GI: Guardian Angel (Overboost Protection)

[ScottyP]

1. starscream
2. mtlms3
3. mrmonk7663
4. Gringo East
5. Sid3wayS
6. speed_freak91
7. ryno077
8. fooqr
9. obijack
10. Sleeperhatch
11. EL F00LI0
12.mroclimbr
13. MS3kid08
14. p057
15. Ckmazdaspeed3
16. blendedej8
17. JTMS3
18. Angr-E1
19. QwkEVO
20. skeurton
21. Dizzydtrain
22. ScottyP

I am all about this. this is legit

[Lex]

Derek wrote a great review with videos and logs: http://www.mazdaspeedforums.org/foru...3/#post1302377

[QwkEVO]

I see Lex lurking.....better get to work and make up another batch! lol

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Lex Install is very simple and I will post it here shortly. Basically, you need power and ground (add a fuse in the stock fuse panel and use the ground on fender where the battery grounds). You also remove the BPV vacuum line, plug this line into the Guardian, and then plug the second port from the Guardian into the BPV. The LED you can route into the the cabin without any modifications through the hood release cable passthrough. So there are no modifications that are not reversible and it should take no more than 1 hour to install.

Any worries about potential over spinning the turbo with the BOV open while the turbo is still trying to target XX boost?

This also got me thinking about being on PCM controlled boost. If there is a leak and the system cannot see it, will the adaptive in the PCM continue to adjust to reach that target?

[Erich]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE Any worries about potential over spinning the turbo with the BOV open while the turbo is still trying to target XX boost?

Warning is already stated that it is not to be used as a boost controller.

[Lex]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE Any worries about potential over spinning the turbo with the BOV open while the turbo is still trying to target XX boost? This also got me thinking about being on PCM controlled boost. If there is a leak and the system cannot see it, will the adaptive in the PCM continue to adjust to reach that target?

This depends on how it is setup. If you are in load tuning mode and recirculating then it will still target load based on what the MAF sees regardless of whether the BPV is open or closed.

The ECU will always try and reach targets. This device is meant to save the motor from a catastrophic condition, not to be ridden on every day as a means to control boost.

The other thing to note is that once you're building less boost, you're generating less exhaust, and are naturally not going to spin the turbine as fast.

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Erich Warning is already stated that it is not to be used as a boost controller.

Thanks, so this would simply be for boost cut if over boost happened?

I only ask because I made something very similar to this for the SRT4 market and it killed several turbo's in a very short period of time, product never made it to market because of this.

[Tomas]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE Any worries about potential over spinning the turbo with the BOV open while the turbo is still trying to target XX boost? This also got me thinking about being on PCM controlled boost. If there is a leak and the system cannot see it, will the adaptive in the PCM continue to adjust to reach that target?

If you see the logs you'll notice the charge air pipes are still pressurized even when the BPV opens. IM pressure remains at about 7-10 psi. I.e. there is still back pressure holding the compressor from overspining.

The engagement feels really gentle.

[Lex]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE Thanks, so this would simply be for boost cut if over boost happened? I only ask because I made something very similar to this for the SRT4 market and it killed several turbo's in a very short period of time, product never made it to market because of this.

Sorry to hear that John, I've had my little K04 under this condition many times and I haven't seen a single issue.

It would also mean that every time someone blew a coupler off a charge pipe the turbo would be sacked.

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Lex This depends on how it is setup. If you are in load tuning mode and recirculating then it will still target load based on what the MAF sees regardless of whether the BPV is open or closed. The ECU will always try and reach targets. This device is meant to save the motor from a catastrophic condition, not to be ridden on every day as a means to control boost.

In boost tuning mode this could become a problem?

I am only commenting on this because you stated, "- It is a much gentler cut than the fuel cut. The car will feel like it lost power, but you will still be able to keep your foot in it if you choose. This is NOT a fuel cut or ignition cut."

Keeping your foot into the throttle with the BOV open could be catastrophic to the turbo, RPM's could potentially kill the turbo.

Other than that, its a great idea!

[Lex]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE In boost tuning mode this could become a problem? I am only commenting on this because you stated, "- It is a much gentler cut than the fuel cut. The car will feel like it lost power, but you will still be able to keep your foot in it if you choose. This is NOT a fuel cut or ignition cut." Keeping your foot into the throttle with the BOV open could be catastrophic to the turbo, RPM's could potentially kill the turbo. Other than that, its a great idea!

Could potentially kill a turbo and actually kill a turbo are very different things. If you're in the middle passing someone and you have oncoming traffic I think I would rather have the option to keep my foot in it instead of hitting a fuel cut.

[Erich]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE In boost tuning mode this could become a problem? I am only commenting on this because you stated, "- It is a much gentler cut than the fuel cut. The car will feel like it lost power, but you will still be able to keep your foot in it if you choose. This is NOT a fuel cut or ignition cut." Keeping your foot into the throttle with the BOV open could be catastrophic to the turbo, RPM's could potentially kill the turbo. Other than that, its a great idea!

If the driver is dumb enough (or actually REALLY needs) to keep their foot in it, better the turbo then the engine.

[Lex]

Again, it is meant to be a failsafe that is ECU and wastegate independent. It's another layer of safety for the vehicle while tuning and modifying.

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Lex Sorry to hear that John, I've had my little K04 under this condition many times and I haven't seen a single issue. It would also mean that every time someone blew a coupler off a charge pipe the turbo would be sacked.

The K04 might be stronger than it looks then.

Not really because when you blow off a coupler or charge pipe the turbo its a spike in RPM then you lift off the throttle (for obvious reasons). If the BOV is being held open then the turbo is allowed to increase RPM over time, thus the WGDC tables will continue to climb putting additional RPM in the turbo until a different cap is hit inside the PCM (boost tuning only I assume).

Have you verified turbo RPM with the BOV open?

[Lex]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE The K04 might be stronger than it looks then. Not really because when you blow off a coupler or charge pipe the turbo its a spike in RPM then you lift off the throttle (for obvious reasons). If the BOV is being held open then the turbo is allowed to increase RPM over time, thus the WGDC tables will continue to climb putting additional RPM in the turbo until a different cap is hit inside the PCM (boost tuning only I assume). Have you verified turbo RPM with the BOV open?

When you see the RED led turn ON, unless you have a good reason not to, you should also probably lift off the throttle and analyze why you overboosted and triggered the device.

You will not hit a "cap" inside the ECU because even with the WG closed and the device triggered, your boost won't continue climbing. So you can stop assuming. You should know this already from having designed a similar device, right?

[Tomas]

Originally Posted by HPFPUPGRADE The K04 might be stronger than it looks then. Not really because when you blow off a coupler or charge pipe the turbo its a spike in RPM then you lift off the throttle (for obvious reasons). If the BOV is being held open then the turbo is allowed to increase RPM over time, thus the WGDC tables will continue to climb putting additional RPM in the turbo until a different cap is hit inside the PCM (boost tuning only I assume). Have you verified turbo RPM with the BOV open?

That's not how it works.
Once you lose charge air pressure there is also less air flow / pressure on the turbine. It's almost instantaneous. The air resistance against the compressor, even when boosting into empty space, overcomes the inertia of the rotor.

[HPFPUPGRADE]

Originally Posted by Lex When you see the RED led turn ON, unless you have a good reason not to, you should also probably lift off the throttle and analyze why you overboosted and triggered the device. You will not hit a "cap" inside the ECU because even with the WG closed and the device triggered, your boost won't continue climbing. So you can stop assuming. You should know this already from having designed a similar device, right?

It looks like a great device, I was just wondering about turbo RPM and if there were any concerns.

Very good idea and a great price!

Originally Posted by Tomas That's not how it works. Once you lose charge air pressure there is also less air flow / pressure on the turbine. It's almost instantaneous. The air resistance against the compressor, even when boosting into empty space, overcomes the inertia of the rotor.

[djuosnteisn]

Jesus john.... can't you just let someone else have a good idea for once?

[Dano]

Received my GA late last week and hope to tinker with it sometime this week and will post up a thread when completed.

BTW...John, its ok for someone else to develop products for our market.

[Sid3wayS]

So @Lex not rushing or anything just curious do you have a ruff estimate of when you will have these up for sale?

[Lex]

Originally Posted by Sid3wayS So @Lex not rushing or anything just curious do you have a ruff estimate of when you will have these up for sale?

Estimates are hard right now just because I am still working 2 jobs. That will change in a week and things will be moving much faster.

[Lex]

I want to see more reviews! Everyone should have gotten theirs by now from the first batch.

[Dano]

Lol. Now the impatience is coming from the other side.

I have mine mounted and the wiring almost done but still need to plumb it and tidy up

Maybe tonight.


Tappin

[bigriver]

Lol! I need to pick up an Add a fuse and find a wire coat hanger. Mine will be on soon.

[event]

I'll definitely buy one when I turbo my miata.

[speed_freak91]

Update? Still interested in picking one of these up when the next batch arrives.

[86AmishMs3]

Hahaha at John.

Hardly seeing this as being bad for the turbo....and chances are it should never be used. Just a failsafe against fail.

Anyways put me down for the 3rd batch... alittle low on skrilla.

[Lex]

Wondering if you guys installed the unit and how it went ... reviews, impressions ...

@rfinkle2
@Dano
@the_rolex_guy
@bigriver
@starscream

[bigriver]

I finally have all the things I need for the install. The vacuum tube I plan to use has 7/32" ID. This fits really snug on the bpv out nipple on the GA as well as the inlet on the oem bpv.

[rfinkle2]

Lex, my apologies.

I have every intention of installing this weekend.

[Dano]

Day job is relentless with my time. I have it installed and just need to get time to collect data and put a thread together.


Tappin

[802MS3]

i can haz?

[Lex]

Originally Posted by 802MS3 i can haz?

You can haz! I iz buzy placing orderz and getting theze madez!

[Dano]

Apparently it's monsoon season down here so no logging yet.


Tappin

[rfinkle2]

Originally Posted by Dano Apparently it's monsoon season down here so no logging yet. Tappin

That was a better excuse than I had for Lex.

[Dano]

Lol

I've been making excuses since before you were born.


Tappin

[p057]

i couldn't make excuses.
Florida's seeing decent weather lately, i don't care about my job, and i've got a legitimate need for one and will install same day I get it.
Will drive my car until either the unit breaks or i get arrested.

[Lex]

Sorry for the delays folks but getting something truly production ready takes time to do right but fear not - the 30 enclosures are in, PCB is being sent out for manufacturing today, electronic parts are bought and the harness supplier will be on board next week.

The details matter since this has been designed and built from the ground up including the electronics, software, enclosure, harness, and plumbing so validation is important - *cough* this is why I want these things to be running out there as much as possible so any issues come out of the woodwork.

Anyways, here's a little shot of what's under the skin:

[Sid3wayS]

@Lex I was woundering does the GA need a dedicated vac line? What I mean is Im planning on installing a boost gauge and the bpv line is the one that I have always seen beeing tapped, if I add a tee there and have one side go to my gauge and the other to the GA will it affect how it works?

[bigriver]

Just finished install and took a quick drive. Set the dial at lowest setting. In third gear stepped on it an boost psi went to 11 psi then dropped to 8 psi and held. I need to use my AP though as i think the SG psi is wrong. LED also lit up. Cutoff was nice and smooth. I just had my scangauge so no logs. If I wasnt watching the SG, i wouldnt have felt the drop in boost. It was that smooth. I'm off to Vegas but will make some logs tomorrow.

Here are some pics. My LED is ghetto rigged on my dash for now, haha.







Just glad I'm not the last to install, lol

@Lex
@rfinkle2