e85/petrol K04 comparison.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05...b4f716eb1b.jpg
Petrol:
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05...b7d1ae5676.jpg
E85:
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05...951f115d27.jpg


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And my ghost valves
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05...526a7fb95b.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/05...0388927f55.jpg


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That petrol one had 92,000 miles on it I bet. Owner was a power happy moderator

Your air mover has a bit more life in other, but not much. It has a bit more daft play then mine at 50,000 miles. I can definitely tell that it came from a Petrol Head. Probably a good thing you took it out.


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So just an update, decided to pull the spill valve (no problems, just curious) to see what it looks like. Now this is after ~4k miles on e, ~2k miles on 50/50, ~500 miles on 93, ~500 miles on 50/50, and ~100 miles so far on e (currently running full corn).

http://i60.tinypic.com/2888osi.jpg
http://i57.tinypic.com/m8kaxg.jpg

A very light "dusting" on the spill valve, that wiped right off as soon as I touched it, and that was it. Everything looks excellent.

I checked mine last weekend during my oil change, and it pretty much looked identical to yours @g00s3y;

That's ~3000miles on full E85 and RP 5w30.

I should be nominated for the nobel peace prize or something.


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@littleloogy; I'm searching for whom to write a letter to...

I should pick up some RP oil and try this, but we're still fuel limited. The lack of injectors sucks. I can't justify losing 60hp just to run full E, even though I really want to.

Just a thought but do you think possibly the fact that the E has cleaned out all of your fuel tank and lines etc that by now there is no more crap for it to clean out and get clogged in the pump? Like if you run E long enough or straight from the factory would it bypass all the worry of having the pump and stuff cleaned?

The issue has never been with the fuel lines. Read more.

Lol, NOOB...


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I have read the thread. I know the issue has to do with oil mixing with the E. Do you honestly assume the E is not cleaning out your 5-10 year old fuel tank and lines as well?

I am not trying to discredit the research done here as it is a huge advance on our platform. Simple suggestions do not need to be shot down if they are at least somewhat relevant. You guys would not have made it this far without suggestions and experiments from the memebers of the forum.

If it does, it will clog the in tank filter first.

I have been on corn for a long time, a long time. I have always had death in my pump, Always! I think after 30,000 miles of corn use would eventually clean out my tank then right @speedfreak44;?

Please tell me who else was experimenting with fuel pump modifications and injecting chemicals into their engine risking their inter workings trying to prevent death? I would really would like to meet the members you speak of.


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Relax @littleloogy;

You were not the only person here to run 100%. Other members have also done research and threw ideas around. My post was not an attack on you. You were not the only person to experience black death. I do not get why you took offense to anything I have said? I believe the wealth of knowledge on this forum is womderful or I would not have donated to further encourage people such as yourself.

Should probably work on your phrasing.

Yeah, guy. This is what I mean.

Also there have been guys that had new cars, switched to full e before 5000 miles and had Black Death. How much crap was in the lines that fast?

Inline fuel filter was done and it caught nothing over a few thousand miles. I cut two of them open and they were clean, so I scrapped that idea a long time ago. It's in my thread.

Well, not sure what the fuck happened, but my fuel pump pressure goes to shit during WOT, and afr's go to shit after ~4200rpm now. Just took a 3rd gear log for the fuck of it, and got really worried when I loaded it up on my pc...

Just removed the spill valve, nothing weird there. Don't have the tools currently to remove the whole pump. Cruising and light accel show everything working fine. Car doesn't act weird at all.

Really at a loss for this right now, I'll pull the pump and inspect tomorrow probably, unless someone here has an answer, because I definitely don't right now.

Let grandpa phate tell you some stories of the olden days...This is the result of the inline fuel filter testing:

http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...tml#post940346

If you read a few pages in either direction, there's lots of discussion about the black death before we had any idea what was causing it. A few pages after that post is where I had the mass spec done on the black death where we determined it was deposit from the oil.

E85 Remedy with HPFP Hardware modifications
 

SWAS?

Never mind, I looked closer. It's not.

Take it out again and see if it still does it. That log is weird. Always Monitor fuel pressure during LOGs

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@phate;
Thanks for the refresher I remember reading that thread not too long ago. I guess when you spend hours trying to catch up on all the stuff on this site it sometimes just mushes together.

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I too first thought maybe it was SWAS, but I would have 8-9 AFR's instead.

FP is one of the 6 always on the AP (boost, AFR, KR, FP, LTFT, BAT). I honestly haven't paid attention to it while actually logging because everything has been fine recently.

It happened last night too when I took a 4th gear log, but it only went to 12.35, and fuel pressure was fine, so I didn't really worry about it. I almost feel like me opening the spill valve let out the secret stuff that kept it running fine lol.

E85 Remedy with HPFP Hardware modifications
 

Yeah, take the spill valve apart and put it back together. That log does not look like death. Check your key on engine off pressure after a hot run, hope your RV did not take a poop. I lost mine at 45,000 miles.


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Did that, everything is good now. Pressure slowly drops while engine off/key on after the drive I just took. Pressure during the 4th gear log looks good, afr's are good. Really not sure what it was...

Also worst pump I've ever seen was seized as fuck and came off a pump gas only CX7. Shit was so full of death it took me over an hour to get it apart.

You may have a bad injector or rv if pressure doesn't rise after a run with key on engine off.

Engine has to be hot too, or it will fall anyways.

No easy way to check the injectors other than to pull them right? If i'm going to do that, I may as well just get CS seals and replace those too.

So some of those cells in my log are in the 1500's at WOT, obviously the fuel system has to work harder on e85, but shouldn't be dropping to those levels still, correct? Maybe I should pull the pump and inspect the internals, possibly some gunk?

With the RV, should I just go ahead and get a 1950psi RV?(anywhere other than hpfpupgrade?) I'm ~61,000 miles right now, and know it's only a matter of time before it starts to go (as it may already be). Read about the 2050/2150 RV hitting fuel cut a bunch, 1950 seems to be the sweet spot.

I get a slight "whistling" sound when accelerating, I always thought it was the Autotech's as I read they are "loud", but could that be the RV? Did some searching and see that some people heard a sound like that, but the internals were fine. Also get chatter at the HPFP when accelerating, but thought that was just because of 5w30, as when I ran rotella when I first got the car (5w40), that wasn't present.

Regardless, looks like i'm going to have to pull some shit and see what is going on.

I had taken maybe a 5-6 minute drive. Car sat for about a half hour before that, and before sitting I was out on a 30-45 minute drive. May not have been warm enough (said no one in FL ever).

Yeah the gas (or corn) has to be hot enough to build the pressure up. Even the 1950psi RV have been hit or miss IIRC. I had a 2050 and that shit NEVER worked.

IMO get a stock unit and adjust your targeted FP's to stay in the 1700's with as few blips over 1850 (crack point) as possible. There's not really a benefit to say 1900+ psi over 16-1700psi anyways.

I like my OEM RV and I target OEM pressure. I don't hear any squeaks.


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It's more about the head/injectors being hot enough for the fuel in the rail to soak up some heat and expand. If it's dropping heat faster than it's taking it on (like when you remove the stock sound damper shit), it will drop pressure.

^What he said

Stock sound damper shit?
I'm listening

Fapped over pics of Laguna Seca

Pu need not apply.

Ok, I was going to say, when I replaced my manifold, I never remember seeing any insulation.

Took it for a 45 minute drive, nothing crazy, just a normal cruise. Turned it off, key on, pressure shows ~600psi, then drops about 50psi every ~45 seconds maybe. So looks like the RV is on it's way out. Still holding pressure decently though.

Also, side note, was about 3/4 full, filled up, 4.1 gal, 72.3 miles = 17.6MPG. Not bad considering fuel trims haven't "settled", and it's only a 2nd revision.

Was it idling at 400? If so, and it rose to 600 before starting to drop off, your PRV is probably just fine.

I've been reading a lot about full E85 recently and I apologize if I missed this anywhere.

Has anyone been running full E with fifth port injection? I'm considering getting a fifth port set up and running full E on my big turbo to make about 400hp rather than relying on mixes.

Yeah, idle is fine, have it idling at 500psi for e85 if I remember correctly. Turned if off, then key on, went to ~594 I think, then dropped 3psi every 3-4 seconds I would say.

When hot It should go all the way to at least 1800 before you should see pressure dropping. When pressure stops climbing and decreases that would be the opening of the RV. If it's opening at 594... That not good.




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Not if it drops at the same rate it climbed at. Pretty sure mine does the same thing when it's cool out, and I have a stock HPRV.

My gut feeling is that everything is working ok. Might not be at peak efficiency, but still working. I feel if it wasn't good, I would have other problems popping up also. Any other way to really check the valve? I don't care if I have to pull it to do so, saw the how-to, doesn't seem hard at all.

Pulling the valve is a huge pain in the ass. You'll know if the valve is failing by how fast the pressure drops and if you can hold pressure up top.

Blip the throttle and shut down the moment you do; KOEO and see what pressure does.

His logs show pressure dipping in the 1500's under WOT.


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Now, I look at the logs, in the upper RPM's it seems the pressure is "decent", it's between 3k-5k I feel that it struggles and where the most low 1600/high 1500 cells are. I also thought that it was just because of running full e, and everything working "harder", was a reason for seeing some lower pressure cells.

Completely forgot to check the pressure again this morning, when I leave work I'll do it.

FWIW I had to bump a few cells up by 100psi or so when I made the jump from 50/50 to full. Might just be a volume thing but you've gone from full to 93 to 50/50 etc before so idk..

Ok, so, first time. This was after a couple WOT pulls. Tapped throttle, turned off, key on, car started back up.....

Did the same, turned it off again, key on. Showed 893 psi and slowly rose 3-5 psi every 5 seconds for the next minute that I watched it.

Cruised the rest of the way home, pulled in, tapped throttle, car off, key on. Showed 1203 psi, and slowly dropped 3-5 psi every 2-3 seconds for the next minute that I watched it, seemed to slow down slightly the longer I sat there.

I bumped it up to 1800psi max, instead of the 1750 on e85 before. Honestly don't remember if it made a difference or not. I see I kept it at 1750 in my current tune. I may try 1800 if I find out everything is fine, and it's not something else possibly causing this problem.

If the PRV was opening, it would be an immediate and RAPID drop in pressure. I think you're fine in that department. Sounds like either the spill valve or internals might have a bit of sticky on them or the internals might be scored (like mine were when I had a similar issue).

I'd start with squirting some redline in through the spill valve cavity and see if that helps; don't forget to remove any excess fuel too.

I actually did that when I opened the spill valve the first time. I believe it's the internals with some sticky on them, still from the rotella left over (only done 2 oil changes since going full corn). When I first start in the morning it starts how it did after the first change to corn, another reason I think it's some sticky icky icky. So going to be pulling the pump sometime this week and giving the whole thing another thorough cleaning with si-1.

And if the internals are messed up, I may just pull the trigger on those IE internals and then hopefully not have to worry about the pump/internals anymore.

E85 Remedy with HPFP Hardware modifications
 

And my pulse with drops with the increased IDC. (Sorry I moved this over to here so we don't cloud someone else's Review with this play talk. )


In your opinion do you think that retarding the intake advance back to 0 yields less of a fueling window? Like the injection point changes as you increase or decrease advancement? Also, any harm in running VVT advance to redline for testing? I am half temped to advance my intake to 10 degrees to redline and see if that help fueling.


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It's been an issue for quite a while. Holding vvt just above 0 prevents it. Something to do with behind the scenes things we don't have access to that happened a couple of atr released ago.

I would have to say that is very weird. Thanks for chiming in master @phate; I guess I'll shoot for 3 degree of advance on my next revision and see where that takes me.


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Well, that makes sense why close to 5k I sometimes get a jump from ~75 IDC to ~95 IDC out of nowhere. I may have to try this also, extra fueling headroom is never a bad thing.

So, i'm going to try and run this, only changed what is red, was at 0 before. I'm thinking it should be safe, can't imagine this blowing anything up. But if it does, I guess I have a damn good reason to build my motor finally.

In my current logs, on my latest revision, I'm just barely going above 100 IDC. Not getting any stumbling, which is good. Last VD log had me at 310/345. Getting back up there on full e, very happy. Not to mention, the price of 93 is now at least $1.10 higher than e85 ($1.99) around here now. I'm done rambling with this statement full of randomness now. Time to go clean my HPFP.

So, pulled my pump. More oil in the housing than I think there should be. Other than that, everything was fine, just the same light dusting that was on the spill valve, were on parts of the internals. Cleaned everything up with SI-1. But this amount of oil, eh...

so no solid fix for this yet?? still seems people are getting the sticky and black death

Do you even read?

Yup and atleast to Wat I read it still seems he couldn't solve the problem. Only thing I've read (not on this thread) were a diff type of internals with a nitride coating Tht stops the build-up. Company out of salt lake city... They are made for 2.0t pumps... Also has a certain type of gasket to keep the oil from reaching the spill valve and internals.

Fuck off.


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Stop reading the other threads and read this one in it's entirety to understand what's actually going on.

This thread includes the best solution for running FULL E85, not a mix. However, you can run high concentrates of a mix and experience the problem if not using the method laid out here.

At this time there is no hardware fix for us. But the additive in the spill valve is the next best thing.

Guess you can't read very well. SI-1, has worked for everyone who has done it so far, provided they lubed up the pump assembly correctly. I've had over 7,000 miles combined now on full corn, and no black/sticky death problems, or of any type that is related to e85 use.

It seems you were able to read well enough to tell us what we already knew about the IE HPFP internals, you can thank @littleloogy; for testing those for us.

Fixed for you.

In all seriousness, you make me want to stab myself in the eye. Repeatdly... Again... And again... Forever

Wow... Sry didn't read all the way through... Just saw the mods on the pump Tht were being tryed to no real avail. I saw the part about sl-1 just didn't put 2 and 2 together...

Yeah, I guess the sticky at the top of the sub-forum saying:

Full E85 Redline S-1 Cure steps/results.

is a bit hard to understand.

I'm reading this on my phone on tapatalk couldn't see Tht. I just saw this thread didn't see the sticky with the s-1 cure sorry..

Full E85 for 10k+ miles straight, including 1000 mile round trip work-cation to VA beach.

Because S-1.

If @littleloogy; gets to a point where these internals are a 100% confirm, then we'll have 2 options really. Those that have yet to purchase internals can go with these and those that already have AT's or the like can go S1 l00b.

Nice!!! Keep it goin

My personal confidence in the Redline fix is near 100%. It's honestly not even an afterthought for me anymore.

Shit just works.

All brought to you by a guy named loogy and his band of merry men ink goos and fat... We still eagerly await the report on the van shaft follower wear pattern and any other observations.

Fapped over pics of Laguna Seca

You say Redline but do you mean Redline + Royal Purple Dexos = solution ? Or did I miss something about the oil no longer being a factor?

I believe it's only with Royal Purple, unless someone is running a different oil that I don't know about. I did try to run regular Royal Purple synthetic on accident, (grabbed the wrong bottle) and I started getting death in my pump pretty quickly.


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Considering the UOAs I get, I'll probably only run RP oil from here on out (at least in the Mazda).

How did the IDC look with a bit of VVT advance up top?

I was hitting around 105 IDC around 5500, I have 3* at 5/5.5/6k (past 5700rpm, logs are actually showing 0), and am now just hovering around 100-101 at max.

So not to bring up an old thread but have you ever been able to determine what caused this to happen on your sleeve and piston? I am just curios if this has something to do more with the type of fuel and or oil being used or something is getting to hot, etc...? Just seems like no solid answer is there but I would like to hear the opinions of others.

The deaths are entirely oil related, and have little to do with the fuel being used (worst pump I've ever seen was running pumpgas, stock internals and completely seized).

FYI. Almost 2 month full E and no problems with the modded fuel level sender. Still reads with perfect accuracy.




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I hate my car...
I swear, everything is seized. Went up to 170 ft lbs on my breaker bar (I use a torque wrench) then decided to use a impact gun. Turned that fucker all the way up and then, "snap!" Lucky I had my trusty extractor kit. Now I'm off to the hardware store to get a bolt. https://vimeo.com/135190385

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08...9d0818897d.jpg


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And now I need a new mount... Did Mazda use a thread insert for the TMM center bolt? The threads in the hole are coming out like a spring. No wonder the bolt didn't want to come out. Mother fucker.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08...105320533d.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08...0b4b04fdc1.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08...451c905088.jpghttp://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08...f5758ada31.jpg


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Fuck, I literally threw that piece out this morning in the dumpster. Figured I don't need it, and I doubt anyone else ever will. I would have just sent it to you for nothing.

Actually, now that I think about it. I threw it away in a box that I put on the side of the dumpster, because it was full. I'll go over and check real quick to see if it's still there.

Here you go, no cost, just PM me your address...

Fuck is right, Oh well.... I shoved the spring things back in, and slowly worked the hole. I was able to get it the new bolt to hold down about 90 ft lbs. unfortunately I feel as though this thing is a ticking time bomb, I do not feel comfortable driving it.


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Can you take a picture of the threads? Does it look like a three insert or is mine stripped to hell?


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Best picture i could get.

It does look like a thread insert to me. See where the cast meets the threads? Correct me if I'm wrong but that appears to be a gap? Either way, thanks for digging in the trash for me, I owe you one.


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It does seem like that. Thankfully I only had to go as far as to my doorstep. Forgot I was lazy and only took the empty cardboard this morning, and not the trash.

That's what overtightening would look like. Must be the same monkey that installs the o2 sensor.

That shit does look like helicoil stuff. That's ridiculous

There is no helicoil in that mount. That's a stripped thread and the tripod needs replacing before your motor drops.

Correct me if I've been taught wrong, but I've always been taught and followed to not use a torque wrench to loosen bolts. Breaker bar to loosen them, torque wrench to tighten them.

Everyone has a different way of doing it. Hell, I've never even used a torque wrench on any of my cars, never had a problem with anything.

I had a feeling this was the case which is why I have not taken my car off of the stands yet. All though I was able to buy a new bolt and get it threaded, I just did not feel comfortable running the car that way. The bolt just did not feel solid when trying to torque it.

Waiting for @g00s3y;'s package... Damn UPS is sloooow. Is that the mount your talking about right Brock?


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Tripod being the portion of the mount that bolts to the trans. The part that stripped.

E85 Remedy with HPFP Hardware modifications
 

I was taught this by my dad, but I never listen to anyone. Especially since I bought this big ass snap on torque wrench years ago and I never used it, just sat in my tool box. I now use it primarily so I can set the max torque when loosing stubborn nuts/bolts. It works well and you know how tight something was. IIRC This bolt was holding well passed 170ft/lbs. I would rather use a tool that I paid for then to let the investment sit in a box.


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Depending on the style of torque wrench, there is no problem using one to loosen bolts
I use my snap-on digital to measure breakaway torque.
You could salvage that tripod, and make it stronger with a helicoil kit though...

But what do I know?
I'm just here to be a toxic troll and push people away from the community.
I have nothing to offer at all.

I feel as though you are 1 of a select number of the smartest people I have had the privilege of interacting with. I don't know what is toxic about being brutally honest. I have yet to come across a post where you are intentionally trying to rid someone or create toxicity on MSF.

I hope you don't go anywhere. If my Direct injector project works out ,I am going to need your brain and resources to pull off one of the biggest advancements on this platform.


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The reasoning is that a torque wrench can lose its accuracy the more it is used so you would only use it when necessary ie tightening. Also given the relative prices of torque wrenches and breaker bars its more economical to beat on the cheaper breaker bar for stuck fasteners.

That all being said I only have a breaker bar so what do I know?

I'm hoping that package will be there today or tomorrow?