E85 Remedy with HPFP Hardware modifications

[Enki]

Originally Posted by Code Monkey What is this, never heard that word before.

That is what food eats.

Anywho, back on topic.

[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by Enki That is what food eats. Anywho, back on topic.

Yes, back on topic...

Originally Posted by justinjenkins Ok so now that you have had these internals in for a while would you say they are a pretty good chance at a go for 100% e85? @littleloogy; Ok so now that you have had these internals in for a while would you say they are a pretty good chance at a go for 100% e85? @littleloogy;

Why did you say that twice?
Did you read the thread?
I have been on 100% for a few weeks now.
Please change your avatar picture, before you post again. You have ruined my mood.

Okay, now you can get back off topic... This particular hybrid will mature anywhere from 112-114 days. Comes in conventional, roundup ready, as well as double pro or triple pro which are all Monsanto traits. And it's in the trash...







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[Sandman978]

I could have eaten that... Just saying...

Fapped over pics of Laguna Seca

[Yatta]

Originally Posted by ItsNox Replace rabbits with guinea pigs. They have more fat and are more delicious. Nom nom /serious thread derailment

cui and chicha (yes I have had both) and they are delicious, shame about them being pets here.

[Sandman978]

I'll try anything once.

Fapped over pics of Laguna Seca

[littleloogy]

Being on E85 sure does create a lot of fluid that collects into my catch can. When I was on petrol, my CC would be dry as a grandma. But now that I made the switch back to E85 I noticed that clear smells like ass fluid is back, and it great numbers. Can was overfilled in just a few weeks.
Makes me ponder about the amount of blowby I am getting with E. I love Washing all that oil off my cylinder walls... Will leaning out my mixture help? I am about to find out...
I was at 11.4 target so now I will just target 12.0. Besides, there is more power to be made with a leaner mixture I am going to keep boost levels around 17 psi to help save my clutch.

My 430 lbs of torque are over... for now.


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[phate]

Originally Posted by littleloogy Makes me ponder about the amount of blowby I am getting with E. I love Washing all that oil off my cylinder walls... Will leaning out my mixture help? I am about to find out... I was at 11.4 target so now I will just target 12.0. Besides, there is more power to be made with a leaner mixture I am going to keep boost levels around 17 psi to help save my clutch. My 430 lbs of torque are over... for now. Sent from my iPhone 6

From the archives.



Leaner mixtures have been tried by me and others on the dyno. They don't offer more power if you are within injector limits on the K04, even after optimizing timing for each mixture.

PS - 5 years ago! Time flies.

[littleloogy]

I remember reading that in your thread. But for argument sake throw the numbers out the window. From tuning RC cars to dirt bikes to Briggs and Stratton 5 hp engines on methanol. Air fuel ratio has always affected performance.
How lean did you go on the Dyno @phate; I remember leaning out to 12.5 trying to keep IDC under 120 i swear I was shitting and getting. But I have no Dyno to prove this.
I should buy a Dyno for my garage. I need one.


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[phate]

Originally Posted by littleloogy I remember reading that in your thread. But for argument sake throw the numbers out the window. From tuning RC cars to dirt bikes to Briggs and Stratton 5 hp engines on methanol. Air fuel ratio has always affected performance. How lean did you go on the Dyno phate I remember leaning out to 12.5 trying to keep IDC under 120 i swear I was shitting and getting. But I have no Dyno to prove this. I should buy a Dyno for my garage. I need one. Sent from my iPhone 6

.83l to .86l. Like I said back then, I didn't believe it until I did it.

E85 Discussion - HPFP lubrication and Flow issues

[justinjenkins]

I don't know why I said it twice. But I have read the thread and I was seeing what your final opinion is on running 100% e85 with the IE HPFP. And I Will change my avatar lol it was that when I made the account. I just need to find something to make the avatar now lol. @littleloogy;

[littleloogy]

I would not recommend at this point. We do not know long term affects on the possible increase wear on our cam follower from all the seals.

The code has already been cracked: follow this guide... If done right, It has been tested and proven. It will set you free.

Full E85 Redline SI-1 Cure steps/results.

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[Dano]

Originally Posted by phate ... Leaner mixtures have been tried by me and others on the dyno. They don't offer more power if you are within injector limits on the K04, even after optimizing timing for each mixture. PS - 5 years ago! Time flies.

Word

Dustin, remember that guy, had many a car on a dyno, two separate tuning events IIRC, and proved there are no measurable gains going leaner than 11.8-12.0. So if you can't see it on a dyno graph you will never notice it in your butt...so why put the engine in danger of overheating.

@loogy

now wall wash is another consideration I suppose but I don't see going from 11.8 to 12 or 12.2 making much difference in what you see in your OCC and what get into the oil.

if you're running 11.4 then hell yes lean that chit out to 11.8-12.0. In your case you might see some power gains but I don't think a dataset as rich as that was tested on the rollers. i.e. going from 11.4 to 12.0 and power gains measured.

Originally Posted by littleloogy I would not recommend at this point. We do not know long term affects on the possible increase wear on our cam follower from all the seals. The code has already been cracked: follow this guide... If done right, It has been tested and proven. It will set you free. Full E85 Redline S-1 Cure steps/results. - Mazdaspeed Forums Sent from my iPhone 6

So there's "results" thread...thanks

[littleloogy]

Yeah, he takes better notes then me. It should be stickied, but I dot get to make decisions like that. I leave that up to the mods...


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[MSP6]

Originally Posted by littleloogy The code has already been cracked: follow this guide... If done right, It has been tested and proven. It will set you free. Full E85 Redline S-1 Cure steps/results. - Mazdaspeed Forums Sent from my iPhone 6

My thread has been mentioned, I feel all grown up now

Also, I just caught the local E85 shift at my pump. Went from 12.0 to 12.7+ at WOT and never noticed until I checked a log. Verified no leaks etc. There's power to be had, IMO, from say 11.4 to 12.0 but after that Idk. I certainly couldn't feel it seat of pants for what little that's worth.

[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by Dano if you're running 11.4 then hell yes lean that chit out to 11.8-12.0. In your case you might see some power gains but I don't think a dataset as rich as that was tested on the rollers. i.e. going from 11.4 to 12.0 and power gains measured.

Okay, that makes more sense. I remember when I first started on E I was targeting 11.4 as you say. I then leaned to 11.6 and it felt faster, then to 11.8, and it felt even faster still. So I would imagine that's where I got in my head wrapped around the fact that leaning E on this platform does yield more power.

There still might be power to be made with a/f ratio changes in combination with higher BAT. I talked with @Enki; in the past about this and now he has his hands full Frankensteining his shit to prove/disprove these theories. If anyone can figure that out it will be him. I intend on joining the fun after I get my car fixed up.


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[littleloogy]

It's interesting how much difference VVT and AFR's can influence my VD numbers, car is flowing great 270g/s @ only 15lbs of boost, 12.1 AFR and pretty conservative on my timing.
E85 15psi VVT.jpg

900 miles on E85 with these internals, no issues. time to play...

Today's Project since it's Saturday Afternoon and I am not drunk yet.

Do BAT's Affect VD numbers?
I need to adjust my tune so BAT's wont affect timing. Then I will increase air restriction by covering my Stock IC with some Aluminum foil and securing it with the IC cover. I will do a base 4th gear Pull, then Do a Pull with 25%, 50%, and possibly 75% coverage depending on how far I am willing to push it. I will be posting VD results to see if there are any Noticable Increases/ Decreases

[Enki]

I can already tell you that BATs affect airflow greatly. Hot air in = hotter air out = falls on its face.

Also, I'm now making between 3 and 4 psi less at about the same airflow numbers.

Edit:
You pretty much always want the coldest air possible going into the cylinder.

[littleloogy]

The results came to no surprise to me. I used this method last winter to keep my BAT's higher because my ASS felt faster when I did. Even doing these tests I could feel my car pick up top end. Every run was done on the exact same spot (right after a big red barn), starting at the same speed (more/less) and within about 20 minutes of each other during the hottest part of the day. So, don't give me any shit about how The results are tainted in some way. had a farmer ask why I was putting aluminum foil in my car. After I explained, he scratched his head and told me to be careful racing down his street.

Anyway,
Looking at the graph you can see how as BAT went up with the increase IC coverage. The 30% coverage seemed the same as the Base test. It was not until 60% and 80% coverage that I felt some gains.

Why I wanted to Test:
Back to my Flathead briggs days, Running close to the same fuel. I would head out on the track for practice at 6:00 in the morning with ambient air temps at 60 degrees. My kart would run like shit. Bogging in the corners, and not having any top end power. Despite my efforts to adjust my Carb, I could not get it to run right. Towards the afternoon when temps would be closer to 100 degrees my kart would run like a bat out of hell. I actually had to richen the A/F mixture to keep my head cool.

This is also why I believe AFR and BAT combo's will affect efficiency and power. On a dyno with BAT's being the same temp you will not see gains with only a/f adjustments. Getting the Right Combination is going to take some Time and Lots of testing.

Digest...

BAT Test 1.jpg

[littleloogy]

Oh yeah... Pics



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[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by Enki I can already tell you that BATs affect airflow greatly. Hot air in = hotter air out = falls on its face. Also, I'm now making between 3 and 4 psi less at about the same airflow numbers. Edit: You pretty much always want the coldest air possible going into the cylinder.

You are correct when it come to air flow. That last pull I did was 80% coverage and showed less air moving but seemed to have more go. The Log shows about a 150 BAT


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[Enki]

Yeah it seemed to me that anything over 130 was losing oomph on my turbo (when WGDC was already 100%).

Edit: It will be really interesting seeing what 2 GPH of 100% meth does for me pre turbo.

[littleloogy]

Interesting!? I'll say. You are nuts! At the least, It should keep your turbo clean.

I have been thinking about my setup. I think I will use the intercooler and a bypass. I will have valves on the pipes that open and close to keep BAT at my desired level. Similar to your shower trying to get the right temperature. Plumbing and the electronic aspect will be a challenge.


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[Enki]

Shouldn't be that hard, really. A single temp sensor somewhere near the intake and an Arduino controlling whatever you use for bypass should do the trick.

At some point I need to finish up my PWM WMI controller and get that bitch plugged in.

[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by Enki Shouldn't be that hard, really. A single temp sensor somewhere near the intake and an Arduino controlling whatever you use for bypass should do the trick. At some point I need to finish up my PWM WMI controller and get that bitch plugged in.

You and Arduino. I really need to sit down and start playing with my kit again. I have never been a fan of writing code. It's a whole new language, and a whole new world for me. I might just make a open loop design if I am too lazy to figure out how to program it.


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[Enki]

I can help with the coding.

[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by Enki I can help with the coding.

I love it when you talk dirty like that.

Question: has anyone opened up the orifice on the hard fuel line in an attempt to decrease restriction? When I pulled my hardline, I noticed the pin hole of an opening that dumps in the fuel rail, ever think about opening this up?


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[Enki]

Yeah it's been done. IIRC, gains were marginal if even existent. I think it was determined that the orifice wasn't a flow restriction.

[littleloogy]

Hacking up my shit today. @Dano; style.


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[Enki]

Get on my level.

MazdaSpeed Forums Presents: YouTube

MazdaSpeed Forums Presents: YouTube

[littleloogy]

Ugh, well that is one way to do it. I was thinking something a little more... Subtle. Beside, I don't have any air chisels handy


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[littleloogy]

This is why I can't ever have anything nice! got to fuck shit up, because lazy...


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[TiGraySpeed6]

Man, if a little ding in your roof sent your OCD on a rant I can't wait to see how you clean that up so you're not freaked out about it even if you can't see it!

OTOH, easy access FTW!

[littleloogy]

The nibbler got away from me. I swear that thin had a mind of its own. I got done and said... "What the fuck did I just do!?"


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E85's toll on the GEN 2 fuel sender




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[littleloogy]

For those of you who do not know how a fuel gauge works:
There is a voltage (usually 5volts that shoots down the red wire heading This nice circuitry of lines and represents a different value of resistance. the higher the resistance, the lower the voltage. So the voltage going back to the computer will read lower then the voltage going in. Thus giving you a level of fuel on your gauge.

As far as the resistor pad and points go, they are functioning properly. I am getting different ohm reads though the range. That's great news for us!

Two problems with the GEN 2 fuel sender:

First is the engineers thought it to be a great idea to use brass or bronze connectors instead of gold plated. This in theory is a good idea with petrol, but when you start adding oxygenated fuel you will get oxidation and corrosion which causes the plates to loos connection. Similar to a corroded battery connector.

Second problem that I see is the factory went cheap and did not want to take the time to solder the connections. They are relying on put clamping force. Which is never s good idea.

I'll post again when it's fixed. I need to clean by bench...





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[g00s3y]

Originally Posted by littleloogy Ugh, well that is one way to do it. I was thinking something a little more... Subtle. Beside, I don't have any air chisels handy Sent from my iPhone 6

Just a few cuts would do

[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by g00s3y Just a few cuts would do

I bet I'll finish first!


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[littleloogy]

All better :



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[Sandman978]

I believe @g00s3y; finished a few weeks ago lol. I'll take that bet

Fapped over pics of Laguna Seca

[littleloogy]

Originally Posted by Sandman978 I believe @g00s3y; finished a few weeks ago lol. I'll take that bet Fapped over pics of Laguna Seca

His is fucked up again... I win


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[littleloogy]

Done and done



Can't even tell...


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