my aggressive downshifting was bad. Never downshift in order to have the engine slow the car....you downshift when you are preparing to accelerate.

Hmm. That is what feels more natural/easy to me, but my brother said it was a good habit to downshift to slow the car because it helps in winter, which I suppose it would especially if you have bad tires for winter.

[steevieg]

yea i never really understood the need to downshift in terms of slowing down/braking. like crankshaft said, break pads are way cheaper than a clutch, for example. no need to get all fancy.

unless for some reason unknown to me, it's bad to put the car in neutral and brake?

[Dizzy Turbo]

Please explain how engine braking is harmful

Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk

[crankshaft]

Originally Posted by steevieg unless for some reason unknown to me, it's bad to put the car in neutral and brake?

I've read somewhere that it's not good to coast in neutral, but I'm not buying it. If there was an argument, the reason wasn't worth remembering.

Coasting/braking while still in gear lets the carputer cut fuel and the energy from rolling will keep the engine and accessories spinning. It's a benefit for fuel economy, but that's probably negligible.

[speedaholic]

Clutch braking is bad...

Rev-matched engine braking is ok (but not absolutely necessary).

[Killface]

Originally Posted by speedaholic Clutch breaking is bad... Rev-matched engine breaking is ok (but not absolutely necessary).

So then what do you do to slow down and stop?

[speedaholic]

Depends at what RPM but for normal driving (merging off freeways, slowing to intersections), I rev-match/downshift then engine brake + foot brake.

When coasting and getting off freeways, I sometimes don't even have to foot brake... I just downshift from 6, 5, 4 to 3 and carve the exit. When stopping at intersections, I pedal brake more than with the engine though.

[Killface]

Originally Posted by speedaholic Depends at what RPM but for normal driving (merging off freeways, slowing to intersections), I rev-match/downshift then engine brake + foot brake. When coasting and getting off freeways, I sometimes don't even have to foot brake... I just downshift from 6, 5, 4 to 3 and carve the exit. When stopping at intersections, I pedal brake more than with the engine though.

Well I am mainly talking about residential city driving. like stop signs and red lights. So do you do like the other guy mentioned, and stay in what gear you are in- coast and then- brake to a stop, then shift to first and go?

[speedaholic]

Look mano, it all comes down to your driving style at that moment. If your cruising along at low speed, engine braking isn't really necessary. Just pop out of gear and coast with foot on brake. However, if your in a hurry and scooting along and need to stop quickly at a light turning red or to shred a corner, you can use engine braking to help the foot instead of slamming the pedal.

You just need to learn to rev-match so you don't put that strain on the clutch.


Simple, no?

[jakk]

The MS3 is my first stick car which I have been driving for not quite 2 years now. I went through what the OP is right now. The first few days were a learning experience . I spent a crap ton of time on the standard shift forums and reading up on how to drive manual and understanding at a basic level how the clutch works and what it is actually doing. I believe that understanding the mechanics behind the clutch helps avoid a lot of damage as you will understand what slipping/riding the clutch is and how it causes damage.

Anyways, from what I read, coasting in neutral is not bad at all from a mechanical standpoint, but it is considered poor form if you are coming up to a red light at say 40 mph and drop it into neutral. This is because you no longer have acceleration or (as much) braking control and as such cannot react quickly if a car pulls out in front of you,etc. I wouldn't worry too much about that initially when you are first learning, though. Just get the basics down so you are not stalling all the time and can make do in traffic.

After almost two years of driving, I still am not anywhere near perfectly smooth. I do rev match+downshift (or at least try to lol), but I don't get too aggressive with it. It feels awesome when you do it perfectly. Most of the time when I am coming to a stop, I will brake/slow down in gear until around 1k, then I will shift into the next lowest gear (at such a low rpm you really don't have to rev match much at all), and then repeat that cycle until I am in 2nd at like 5 mph (you can feel the car start to hesitate), then I will clutch in and stop.

Just be patient, after driving a few other manual cars I have realized that our cutch is quite grabby and on average I find my speed to be the hardest car to drive smoothly out of everything I have driven. Above all have fun, it's a fun skill to learn and always gives you something to improve on during your daily commute. You will develop your own style eventually, everyone does.

[Killface]

Originally Posted by speedaholic Look mano, it all comes down to your driving style at that moment. If your cruising along at low speed, engine braking isn't really necessary. Just pop out of gear and coast with foot on brake. However, if your in a hurry and scooting along and need to stop quickly at a light turning red or to shred a corner, you can use engine braking to help the foot instead of slamming the pedal. You just need to learn to rev-match so you don't put that strain on the clutch. Simple, no?

I don't deny that rev matching is something that I need to work on and learn.

I am strictly speaking about residential driving. Does it really put that much strain/wear to coast to a red light/stop sign in gear, and clutch brake at the very end to come to a complete stop? I am not braking more than I would in an automatic, maybe even less. And what's the verdict on putting it in neutral and braking to stop? Some say its good others bad.

[speedaholic]

Originally Posted by Killface I don't deny that rev matching is something that I need to work on and learn. I am strictly speaking about residential driving. Does it really put that much strain/wear to coast to a red light/stop sign in gear, and clutch brake at the very end to come to a complete stop? I am not braking more than I would in an automatic, maybe even less. And what's the verdict on putting it in neutral and braking to stop? Some say its good others bad.

If you ride the clutch to brake... you're going to have a bad time. [insert South Park meme here]

As for coasting neutral, i dunno... I guess I don't do it often enough to think about it but except for extra wear on the brake pads, I don't see any negative mechanical impact.

Maybe some msf gearheads can extrapolate on the subject?

[grazamataz]

Why buy? Because my girlfriend laughs at me every time I have a clear lane on the highway entrance ramp because it makes me giggle like an idiot. Plus all the tech and overall bang for the buck. And what everyone else said. One of a kind.

sent from my phone because it's 2014

[Killface]

Originally Posted by speedaholic If you ride the clutch to brake... you're going to have a bad time. [insert South Park meme here] As for coasting neutral, i dunno... I guess I don't do it often enough to think about it but except for extra wear on the brake pads, I don't see any negative mechanical impact. Maybe some msf gearheads can extrapolate on the subject?

I'm an idiot. I was under the impression that you cannot brake without the clutch when in gear or it will stall. So besides coasting in neutral to stop, what is proper form to slow down and stop at a stop sign or red light? You can't stay in say 4th and coast and just use the brakes can you? Should you use the brake to slow but also engage the clutch to shift down when needed? What is the correct order to do to go from 50km/hr to a stop when you know well in advance you need to stop?

[Schrocko]

Bro, once you get the car it will all make sense after a few days. The first couple days are going to suck, that's a given, especially hills.. But you will get it and never regret it. Manual is so much better than auto. This is my first stick shift car, genwon. Once you have bought the car or utilize a friends manual car you will get it. You can read and watch all the videos possible, but you will have your own style. Don't worry about rev matching for a while. Get the basics first. Getting it into first was hard enough at first.. Don't stress yourself out with rev matching/heel toe/etc. Once you get it into first smoothly and the master the smooth gear change of first to second you will be golden.

[Killface]

Originally Posted by Schrocko Bro, once you get the car it will all make sense after a few days. The first couple days are going to suck, that's a given, especially hills.. But you will get it and never regret it. Manual is so much better than auto. This is my first stick shift car, genwon. Once you have bought the car or utilize a friends manual car you will get it. You can read and watch all the videos possible, but you will have your own style. Don't worry about rev matching for a while. Get the basics first. Getting it into first was hard enough at first.. Don't stress yourself out with rev matching/heel toe/etc. Once you get it into first smoothly and the master the smooth gear change of first to second you will be golden.

Yeah. I borrowed my brothers manual truck to practice on. I can get around town fine and rarely stall, just had some questions. More or less double to check if I am doing things correctly, and not putting additional wear on his truck. Which it seems I might be putting a little extra strain on the clutch when stopping, as I have been staying in gear- coasting- then clutch braking to come to a complete stop.

So instead can you be in 4th going 50km/hr and coast - when you get to about 35 or something shift down(without rev'ing at all) continue coasting and continue to downshift to slow down the vehicle - and then at the end brake to come to a complete stop, clutching in before you stop moving completely?

[Littlescroll]

If I'm in 4th at 50mph and approaching a red light here's what I do. I let off the gas while staying in gear and let the engine slow me down (adding brake as necessary) until I get near 1k rpm (go much below that and you'll stall). Then I go clutch in and to neutral and I use the brake to finish stopping.

I don't row through all the gears and downshift every time because I believe it's unnecessary and I've been told it will increase wear on the drive train. When I do downshift I always Rev match, but I typically only do that if I'm slowing for a turn at speed or if I really want to hear my exhaust.

I do not hold in the clutch at stop lights. I've been told this causes excessive wear on the throw out bearing. It surprises me how many people do hold in the clutch while stopped for long periods.

[2zooms]

^^This

This is exactly what I do as well.

[Killface]

Originally Posted by Littlescroll If I'm in 4th at 50mph and approaching a red light here's what I do. I let off the gas while staying in gear and let the engine slow me down (adding brake as necessary) until I get near 1k rpm (go much below that and you'll stall). Then I go clutch in and to neutral and I use the brake to finish stopping. I don't row through all the gears and downshift every time because I believe it's unnecessary and I've been told it will increase wear on the drive train. When I do downshift I always Rev match, but I typically only do that if I'm slowing for a turn at speed or if I really want to hear my exhaust. I do not hold in the clutch at stop lights. I've been told this causes excessive wear on the throw out bearing. It surprises me how many people do hold in the clutch while stopped for long periods.

Alright I will give this a try.

[grazamataz]

yep +1 for what littlescroll said. i only rev-match and downshift if coming up on a turn or if i'm slowing down but i know i'll be accelerating again without stopping (e.g. approaching a light that just turned green). otherwise i'll slow down while in whatever gear i'm in until my revs hit 1k-ish, then pop it in neutral, release the clutch and use just the brakes to stop. and i don't hold the clutch in at a light or if i'm stopped for more than a couple seconds. and when i'm waiting at lights i always watch the other lights so i know exactly when mine will be turning green, so i can get into gear just before it turns but without sitting there holding the clutch in.

[Dat8687]

Originally Posted by crankshaft Correct. I ruined the engine in my first car because I didn't know that my aggressive downshifting was bad. Never downshift in order to have the engine slow the car....you downshift when you are preparing to accelerate.

Wow.. Yea don't feel bad I have seen worse.. My sister burned through a brand new clutch on her car because she always rested her foot on the clutch pedal. That slight pressure against it wore it out quick.

The only time I downshift is when I have to due to engine speed falling below the normal parameter for the gear its in..

[crankshaft]

Originally Posted by Littlescroll If I'm in 4th at 50mph and approaching a red light here's what I do. I let off the gas while staying in gear and let the engine slow me down (adding brake as necessary) until I get near 1k rpm (go much below that and you'll stall). Then I go clutch in and to neutral and I use the brake to finish stopping. I don't row through all the gears and downshift every time because I believe it's unnecessary and I've been told it will increase wear on the drive train. When I do downshift I always Rev match, but I typically only do that if I'm slowing for a turn at speed or if I really want to hear my exhaust. I do not hold in the clutch at stop lights. I've been told this causes excessive wear on the throw out bearing. It surprises me how many people do hold in the clutch while stopped for long periods.

This.

Except that cruising at 50, I'm in 6th gear.

[Littlescroll]

Originally Posted by crankshaft This. Except that cruising at 50, I'm in 6th gear.

I would also normally be in a higher gear at that speed unless I had been accelerating recently.

[StevenW]

Too lazy to read all 3 pages, so here's my opinion.

Ms3: You can fit all your crap in the trunk, and fold the seats down. Hell I packed enough camping supplies for 4 people AND those 4 people in my car with one seat down. And moved all my crap from one house to another in the back of my car with both seats down.

Lots of potential and aftermarket. Research is there. The way boost comes on is a very visceral experience like someone else had mentioned before. Yes it's FWD, but the ST get's rave reviews that it can kick out the rear, etc. etc. and hides the fact that is FWD really well. Get a RMM and RSB on the ms3 and you'll be outperforming the ST and won't really know it's FWD until you try to floor it mid corner.

I actually drove the ST and ms3 within 30 mins of each other. I was researching and debating for weeks and when I finally drove the cars I knew what I wanted. If you want a commuter that you will not mod I'd say go for the ST. If you want something more "raw" I guess and fun, the MS3 is where it's at.

As for the WRX, IMO they're waaaaay to common. Especially in Southern California, and I wanted something different. Also the price for a WRX was a few thousand above what the MS3 is IIRC. I had some buyers remorse after getting the MS3 for a while, since everyone was giving me shit about not getting the WRX since it has AWD, but 7 or so months in I can confidently say fuck em. I've pulled on my friend's Evo and out cornered a WRX trying to run away on the same freeway I was getting onto...May have been the drivers, or a ton of other things but results are results.


Edit: Also the ford manager was trying to sell me the car at sticker and would not give an initial price point, he just kept asking "Well what, do you want to pay for it?" We went back and forth and he kept asking me the same fucking question. He then went on to tell me how sticker price is actually a really good deal, because the ST's are a speciality car like the Raptor and they usually sell them for 3k over sticker. Eventually I told this homo my price (24k + tax and fees) for a ST2. I had looked around on the forums and saw similar prices on the "what did you get your ST for" thread. He looked at me like I had just asked to fuck his wife, and again tried to sell me on some bullshit about how sticker is a great price and that I should give him a handy for the amazing deal he was cutting me. I walked out, went to the mazda dealership, test drove it, loved it. Mazda went from 28k to 24k in 30 minutes with some floor mats and that blue foot well lighting thing. Ford called me back a few weeks later asking if I was still interested in the car while I was waxing my new MS3. Fuck you Sunrise Ford of Fontana, Ca...you can go suck on a bag of old limp dicks.

/rant

[middlemarkal]

JUST PURCHASED A white msp3 2010 WITH TECH PACKAGE 67000KM IN QUEBEC FOR 17000$ (with winter tire on rims)
for new value and 4 year 80000km garanty is 24$ a month.



I'm happy and will get it tomorow

you should shop further or go to the us, to import you'll pay the taxes (federal and provincial) and a 6% custom and about 300$ for the paperwork at the border and that includes the verification at Canadian tire. I did it a few years ago easy. Look on the internet how to inport cars in Canada.

[Jzen16]

I couldn't get an STi and EVO's weren't sold around me. I had the choice of a WRX, but it didn't have anything on it where as the 2013 tech ms3 had lots of nice things..
although some may never use it..the room i use it for has seriously come in handy..I've taken wheels and tables on the daily.
all in all my friends sometimes ask me why no evo/sti, I go meh. I like this. plusss, none of them drive a pu and I don't even know any locals with a pu
so I'm kinda unique in a sense?? it feels nice having a different car and they don't know the potential of it either...
I have a lot more to say, but this is the gist of it!